[Julian658]

Reagan wasn't targetting "blacks" in general, and he certainly wasn't targetting "whites" in general. He was specifically targetting the Black Panthers, a self-organising group of radical blacks who had taken to following police officers around while armed with rifles in order to 'monitor' their behaviour in black neighbourhoods. They had a constitutional right to do this, but the police wanted it stopped and Reagan wanted it stopped. Gun control laws were their chosen means of stopping it, by taking away their constitutional right to bear arms. Everyone else, black or white, was just collatoral damage.

I don't doubt police brutality was a billion times worse in that era, but following cops as you describe above is extremely disturbing.

Ideally laws apply to ALL equally. Gun control laws are obeyed by law abiding people with no proclivity to do crime.

Those that want to do crimes with the aid of a gun can always get them in the black market. I live in Maryland which has extremely strict gun control laws. They make you jump thru hoops and loops and it takes about 270.00 USD dollars just to apply for a permit and pay for the training. They require security training, fingerprints, seven day wait, pristine record of no crime, etc, etc . And yet every single criminal in downtown Baltimore has a gun and they shoot each other on a daily basis.



This type of excessive gun violence is a new phenomenon. Thomas Sowell grew up in Harlem in the 1940s and he recalls that gun violence was unheard off. He never heard gunshots while growing up in the hood. But, that was in the 1940-50s. He was admitted to Harvard when there was no affirmative action. He got in because he was smart and not because he was black.

[Potemkin]

I don't doubt police brutality was a billion times worse in that era, but following cops as you describe above is extremely disturbing.

It was meant to be disturbing. The Black Panthers were not willing to continue being passive victims of racism and police brutality. They wanted the police to feel the same discomfort and, yes, the same fear that black people felt when interacting with them. The police, of course, didn't like this one little bit, and called on Reagan to do something about it. Which he did.

Ideally laws apply to ALL equally.

Indeed. Which is why Reagan had to apply the gun control laws to everyone, equally, although I'm sure he would much rather they had just applied to the Black Panthers. There's always that pesky Constitution, getting in the way.... Lol.

Gun control laws are obeyed by law abiding people with no proclivity to do crime.

The gun control laws allowed the police to arrest the Black Panthers if they tried to follow them around while armed with rifles. Which was the whole point of those laws.

Those that want to do crimes with the aid of a gun can always get them in the black market. I live in Maryland which has extremely strict gun control laws. They make you jump thru hoops and loops and it takes about 270.00 USD dollars just to apply for a permit and pay for the training. They require security training, fingerprints, seven day wait, pristine record of no crime, etc, etc . And yet every single criminal in downtown Baltimore has a gun and they shoot each other on a daily basis.

You're preaching to the choir, @Julian658 - as a revolutionary communist, I believe that the working class should be armed and dangerous. Everyone who wants one, and is not a known criminal preying on the working people, should have a gun. If I had my way, there'd be guys standing on every street corner handing out free Kalashnikovs to anyone who wanted one. Lol.

This type of excessive gun violence is a new phenomenon. Thomas Sowell grew up in Harlem in the 1940s and he recalls that gun violence was unheard off. He never heard gunshots while growing up in the hood. But, that was in the 1940-50s. He was admitted to Harvard when there was no affirmative action. He got in because he was smart and not because he was black.

How is this relevant?

[Julian658]

It was meant to be disturbing. The Black Panthers were not willing to continue being passive victims of racism and police brutality. They wanted the police to feel the same discomfort and, yes, the same fear that black people felt when interacting with them. The police, of course, didn't like this one little bit, and called on Reagan to do something about it. Which he did.

Despite the massive reduction in racism in the last 60 years the sentiments of many in the black community have not changed much. The perception of racism is at an all time high. The old model to create revolution ie employer oppressing the worker has been replaced by white people oppressing all other groups in the world. And I admit it is working quite well.

Indeed. Which is why Reagan had to apply the gun control laws to everyone, equally, although I'm sure he would much rather they had just applied to the Black Panthers. There's always that pesky Constitution, getting in the way.... Lol.

It is interesting that gun control was advocated by the right.

You're preaching to the choir, @Julian658 - as a revolutionary communist, I believe that the working class should be armed and dangerous. Everyone who wants one, and is not a known criminal preying on the working people, should have a gun. If I had my way, there'd be guys standing on every street corner handing out free Kalashnikovs to anyone who wanted one. Lol.

How is this relevant?

You guys cherish chaos and mayhem in the West as this increases the likelihood of revolution. However, the social justice warriors get in the way by indirectly promoting capitalism to pay for a welfare state.

Sowell is relevant as he is the main subject of the thread. Blacks in the inner city are immune to gun control laws.

[late]

Despite the massive reduction in racism in the last 60 years...

Your information is over 30 years out of date. We started re-segregating in 1989. The FBI has said there is a big increase in hate groups and hate crimes.

All of which I've told you multiple times before, and will have to say it multiple times again because you don't do reality, you do propaganda.

[Potemkin]

Despite the massive reduction in racism in the last 60 years the sentiments of many in the black community have not changed much. The perception of racism is at an all time high. The old model to create revolution ie employer oppressing the worker has been replaced by white people oppressing all other groups in the world. And I admit it is working quite well.

If some guy is now no longer murdering his wives, but is instead just beating them up, should we say to ourselves, "Oh well, he's much better than he used to be. We should give him a break and just let him beat up his current wife. After all, he hasn't killed her yet, has he? He's a reformed character!" Would this be a reasonable position to adopt, do you think?

It is interesting that gun control was advocated by the right.

The right will advocate anything they think will be in their own interests. They tend to be opportunists, not ideologues.

You guys cherish chaos and mayhem in the West as this increases the likelihood of revolution. However, the social justice warriors get in the way by indirectly promoting capitalism to pay for a welfare state.

Indeed. I've always found the SJWs to be rather annoying. They seem to want a revolution without a revolution. Not sure how that's going to work out for them....

Sowell is relevant as he is the main subject of the thread. Blacks in the inner city are immune to gun control laws.

Criminals in general are immune to gun control laws. Another reason why ordinary working people should be armed.

[Julian658]

Your information is over 30 years out of date. We started re-segregating in 1989. The FBI has said there is a big increase in hate groups and hate crimes.

All of which I've told you multiple times before, and will have to say it multiple times again because you don't do reality, you do propaganda.

Can you post the references regarding how hate crimes have gone up since 1989? I will try to look it up. If you are correct then it is my bad. However, from my personal experience as someone that came to the USA in the 1970s the level of racism is much less.

Right wing nationalists are now stimulated and making noise. This is what I would expect after the demonization of white people by the media, CRT, and the left. For every action there is a reaction. I wish schools would preach unity regardless of skin color rather than race ID politics. When the left does race ID politics they are asking some whites to do the same. That is a terrible strategy.

[late]

Can you post the references regarding how hate crimes have gone up since 1989? I will try to look it up.

Not what I said...

Try the FBI.

[Julian658]

If some guy is now no longer murdering his wives, but is instead just beating them up, should we say to ourselves, "Oh well, he's much better than he used to be. We should give him a break and just let him beat up his current wife. After all, he hasn't killed her yet, has he? He's a reformed character!" Would this be a reasonable position to adopt, do you think?

I am not saying there is no racism. However, by every measured parameter racism is less today. Furthermore, these days racism is defined as an abstract. CRT people say there is racism in every aspect of the West and that all white people are racists. They are not ashamed to even say racism is in the air we breath. Within this context racism is a billion times worse. The American black community has embraced the role of the noble victim and that is what unites them.

I went to a graduation today in Montgomery County Maryland. This is one of the most wealthy counties in America with a per capita income of 108,000 USD a year. In the county whites are a minority and everywhere you go you see people from all over the world. Among the graduates there were very few with Anglo Saxon names. The school is mostly minority kids. I was disappointed to see the principal and all speakers talk about how oppressed they are. Whenever oppression and racism was mentioned by the speakers the crowd erupted in applause. I realized these people celebrate their oppression by clapping their hands. Meanwhile this high school in one of the most wealth counties in the USA looks like a high end country club with state of the art facilities. I sat among many black families and they were all high end and affluent and yet they clap when SJW topics were mentioned by the speakers.

The right will advocate anything they think will be in their own interests. They tend to be opportunists, not ideologues.

They are no different than you in that regard. I venture to say that if the extreme left gets into power all guns will be outlawed.

Indeed. I've always found the SJWs to be rather annoying. They seem to want a revolution without a revolution. Not sure how that's going to work out for them....

They are driven by narcissism which is fed by over the top virtue signaling. I saw massive virtue signaling by all speakers in the graduation.

Criminals in general are immune to gun control laws. Another reason why ordinary working people should be armed.

You sound like a right winger. A Zizek type communist. I bet you are not PC.

[Julian658]

Not what I said...

Try the FBI.

https://www.latimes.com/california/stor ... tinue-rise

In LA hate crimes have gone up a tad, but way less than in the 2000-2010 decade.

Since the election of Trump hate crimes went up slightly. This is the reaction one would expect if one group is demonized 24/7 by the media.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/niallmccar ... 62f3361701

Further demonization of white people is not likely to work. I would suggest unity as it is done in France. I would abolish the system of classifying people according to skin color. That is divisive and leads to tribalism.

[Potemkin]

I am not saying there is no racism. However, by every measured parameter racism is less today. Furthermore, these days racism is defined as an abstract. CRT people say there is racism in every aspect of the West and that all white people are racists. They are not ashamed to even say racism is in the air we breath. Within this context racism is a billion times worse. The American black community has embraced the role of the noble victim and that is what unites them.

This may have something to do with the fact that their ancestors, and their entire racial identity, were systematically oppressed, enslaved, humiliated and persecuted for centuries. And you expect that not to have a permanent effect on that entire group of people?

I went to a graduation today in Montgomery County Maryland. This is one of the most wealthy counties in America with a per capita income of 108,000 USD a year. In the county whites are a minority and everywhere you go you see people from all over the world. Among the graduates there were very few with Anglo Saxon names. The school is mostly minority kids. I was disappointed to see the principal and all speakers talk about how oppressed they are. Whenever oppression and racism was mentioned by the speakers the crowd erupted in applause. I realized these people celebrate their oppression by clapping their hands. Meanwhile this high school in one of the most wealth counties in the USA looks like a high end country club with state of the art facilities. I sat among many black families and they were all high end and affluent and yet they clap when SJW topics were mentioned by the speakers.

This is the legacy of centuries of oppression, humiliation and exploitation. African-Americans, collectively, show all the symptoms of post-traumatic stress disorder. It's like telling an ex-veteran with a steady job and a stable marriage to "pull himself together" when in fact he's falling apart with PTSD. Their behaviour may seem irrational to you, but it is actually perfectly normal, given their past.

They are no different than you in that regard. I venture to say that if the extreme left gets into power all guns will be outlawed.

Reagan introduced gun control in California because some of the blacks were getting a bit uppity. Don't talk to me about "opportunism".

They are driven by narcissism which is fed by over the top virtue signaling. I saw massive virtue signaling by all speakers in the graduation.

Almost everyone in the modern world engages in virtue signalling, even the followers of Trump.

You sound like a right winger. A Zizek type communist. I bet you are not PC.

I'm actually a Stalinist. I dunno, was Stalin PC?

[wat0n]

Indeed, but it also means that sooner or later they will regard themselves as being safe and living in equality just like other formerly oppressed groups have done over time. Even to this day, for example, there are Italian American advocacy organizations even though official and I'd say even societal discrimination against them ceased long ago (the latter is something even Jewish Americans haven't been able to accomplish yet).

[late]

"Hate crimes in the U.S. rose to the highest level in more than a decade as federal officials also recorded the highest number of hate-motivated killings since the FBI began collecting that data in the early 1990s, according to an FBI report released Monday.

As the data was made public on Monday, advocacy groups, including the Anti-Defamation League, called on Congress and law enforcement agencies across the U.S. to improve data collection and reporting of hate crimes. Critics have long warned that the data may be incomplete, in part because it is based on voluntary reporting by police agencies across the country.

Last year, only 2,172 law enforcement agencies out of about 15,000 participating agencies across the country reported hate crime data to the FBI..."
https://apnews.com/article/hate-crimes-rise-FBI-data-ebbcadca8458aba96575da905650120d

While hate crimes against Blacks is about the same as last year, hate crimes against Latinos and Asians is on the rise.

I don't want to get too esoteric for ya, but the way you deal with crime is law enforcement...

[Julian658]

This may have something to do with the fact that their ancestors, and their entire racial identity, were systematically oppressed, enslaved, humiliated and persecuted for centuries. And you expect that not to have a permanent effect on that entire group of people?


This is the legacy of centuries of oppression, humiliation and exploitation. African-Americans, collectively, show all the symptoms of post-traumatic stress disorder. It's like telling an ex-veteran with a steady job and a stable marriage to "pull himself together" when in fact he's falling apart with PTSD. Their behaviour may seem irrational to you, but it is actually perfectly normal, given their past.

I fully agree, but many American blacks don’t know they know they have generational post racism PTSD. At least the soldier that comes back home from war has an idea of PTSD and is receiving treatment. The media a left wing leaders are worsening the PTSD. The young generation that never experienced Jim Crow complains more than their grandparents. Meanwhile the media and political leaders encourage the syndrome of victimhood. Don’t get me wrong, victimhood can be seen as empowering and a symbol of unity.

Almost everyone in the modern world engages in virtue signalling, even the followers of Trump.


I'm actually a Stalinist. I dunno, was Stalin PC?

The problem with some that signal virtue is that the crazy stuff they preach is not subject to their conscience.

State capitalism is certainly better than communism even if both systems are authoritarian.