[Politics_Observer]

If republicans don't view voting as a fundamental right, but a "privilege" then how would republicans feel if such a "privilege" is taken away from them? Maybe the democrats should consider taking away the right to vote for the republicans given they view voting as a "privilege" instead of a fundamental right, that way democrats can keep their voting "privileges" and not have them threatened by republicans. If repulbicans complained about it then the democrats should simply say "hey, you said it yourself, it's a privilege and not a fundamental right, so we are taking your privileges away. You would do it to us if you had the chance given you said voting is a privilege!"

[late]

If republicans don't view voting as a fundamental right, but a "privilege" then how would republicans feel if such a "privilege" is taken away from them? Maybe the democrats should consider taking away the right to vote for the republicans given they view voting as a "privilege" instead of a fundamental right, that way democrats can keep their voting "privileges" and not have them threatened by republicans.

You want to fight the enemy, not become them.

[Politics_Observer]

@late

I know that late, but I am making a point. If voting is a privilege, who is to say that some democrats might take republicans up on that and take away republican "privileges" to vote?

[Gardener]

Democrats vote to increase voting access and remove barriers to voter participation. What are you talking about?

Hmm.. but you can argue that Democrats vote to increase voting access to EVERYBODY - including non-US citizens, and remove potential barriers to voter fraud ! (where it benefits the Democratic vote).

[Politics_Observer]

@Gardener

Do you have evidence from an authoritative source of non-US citizens voting in our elections?

[Pants-of-dog]

Non-citizens were allowed to vote in US elections until relatively recent times: the 1920s or thereabouts.

And if the idea is to use voting as a means to hold the government accountable, then I would like someone to explain why non-citizens do not have the same duty nor should they enjoy the same benefits.

[late]

@Gardener

Do you have evidence from an authoritative source of non-US citizens voting in our elections?

That depends on whether you think Qanon is authoritative...

[Godstud]

Hmm.. but you can argue that Democrats vote to increase voting access to EVERYBODY - including non-US citizens, and remove potential barriers to voter fraud ! (where it benefits the Democratic vote).

Conspiracy theories are all you have? Lame. There is no evidence, whatsoever, that this has a lick of truth in it.

Democrats want voter(legal) access.

Republicans want voter(legal) suppression.

[Gardener]

Non-citizens were allowed to vote in US elections until relatively recent times: the 1920s or thereabouts.

And if the idea is to use voting as a means to hold the government accountable, then I would like someone to explain why non-citizens do not have the same duty nor should they enjoy the same benefits.

Because it is not THEIR government, nor should they have any say in its composition. That is a fairly basic tenant of citizenship ? d

[Godstud]

@Gardener, It doesn't matter, as non-citizens are NOT voting in American election. Saying otherwise is simply being dishonest or buying into QAnon conspiracy theories.

Non-Citizens Are Not Voting. Here Are the Facts.
Let’s have an honest debate about voting in this country — not one filled with misinformation. Voter fraud, including voting by non-citizens, is just not happening like the president says.

Multiple nationwide studies have uncovered only a handful of incidents of non-citizens voting. Based on state prosecution records, votes by non-citizens account for between 0.0003 percent and 0.001 percent of all votes cast. Election officials agree that there is no serious problem of non-citizen voting in our elections. The National Association of Secretaries of State, whose Republican-majority membership includes the chief elections officers of 40 states, said they “are not aware of any evidence that supports the voter fraud claims made by President Trump.”

Federal law and the law of every state prohibit non-citizens from registering to vote or voting in elections (save for a few municipalities that allow non-citizen residents to vote in local elections). Experts believe that the severity of the penalties for violating these laws serve as a significant deterrent.

Penalties for a non-citizen voting or registering to vote are severe.

Under federal law, any non-citizen that votes can be fined up to $100,000 and imprisoned for up to one year or three years if they intentionally misrepresented their citizenship status. States have their own equally harsh penalties. In one recent high-profile example, a permanent resident in Texas was sentenced to eight years in prison for voting.

Even more serious, a non-citizen can be deported for casting a single vote they were not eligible to cast. For non-citizens working towards naturalization, merely being registered to vote can serve as a basis for denying citizenship.
https://www.brennancenter.org/our-work/ ... -are-facts

[Gardener]

@Gardener, It doesn't matter, as non-citizens are NOT voting in American election. Saying otherwise is simply being dishonest or buying into QAnon conspiracy theories.

Non-Citizens Are Not Voting. Here Are the Facts.
Let’s have an honest debate about voting in this country — not one filled with misinformation. Voter fraud, including voting by non-citizens, is just not happening like the president says.

Multiple nationwide studies have uncovered only a handful of incidents of non-citizens voting. Based on state prosecution records, votes by non-citizens account for between 0.0003 percent and 0.001 percent of all votes cast. Election officials agree that there is no serious problem of non-citizen voting in our elections. The National Association of Secretaries of State, whose Republican-majority membership includes the chief elections officers of 40 states, said they “are not aware of any evidence that supports the voter fraud claims made by President Trump.”

Federal law and the law of every state prohibit non-citizens from registering to vote or voting in elections (save for a few municipalities that allow non-citizen residents to vote in local elections). Experts believe that the severity of the penalties for violating these laws serve as a significant deterrent.

Penalties for a non-citizen voting or registering to vote are severe.

Under federal law, any non-citizen that votes can be fined up to $100,000 and imprisoned for up to one year or three years if they intentionally misrepresented their citizenship status. States have their own equally harsh penalties. In one recent high-profile example, a permanent resident in Texas was sentenced to eight years in prison for voting.

Even more serious, a non-citizen can be deported for casting a single vote they were not eligible to cast. For non-citizens working towards naturalization, merely being registered to vote can serve as a basis for denying citizenship.
https://www.brennancenter.org/our-work/ ... -are-facts

I never said it WAS happening. I merely said that Democrats WANT it to happen !

[Godstud]

I merely said that Democrats WANT it to happen

That's a delusion with no basis in reality. QAnon bullshit, AGAIN.

[Pants-of-dog]

Because it is not THEIR government, nor should they have any say in its composition. That is a fairly basic tenant of citizenship ? d

Since they have to abide by the rules of said government and could be oppressed by said government, it is their government in every practical way.

Also, this was how the founding fathers did it. Do you know better than them how to run the country?

[Steve_American]

Since they have to abide by the rules of said government and could be oppressed by said government, it is their government in every practical way.

Also, this was how the founding fathers did it. Do you know better than them how to run the country?

IMHO, now is not the time to change this.
The world is facing mass migrations that will be 10 times worse than any in history as a percent of the population.
The US will be faced with accepting many millions of people, or killing them at the border. IMHO, they will be so desperate that they will keep trying until they die. That is what is going to happen in a few to several to many years.
Letting them vote as soon as they arrive is just dumb.

Also, Flordia will be 30% (and increasing yearly) under the ocean in many years.
.

[Pants-of-dog]

IMHO, now is not the time to change this.
The world is facing mass migrations that will be 10 times worse than any in history as a percent of the population.
The US will be faced with accepting many millions of people, or killing them at the border. IMHO, they will be so desperate that they will keep trying until they die. That is what is going to happen in a few to several to many years.
Letting them vote as soon as they arrive is just dumb.

Also, Flordia will be 30% (and increasing yearly) under the ocean in many years.
.

Actually, those all seem like very good reasons to talk about enfranchisement of recent migrants as soon as possible.

[Steve_American]

The Repuds as a Party have ---
1] Either staged a coup or supported it after the fact.
2] Are proposing or passing laws in the states to supress the Dem vote.
3] Proposing and passing laws in the states to give the state legislature the power to overturn an election without proof of the fraud they alledge.

IMHO, the Repud Party must be punished for this for at least one election cucle.
And the only punishment that politiciand understsnd is loosing elections.