[Godstud]

@Crantag Some of the female fighters probably have more testosterone in them than a male transitioning to female.

PEDs are endemic in sports.

[Crantag]

@Crantag Some of the female fighters probably have more testosterone in them than a male transitioning to female.

PEDs are endemic in sports.

No doubt there.

But, it almost seems like this "men can use drugs and become women" is like, the other side of the coin of like, "hey, these men use drugs to compete with other men."

Like, "using drugs, that will make you spiderman!"

And then, the other end of the exaggerated take on it, "men can use drugs, and become women!"

I will never accept, or be okay with, or consider scientific, this notion of men going on a drug cycle, and now they are ready to compete with women.

It is misogyny parading as anti-misogyny, by these woketards.

When a male track runner, who is pretty good, but can't quite make the grade; decides to 'transition' to women, and compete with genuine women, he is stealing a place from a girl her deserves to be there, not like him.

And, men are 'transitioning' to woman now, for reasons of competing in the 'junior leagues'. Which, was always an inevitable result.

[AFAIK]

Able bodied athletes should be allowed to compete in the paralympics, so long as they are suffering from BIID.

[Crantag]

Able bodied athletes should be allowed to compete in the paralympics, so long as they are suffering from BIID.

I think a new division is needed in the paraolympics, eunuchs. You gotta get your balls chopped to compete though.

[wat0n]

Sorry for the mild necropost, but I thought this is related to the thread:

Transgender swimmer Lia Thomas says she belongs on the women's team, is eyeing 2024 Olympics
Cydney Henderson
USA TODAY


University of Pennsylvania swimmer Lia Thomas says she "belongs on the women’s team" after more than a dozen teammates said she shouldn't be allowed to compete.

"The very simple answer is that I'm not a man. I'm a woman, so I belong on the women's team," Thomas, a 22-year-old transgender woman, told Sports Illustrated in an interview published Thursday. "Trans people deserve that same respect every other athlete gets."

Thomas, a senior student-athlete, competed on the men’s team for three seasons. After completing two years of hormone replacement therapy, Thomas competed on the women’s swim team in the 2021-22 season in dominant fashion. At the Ivy League championships last month, Thomas won the 100-meter freestyle (47.63), 200 freestyle (1:43.12) and 500 freestyle (4:37.32).

Thomas said she's not focused on her success – "I get into the water every day and do my best" – but critics said she has an unfair advantage over cisgender athletes. Thomas said she doesn't "look into the negativity and the hate," but she has unwillingly become the face of the national debate on transgender athletes' inclusion in sports.

In February, 16 of Thomas' teammates anonymously sent a letter to the school and the Ivy League stating that Thomas should not be allowed to compete because she could break "Penn, Ivy, and NCAA Women’s Swimming records; feats she could never have done as a male athlete."

“We fully support Lia Thomas in her decision to affirm her gender identity and to transition from a man to a woman. Lia has every right to live her life authentically,” read the letter, which was obtained by the Washington Post. "However, we also recognize that when it comes to sports competition, that the biology of sex is a separate issue from someone’s gender identity. Biologically, Lia holds an unfair advantage over competition in the women’s category, as evidenced by her rankings that have bounced from #462 as a male to #1 as a female."

But, Thomas said there's no middle ground.

“I’m a woman, just like anybody else on the team,” Thomas says. “I’ve always viewed myself as just a swimmer. It’s what I’ve done for so long; it’s what I love.”

In February, the NCAA cleared Thomas to compete at the 2022 women's championships in Atlanta from March 16-18 after ruling that a new policy for transgender athletes won't go into effect until the 2023-24 season. Thomas was in compliance with the previously approved NCAA testosterone threshold of 10 nanomoles per liter.

"I just want to show trans kids and younger trans athletes that they're not alone," Thomas told Sports Illustrated. "They don't have to choose between who they are and the sport they love."

And Thomas said she has no plans to slow down. She has her eyes set on the 2024 Olympic trials.

"I don't know exactly what the future of my swimming will look like after this year, but I would love to continue doing it," Thomas told Sports Illustrated. "I want to swim and compete as who I am."

She continued: "I've been reinvigorated. I've been swimming for 17 years, but for (only) a short part of that time have I felt fully engaged. After coming out and being my authentic self, I could really start to see a future. Before I came out, I couldn't visualize a future."

Contributing: Scooby Axon, USA TODAY; The Associated Press

Her case became even more noticeable after this:

Amid protests, Penn swimmer Lia Thomas becomes first known transgender athlete to win Division I national championship

ATLANTA -- Lia Thomas is a national champion.

Thomas, who is a transgender woman, touched the wall in 4 minutes, 33.24 seconds in the 500-yard freestyle on Thursday night to become the first known transgender athlete to win a Division I national championship in any sport.

Thomas finished 1.75 seconds ahead of second-place Emma Weyant, who attends Virginia. Thomas' time was a season best and a little more than 9 seconds off of Katie Ledecky's 4:24.06 record.

The race began with the crowd cheering for each of the swimmers, but fans were noticeably quiet for Thomas' introduction. Save Women's Sports founder Beth Stelzer draped a vinyl banner with the organization's phrase over the railing.

During the race, Thomas was alternately tested by Olympians Brooke Forde (Stanford), Erica Sullivan (Texas) and Weyant. Thomas led early, but was passed by Sullivan and trailed for most of the first half of the race. Thomas and Weyant went stroke-for-stroke in the back half of the race, but Thomas pulled away over the final 150 yards to win her first national championship.

"It means the world to be here," Thomas said in an interview with Elizabeth Beisel after the race.

Thomas, who declined to attend the NCAA-required postrace news conference, told Beisel she has been trying to tune out the distractions. "I try to ignore it as much as I can," Thomas said. "I try to focus on my swimming, what I need to do to get ready for my races. And just try to block out everything else."

As she stood on the podium with her trophy, she flashed a peace sign, just as she did for her four Ivy League championships. And once again, the crowd was noticeably quiet as she was announced as the champion.

Thomas returns to the pool Friday morning for the 200-yard freestyle prelims. She also is scheduled to compete in the 100 on Saturday.

"It's a symbol of Lia's resilience," Schuyler Bailar, who at Harvard became the first known transgender man to compete on a Division I men's team, told ESPN. "The fact that she's able to show up here, despite protesters outside, people shouting and booing her, I think it's a testament to her resiliency. And it's also a symbol that we can both be who we are and do what we love."

"Any hate is unnecessary," Virginia junior Lexi Cuomo said after the Cavaliers won the 200 freestyle relay. "We need to look at it as we're all competitors right now. We're focused on ourselves and our team. Our first and foremost goal is to win a national title."

After posting the nation's top times in the 200 and 500 freestyle events in December at the Zippy Invitational in Akron, Ohio, Thomas garnered national attention. Her success in the pool drew both praise and criticism. Some of that criticism was on full display in Atlanta.

Outside of the McAuley Center, dueling protests dominated the morning. More than 20 protesters from Save Women's Sports and Young Women for America (the college branch of Concerned Women for America) chanted outside, protesting Thomas' inclusion in the women's category.

The group also included Idaho state Rep. Barbara Ehardt, the author of HB 500. HB 500 was the first law restricting transgender athletes' ability to play sports in accordance with their gender identity. It has since been blocked in federal court.

"We're not going to stand by and let women be displaced," said Annabelle Rutledge, the national director for Young Women for America. "We must fight for their rights."

Concerned Women for America announced Thursday that the organization filed a Title IX complaint against the University of Pennsylvania. CWA contends that Penn is violating Title IX by allowing Thomas to compete on the women's team.

"The future of women's sports is at risk and the equal rights of female athletes are being infringed," CWA president and CEO Penny Nance said in a statement. "We filed a formal civil rights complaint against UPenn in response to this injustice."

This is not the first Title IX complaint CWA has filed in response to a prominent transgender athlete. After Franklin Pierce University (FPU) track athlete CeCe Telfer won a Division II national championship in the 400m hurdles in 2019, CWA filed a Title IX complaint with the Office for Civil Rights (OCR) at the Department of Education. The OCR found that FPU's transgender inclusion policy violated Title IX and the school was forced to rescind its policy. The Department of Education has not yet responded to CWA's latest complaint.

On the other side of the street from Save Women's Sports and CWA were a dozen counterprotesters, who were Georgia Tech graduate and undergraduate students.

"They are bringing off-campus hate onto our campus," Georgia Tech Grad Pride president Naiki Kaffezakis told ESPN.

Another counterprotester, who wished to be acknowledged by only her first name, had words of support for Thomas.

"I'm rooting for her. I'm very happy for her," Em said. "Good luck out there, girl. Get 'em."

So Lia Thomas went on and beat some Olympians. And it seems some people are not too happy, this is what happened in the podium:

Yet Erica Sullivan stands by her in an op-ed here.

Any thoughts?

[Rancid]

I think biological women are getting screwed hard.

[Unthinking Majority]

I think biological women are getting screwed hard.

Not by me, I can confirm without a doubt!

[Unthinking Majority]

Create a new category for trans women and regulate the level of hormones like they do all other Olympians. Simple solution. Maybe have a separate category for trans women on hormones vs not on hormones.

Trans women are not on an equal playing field to cis women. People's feelings do not change these biological facts.

[Drlee]

"The very simple answer is that I'm not a man. I'm a woman, so I belong on the women's team," Thomas, a 22-year-old transgender woman, told Sports Illustrated in an interview published Thursday. "Trans people deserve that same respect every other athlete gets."

What a load of shit. I am getting really tired of this. It is one of the reasons I have been getting more and more inclined to vote republican again.

This male says he is not a man. No argument there. HE says he is a woman. No he is not. He may identify as a woman and wish to adopt the trappings of female gender norms but he is not a women. He is a MALE who wants to live his life as a woman. He says that "Trans people deserve that same respect every other athlete gets." Respect? Garbage. Nobody deserves respect. It is something to be earned.

The issue is not that he is trans. That is fine. The issue is whether it is fair for him to be allowed to compete against people who were not allowed to use testosterone and other male hormones to enhance their performance. He was/is awash in them.

This is not even close. Fuck him. Let him compete with the men and let women have a fair shot at competing. Tell you what. We will let him wear a sports bra by way of accommodation.

[jimjam]

Some folks seem to have sex ID issues. I'm sorry but i don't give a shit.

Folks will work all their lives and save up a nest egg which will be filched in no time at life's end by so called "nursing homes" that charge thousands of dollars per month in exchange for clean sheets and high school level cafeteria food served by grossly underpaid workers while C.E.O.'s etc are paid millions. Why isn't this even talked about by assholes like Teddy Cruz?

[Potemkin]

Some folks seem to have sex ID issues. I'm sorry but i don't give a shit.

Folks will work all their lives and save up a nest egg which will be filched in no time at life's end by so called "nursing homes" that charge thousands of dollars per month in exchange for clean sheets and high school level cafeteria food served by grossly underpaid workers while C.E.O.'s etc are paid millions. Why isn't this even talked about by assholes like Teddy Cruz?

Because, like most politicians, he has long ago been bought and paid for. Politicians don’t serve the public because the public can’t afford their prices.

[Fasces]

I think people in this thread don't go far enough.

Folks like Michael Phelps are genetic mutants basically built for excelling at swimming that no other living man will match - hell, I was denied a place in the NBA in the womb when my genetics decided they would stop growing at 175cm.

It is in the interest of fair competition that level playing fields be established truly. Maximum testosterone hormones per mL for women. Maximum heighs and oxygen red blood cell carrying capacity for men.

1) Let's define the "Average Male" and "Average Female"

2) limit all Olympic and Athletic compeition to those that fall within one standard deviation of that, in all physiological ways possible.

Only then will athletics be safe, competitive, and fair!

[wat0n]

I think people in this thread don't go far enough.

Folks like Michael Phelps are genetic mutants basically built for excelling at swimming that no other living man will match - hell, I was denied a place in the NBA in the womb when my genetics decided they would stop growing at 175cm.

It is in the interest of fair competition that level playing fields be established truly. Maximum testosterone hormones per mL for women. Maximum heighs and oxygen red blood cell carrying capacity for men.

1) Let's define the "Average Male" and "Average Female"

2) limit all Olympic and Athletic compeition to those that fall within one standard deviation of that, in all physiological ways possible.

Only then will athletics be safe, competitive, and fair!

That's actually true, and another way to see it. Indeed, there are women who have naturally higher levels of testosterone and they have been banned from competing based on that.

So... Maybe we could just do away with different sex categories for sports? Or maybe, as I mentioned earlier ITT, there could be an "anything goes" category that isn't just divided by sex, but allows roiding.

[MadMonk]

Puberty separates the sexes in terms of growth and other physical developments. The genetic sex that you were during puberty has lifetime implications in terms of bodymass, bone structure, length, muscle mass and muscle fiber type.

Boys/Men have about ten times higher levels of testosterone during puberty than women, which releases enormous amounts of anabolic and catabolic hormones. Estrogen also releases these growth hormones but at far lower levels. Physical training can add as much muscle mass to either sex as measured by percentage growth, but men have a higher starting point. Women can have far greater strength in relation to bodymass compared with men, but the overall strength is most often less given men tend to have greater bodymass.

In terms of musclefibers, men have a higher rate of explosive muscle fibers with higher burnrate of carbohydrates in absence of oxygen, while women have higher rates of slower but more durable muscle fibers. Larger lungs, larger hearts and higher hemoglobin levels in the blood also gives an advantage of oxygenating the muscles faster.

But I think we should introduce a separate free-for-all category where anyone is allowed to compete regardless of prerequisites.

[Drlee]

Why don't we do away with women's sports altogether. It is not their place to be jocks anyway. Their place is in the home or sitting at a desk outside of their boss's office. They can jog to stay trim and play golf when it is necessary for business mingling. Otherwise women's sports are just useless, less impressive versions of men's sports anyway.

[BlutoSays]

How do you know the left is losing?

It's easy, actually. When things are going badly for democrats, the culture wars rev up.

Don't say gay!
LGBTQIAWTFBBQ+/-
Gender theory Disney

Divide and conquer - brought to you by Comcast, Time Warner, AT&T, Viacom, the DNC, Woke Inc., and all the players you already know.

More shiny objects on the horizon, courtesy of the Democrat Trans Council. November is coming, and progressives are scared shitless.

[Drlee]

This is a totally loosing issue for Democrats. Its utter absurdity infuriates moderates and brings out the moderate/leans conservative independent vote.

The issue is helped by those who see a conspiracy behind all of this. There is no corporate gay agenda. Just companies trying to avoid damage from a very vocal and newly empowered minority.

Americans are generally sympethetic to gay rights. By that they mean normalization of rights for gay and lesbian people. Bi does not matter because it is a subset of LG. Trans is generally ok with most people and hardly anyone knows what queer means at all.

Trans athletes do not do their cause any favors at all. In fact their whiny selfish desire to play a game hurts their cause dramatically. But these special snowflakes can't give any on the issues. They cross into the absurd and the people (correctly in my opinion) shout NO. And they do that by (as I am going to do) vote for conservative candidates.

A good analogy is this. People in the US generally favor liberal gun laws. They believe that people should be allowed to own them. But a few morons want to carry them at protests or at schools and the result is that the people shout NO again.

Hopefully that is what will happen here. Hopefully we will choose to not break a good thing.

One thing that the right is far better at remembering than the left is, is that the word "equality" does not mean "the same". And that it is possible in a democracy to make some decisions that are the best for the majority of people even if they inconvenience some of the people. Even sometimes a lot.

[BlutoSays]

Watch two minutes of her - a child abuser. Listen to what she says.


SCOOP: Disney corporate president Karey Burke says, "as the mother [of] one transgender child and one pansexual child," she supports having "many, many, many LGBTQIA characters in our stories" and wants a minimum of 50 percent of characters to be LGBTQIA and racial minorities.

[BlutoSays]

Leaked Zoom Call of Disney Executives Shows Their Shocking Plan For New Children's Movies

[Pants-of-dog]

All of this makes me think that Republicans are smart to make this into a media frenzy. It really seems to get people emotional and riled up, and therefore willing to go out and vote for them.

The nice thing about this is it requires very little in terms of policy change or actually making things better, so lots of gain for no cost.