Alexander, Jesus, the Greeks were they Nordic Aryans? - Page 4 - Politics Forum.org | PoFo

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Theories and happenings too odd for the main forums.
#14715728
The first Nordics in the Greco-Roman world appeared in the 4th AD, considering that you are talking about people in the 5th-3rd BCE, your Nordic theories hardly make any sense, especially when we have so much evidence to the contrary, mosaics, paintings, descriptions by the Greeks themselves contrasting themselves to Hyperboreans and when we have the evil-blue-eye superstition which is still obervant being so rampant that Aristotle tried to provide a scientific explanation.

All evidence which Nordic racists brush off due to their white-centrist point of view.
#14715732
@noemon
True, Arabs are darker than Greeks. But even so, Greeks weren't historically white, they were caucasian, so not too dark and not too white.
And Greeks do look like Aryans BTW, even historically both shared simillar description.

Arab records actually go back quite before that. For example in Arabic history books you can read in details about when and how Mekkans started their trade journey every year from Mekka all the way up to the Roman empire and their deals and trades and when did they started that tradition, in the 5th century.(the two journeys, one in the winter south to Yemen and Africa and one in the summer to the Roman and Persian empires)
And thats just Mekka. The first Arabs whom live in Yemen have historical records back to the 1st century and some even before. And those were specifically known because they encountered Persians first and that was what connected them to much of the world.
Last edited by anasawad on 05 Sep 2016 21:24, edited 1 time in total.
#14715735
@Albert
Well, to be fair, Slavs aren't really full white either rather mixed currently. You know Many brown people went there specially from Asia.
:lol: :lol:


Fun fact, if you want to know how white people were described historically, as in, historically in ancient times before Christ.
Just search the origins of the word Barbarians. :lol: :lol:
And i'm serious here. :p
#14715739
Okay you win, Greco-Roman world was fully brown. I don't care. I'm sure the fact that they imported so many Slavic slaves that the word slave is now derived from Slavs. Had no impact on genetic disposition of any region.


As I have said before Greeks or rather Greco-Romans have assimilated, Slavic Serbians, Scandinavians(Varangians), Assyrians(not Arabic Syrians), Jews & Armenians mainly as well as small portions of Persians and Goths(the reason these are called small is because of the fact that assimilation requires a stable marriage contract which did not exist but their contact was substantial to warrant small but not big which would be the case if marriage contractual agreements existed among them). These are the peoples that the Greco-Romans were permitted to marry granted that they were Christianised and which became assimilated into the Roman Empire out of their own accord wanting to gain the status of a Greek-speaking Roman. The Turks however were not assimilated by Greeks, they assimilated the Greeks, which is different as mixed Turco-Greek offspring mandatorily became Turkish.
#14715743
Albert wrote:I just think its fair to assume that there was a mix of Nordics in Greco-Roman world. Considering geography, expansion of those peoples and history.


:eh:

Look at the blue on that map.

Image

How many of them do you think made it into Ancient Rome? Ancient Greece?

But even then, the big warm color center of Europe were largely made of Celts, and the oldest group of Celts that were not moved around a lot during ancient times are the Irish of rural Western Ireland, who tend to be, "black Irish."

Like me, my family, and most famously someone that has shown up in this thread before:

Image

For a long time, racial scientitions considered us African because of this:

Image

But really, it's because the Irish (and British Celts) are descended from the Basque.

Of course, this is all mixed up and more complicated than this as everyone's moving around—but that's generally what they're finding.

And these are people that the Romans said had "milky skin." As Noemon said, this is almost certainly by comparison to the darker people of the Mediterranean instead of them literally having milk for skin or something.

The only reason this is even a question is because there are racists on the board that want to spit in the face of all history, genetics, and common sense and say that the people Norway were not actually living traditionally, but Genetically Superior Racial Supermen that ruled us all and started society going before disappearing back to Sweden or whatever for no apparent reason, then stepping in to be Christ, savior of man, for a moment, and then receding back up for no reason until they forgot everything they did for the history of the world and became Vikings.

All Noemon, myself, others, and everyone else that is smarter than us for not even engaging this stupid conspiracy theory, conclude is that history and science are correct and people with black hair can start a civilization.
#14715744
noemon wrote:Wait a minute, Iranians look like Europeans but Iranian women married with Greeks turned the Greeks into Arabs?


You constantly invent things I did not say. I talked about Egyptian women, not Iranian.

You manage to mix up everything in your brain, and then you blame your opponents. You pasted an Orthodox Icon, and I said that the icons become darker with time, but you twisted my answer and started to talk about the painting of mummies that were painted using a different technique.

noemon wrote:Romans looking like this:

Image


Some Romans looked like this couple, others looked differently. As already many times repeated, there lived different ethnic groups and even different races in Pompeii.

Here is another painting from the same city that illustrates this:

Image


noemon wrote:At the end of World War I, when the UK & Greece fought the Germans on the side of the Ottomans, the UK was the main proponent of Istanbul going to Greece, the French, the Italians and the Soviet Russians however could not tolerate a Greek Constantinople and it were the Soviets who gave Ataturk the necessary weapons, and the French and Italians who made life difficult for the Greeks and the British. Constantinople was occupied and it was eventually ceded to Turkey.


What did you expect from Bolsheviks?
They brutally murdered the Russian Tsar and all his family, they defiled Russian Churches, why should they permit any strengthening of the Orthodox Greece?
They dreamed about World Revolution, which was the first Globalist project, supported by Wall Street Banksters.

BTW, it is idiotic to talk bout "Soviet Russians", Russian people were not of control of the Soviet Union till the end of WWII.

noemon wrote:...German complicity & support in the Armenian, Greek and Syrian genocides...


You seem to be obsessed with "German guilt", are there any genocides in this world that Germans were not complicit?

:eh:

What about the Young Turks?

I could not find any Germans among these guys, but some Jews:


The prominent leaders and ideologists included:
Pamphleteers and activists
...
Emmanuel Carasso Efendi, a lawyer and a member of the prominent Sephardic Jewish Carasso family
Mehmet Cavit Bey, a Dönmeh from Thessalonica, Jewish by ancestry but Muslim by religion since the 17th century, who was Minister of Finance;[19] he was hanged for treason in 1926
....
Marcel Samuel Raphael Cohen (aka Tekin Alp), born to a Jewish family in Salonica under Ottoman control (now Thessaloniki, Greece), became one of the founding fathers of Turkish nationalism and an ideologue of Pan-Turkism
...

Talaat Pasha, whose role before the revolution is not clear

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Young_Turks


Talaat, the mastermind behind the Armenian genocide, had an interesting biography, it is believed that he was a Donmeh.

His salary was not high, so he worked after hours as a Turkish language teacher in th Alliance Israelite School which served the Jewish community of Edirne.[11]
At the age of 21 he had a love affair with the daughter of the Jewish headmaster for whom he worked.

...
According to various sources, Talaat Pasha had developed plans to eliminate the Armenians as early as 1910. Danish philologist Johannes Østrup wrote in his memoirs that in the autumn of 1910, Talaat talked openly about his plans to "exterminate" the Armenians with him.[14][15] According to Østrup, Talaat stated: "If I ever come to power in this country, I will use all my might to exterminate the Armenians."[14][15] In November of that year, a decision to carry out such a plan was made in Thessaloniki where a secret conference was held by prominent members of the Committee of Union and Progress (CUP).

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talaat_Pasha


How could somebody without any connection to Jews be a teacher in a Jewish School?
Last edited by ArtAllm on 05 Sep 2016 22:45, edited 2 times in total.
#14715749
ArtAllm wrote:You constantly invent things I did not say. I talked about Egyptian women, not Iranian.
You manage to mix up everything in your brain, and then you blame your opponents. You pasted an Orthodox Icon, and I said that the icons become darker with time, but you twisted my answer and started to talk about the painting of mummies that were painted using a different technique.


You said that Alexander moved his capital to Egypt and ordered his men to marry Egyptian women, I thought you were confused to say Egypt instead of Persia as Alexander moved his capital to Persia(Babylon) and ordered his generals to marry Persian women as he did. But it seems that you are massively confused as well. Regardless Alexander's orders were all overturned upon his death as history tells us and in Egypt specifically, a very extreme apartheid existed that separated Greeks from Egyptians, there is an academic paper on the subject given to you already which you have failed to address.

Arabs did not exist in Egypt back then, except for some tiny number of merchants but as Herodotus again tells us, they were negligible and does not count them among the peoples in Egypt.
#14715842
@The Immortal Goon The way i used the term nordic, i was referring to north European. That is in contrast to south European.

And I think we all know that Irish are not white and incapable of civilized life. If it was not for the Englishman you would still be living in huts, bowing down to your clan leaders and blowing the bagpipe for your pass time.

Irish are not white, they are translucent.

Image
#14716680
noemon wrote:You said that Alexander moved his capital to Egypt and ordered his men to marry Egyptian women, I thought you were confused to say Egypt instead of Persia as Alexander moved his capital to Persia(Babylon) and ordered his generals to marry Persian women as he did.


Well, he planned to move his capital to Babylon, but Alexandria in Egypt was de facto the most important city of his empire, and he was buried here.
The Ptolemaic Kingdom was the most prominent Kingdom that existed till the Roman Time.
During the reign of Ptolemies II and III thousands of Macedonian veterans were rewarded with grants of farm lands, and Macedonians were planted in colonies and garrisons or settled themselves in the villages throughout the country. Upper Egypt, farthest from the centre of government, was less immediately affected, even though Ptolemy I established the Greek colony of Ptolemais Hermiou to be its capital. But within a century Greek influence had spread through the country and intermarriage had produced a large Greco-Egyptian educated class. Nevertheless, the Greeks always remained a privileged minority in Ptolemaic Egypt. They lived under Greek law, received a Greek education, were tried in Greek courts, and were citizens of Greek cities.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ptolemaic_Kingdom


Well, if I was an idiot, like some users in this forum, I would talk about "Greek racism", because Greeks were a privileged group in Egypts.

But who were these Greeks?
Well, they were people who accepted the Hellenistic culture, that had nothing to do with race. Hellenistic people were of mixed race.

noemon wrote:... in Egypt specifically, a very extreme apartheid existed that separated Greeks from Egyptians...


Yes, but this division was not racial, it was cultural. The educated class was Hellenistic, though of mixed Egyptian-Greek origin, the common people were of the old Egyptian stock.

It is obvious that the soldiers did not take Greek women to Egypt, they married local women, like it was the case with Spanish conquistadors in Latin America, who married local women, and their descendants are mestizos who speak Spanish.

Mestizos speak Spanish, they were always segregated from native Amerindians, but it would be idiotic to say that Mestizos in Latin America and the Spanish people in Spain are the same race.

noemon wrote:Arabs did not exist in Egypt back then, except for some tiny number of merchants but as Herodotus again tells us, they were negligible and does not count them among the peoples in Egypt.


They did not call themselves Arabs yet, but the population of these regions remained the same.

Do not confuse race with ethnicity or religion.

Ethnic and religious (or ethno-religious) groups segregate themselves.
The Jews is the most prominent example of such a segregation.
Jews usually intermarry only with Jews.

But how did it happen that Ethiopian Jews are indistinguishable form Black Ethiopians who are Christians or Muslims, and Chinese Jews are indistinguishable from other Chinese people? And Jews from Lithuania look like Nordic people with blue eyes and blond hair?

Well, the answer is simple.

If a non-Jew converts to Judaism, then he is a Jew, and he can marry another Jews. That was the only segregation that worked for Jews and also for Hellenistic people. You can become a Jew via conversion, you marry another Jew, and then you segregate yourself from people of your own race.

That is what Tacitus described in his historical works:

The most degraded out of other races, scorning their national beliefs, brought to them their contributions and presents. This augmented the wealth of the Jews, as also did the fact, that among themselves they are inflexibly honest and ever ready to shew compassion, though they regard the rest of mankind with all the hatred of enemies. They sit apart at meals, they sleep apart, and though, as a nation, they are singularly prone to lust, they abstain from intercourse with foreign women; among themselves nothing is unlawful. Circumcision was adopted by them as a mark of difference from other men. Those who come over to their religion adopt the practice, and have this lesson first instilled into them, to despise all gods, to disown their country, and set at nought parents, children, and brethren. Still they provide for the increase of their numbers.

http://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/jso ... citus.html


As we see, Jews were from the very beginning just an ethno-religious group, they isolated themselves from the others, they hated the others, they treated the others as enemies, but the "others" were their former cousins, who did not abandon their old gods and their old way of life.

And now compare this to the other works of Tacitus, like "Germania":

The Germans themselves I should regard as aboriginal, and not mixed at all with other races through immigration or intercourse. For, in former times, it was not by land but on shipboard that those who sought to emigrate would arrive; and the boundless and, so to speak, hostile ocean beyond us, is seldom entered by a sail from our world. And, beside the perils of rough and unknown seas, who would leave Asia, or Africa, or Italy for Germany, with its wild country, its inclement skies, its sullen manners and aspect, unless indeed it were his home?
...
Every mother suckles her own offspring, and never entrusts it to servants and nurses. The master is not distinguished from the slave by being brought up with greater delicacy. Both live amid the same flocks and lie on the same ground till the freeborn are distinguished by age and recognised by merit. The young men marry late, and their vigour is thus unimpaired. Nor are the maidens hurried into marriage; the same age and a similar stature is required; well-matched and vigorous they wed, and the offspring reproduce the strength of the parents.
...
The other slaves are not employed after our manner with distinct domestic duties assigned to them, but each one has the management of a house and home of his own. The master requires from the slave a certain quantity of grain, of cattle, and of clothing, as he would from a tenant, and this is the limit of subjection.
...
Of lending money on interest and increasing it by compound interest they know nothing,—a more effectual safeguard than if it were prohibited. Land proportioned to the number of inhabitants is occupied by the whole community in turn, and afterwards divided among them according to rank.
...
Arms are not with them, as with the other Germans, at the general disposal, but are in the charge of a keeper, who is actually a slave...
...
For my own part, I agree with those who think that the tribes of Germany are free from all taint of inter-marriages with foreign nations, and that they appear as a distinct, unmixed race, like none but themselves. Hence, too, the same physical peculiarities throughout so vast a population. All have fierce blue eyes, red hair, huge frames, fit only for a sudden exertion.
https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Germania ... 6_Brodribb)


So what is Tacitus telling us?

Well, Northern Europe was isolated from the rest of Europe by forests and ocean, people there were also isolated from the rest of Europe during the ice times, so it is obvious that they could develop a racial homogeneity.

The Northern People did not have an institution of slavery similar to South Europe or the Orient. Their slaves were from the same stock, they were just people who were subordinated to the stronger alpha-males:

Strangely enough they make games of hazard a serious occupation even when sober, and so venturesome are they about gaining or losing, that, when every other resource has failed, on the last and final throw they stake the freedom of their own persons. The loser goes into voluntary slavery...

https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Germania ... 6_Brodribb)


As we see, the Northmen slaves were just serfs or squires, they lost the battle and they were subordinated to the winners. That was the ethic of the Northern men.

Germanic tribes did not know what "racism" is, because they all looked similar, speak they were of the same race.

Racism is a phenomenon that inevitably exists in racially mixed societies, in these societies people of different skin colour are enslaved.

Northern people hated slavery, like it was practised in South Europe, the institution of slavery was de facto destroyed by Northern people who had different moral and ethic norms, speak their ethics was free from racism, though the contact with Romans corrupted the original culture of Germanic tribes:

Besides parents and children, a household might include slaves, but slavery was uncommon, and according to Tacitus, slaves normally had households of their own. Their slaves (usually prisoners of war) were most often employed as domestic servants.[200] Polygamy and concubinage were rare but existed, at least among the upper classes.[205] When a certain number of families resided on the same territory, this constituted a village (Dorf in German). The overall territory occupied by people from the same tribe was designated in the writings of Tacitus as a civitas, with each of the individual civitas divided into pagi (or cantons), which were made up of several vici. In cases where the tribes were grouped into larger confederations or a group of kingdoms, the term pagus was applied (Gau in German).[206] Extensive contact with Rome altered the egalitarian structure of tribal Germanic society. As individuals rose to prominence, a distinction between commoner and nobility developed and with it the previous constructs of folkright shared equally across the tribe was replaced in some cases by privilege.[175] As a result, Germanic society became more stratified. Elites within the Germanic tribes who learned the Roman system and emulated the way they established dominion were able to gain advantages and exploit them accordingly.[207]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Germanic_peoples


But the spirit of Northmen still survived after the adoption of Roman Law, that is the only reason why white Christians could not tolerate Slavery, which was perfectly accepted by Abrahamits, Christianity accepts Slavery.

White people, who are the only people, who REALLY hate racism, freed black slaves, though some shills, who are de facto the worst racists themselves, still talk about "white racism" and the "white guilt".
#14716683
Image

The average frequency of the Slavic haplogroup R1a is 11.5% nationally in Greece today. It was the Greco-Macedonians and Tharacians who introduced R1a to Greece from 4,000 to 3,500 years ago. R1b is associated with the Dorians, who swept southward into central Greece and then into the southern Aegean area in successive migrations beginning about 1,100 BC. There are archaeological links between the Pontic-Caspian steppe, which is known as the R1a heartland, and ancient Greece as well, suggesting that the charioteers originally arrived from the Pontic-Caspian steppe. A Macedonian Greek royal family ruled the Ptolemaic Kingdom in Egypt for three hundred years, which was associated with the further expansion of the Greco-Macedonians in the region.

Image
#14716747
ArtAllm wrote:Well, he planned to move his capital to Babylon, but Alexandria in Egypt was de facto the most important city of his empire, and he was buried here.
The Ptolemaic Kingdom was the most prominent Kingdom that existed till the Roman Time.


Alexander was meant to be buried in Macedonia, his body was stolen by Ptolemy and buried in Egypt, the Seleucid Empire was the most prominent Kingdom of the Diadochi.

Well, if I was an idiot, like some users in this forum, I would talk about "Greek racism", because Greeks were a privileged group in Egypts.


Greeks were and still are racists, that is no secret. Your wiki bold statement also lacks a citation.

But who were these Greeks?
Well, they were people who accepted the Hellenistic culture, that had nothing to do with race. Hellenistic people were of mixed race.


Hellenistic people are foreign people who have adopted Greek culture, Greeks are not Hellenistic. Adoption of Greek culture did not grant anybody civil rights(incl. marriage) in Greek states, it merely made one amicable and tolerable.

Yes, but this division was not racial, it was cultural. The educated class was Hellenistic, though of mixed Egyptian-Greek origin, the common people were of the old Egyptian stock.


No the division was racial, you could not be a citizen of any Greek state if both your parents were not Greek.

It is obvious that the soldiers did not take Greek women to Egypt, they married local women, like it was the case with Spanish conquistadors in Latin America, who married local women, and their descendants are mestizos who speak Spanish.


It is obvious that you are misinformed, Alexandria was a brand-new city established solely by Greek settlers(incl. women), entire cities travelling with Alexander and establishing brand new cities from the bottom-up, Alexander's Generals revolted when they were told to intermix and as soon as he died they either killed or simply abandoned their foreign wives and ordered their soldiers to do the same. Their ethno-centric policies carried on in all the Kingdoms of the Diadochi.

These are all in the Academic paper already provided to you.

They did not call themselves Arabs yet, but the population of these regions remained the same.


They did call themselves Arabs as Herodotus informs us and they were not present in Egypt back then, they were still inside the Arabian peninsula.

I see you have completely ignored German complicity in the Armenian genocide and you are blaming the Jews yet again, you also added that extra bit after my reply as well.

The Young Turks included many Armenians and Greeks as well as the Young Turks started out as the republicans of the Ottoman Empire proclaiming a constitution and abolishment of the Sultanate, that drew in their ranks all the minorities of the Ottoman Empire including the Jews. But it were German officers who gave orders for Christians to be massacred as we have already seen and not Jews or Armenians or Greeks.
#14717676
@noemon

Well, now I know your opinion, and you are entitled to have an own opinion and ignore the facts.

BTW, why should it be in the interests of German officers to kill Armenians?

And back to the facts about the Egyptian mummies:

Under Greco-Roman rule, Egypt hosted several Greek settlements, mostly concentrated in Alexandria, but also in a few other cities, where Greek settlers lived alongside some seven to ten million native Egyptians.[6] Faiyum's earliest Greek inhabitants were soldier-veterans and cleruchs (elite military officials) who were settled by the Ptolemaic kings on reclaimed lands.[7][8] Native Egyptians also came to settle in Faiyum from all over the country, notably the Nile Delta, Upper Egypt, Oxyrhynchus and Memphis, to undertake the labor involved in the land reclamation process, as attested by personal names, local cults and recovered papyri.[9] It is estimated that as much as 30 percent of the population of Faiyum was Greek during the Ptolemaic period, with the rest being native Egyptians.[10]

Modern Studies conclude that the Faiyum portraits represent Greek settlers in Egypt.[11][12] Victor J. Katz notes that "most modern studies conclude that the Greek & Egyptian communities coexisted with little mutual influence".[13]
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Greeks_in_Egypt
#14717688
ArtAllm wrote:@noemon

Well, now I know your opinion, and you are entitled to have an own opinion and ignore the facts.


So you are ignoring the facts and then complain too, I guess victimisation has seeped into your brain.

BTW, why should it be in the interests of German officers to kill Armenians?


You should come back with a better reply if you want to be taken seriously...here:

Facing History wrote:In December 1913, a German mission arrived in Turkey with the task of reorganizing the Ottoman army. Officers of the German military mission assumed responsibility for the command of the Turkish army under the leadership of Enver. The German-Turkish relationship was strengthened after the agreement of a military alliance between Germany and the Ottoman Empire in August 1914.

In notes written after a meeting with Young Turk leaders of the Committee of Union and Progress known as ‘Ittihad’, Max Scheubner-Richter, a German vice consul and commander of a joint German-Turkish special guerrilla force, described plans to “destroy” the Armenians of the Ottoman Empire.

The first item on this agenda concerns the liquidation of the Armenians. Ittihad will dangle before the Allies a specter of an alleged revolution prepared by the Armenian Dashnak party. Moreover, local incidents of social unrest and acts of Armenian self defense will deliberately be provoked and inflated and will be used as pretexts to effect the deportations. Once en route, however, the convoys will be attacked and exterminated by Kurdish and Turkish brigands, and in part by gendarmes, who will be instigated for that purpose by Ittihad.2

From their unique position as overseers of the Ottoman army, German soldiers watched as the genocide was carried out. The highest-ranking member of Germany’s military mission to Turkey, General Bronsart von Schellendorf, directly issued orders for the round up and deportation of Armenians. Another high-ranking German officer, Lieutenant Colonel Boettrich, the military chief overseeing the construction of the Baghdad Railway, produced orders to deport the Armenian laborers, workmen, technicians, engineers, and administrators who were working on the railroad.3 When Franz Gunther, deputy director of the Anatolian Railway, learned about Boettrich’s orders, he warned:

Our enemies will some day pay a good price to obtain possession of this document . . . they will be able to prove that the Germans have not only done nothing to prevent the Armenian persecutions but they even issued certain orders to this effect, as the [Turkish] Military Commander has ecstatically pointed out.4


Yeah on the subject let's see:

Under Greco-Roman rule, Egypt hosted several Greek settlements, mostly concentrated in Alexandria, but also in a few other cities, where Greek settlers lived alongside some seven to ten million native Egyptians.[6] Faiyum's earliest Greek inhabitants were soldier-veterans and cleruchs (elite military officials) who were settled by the Ptolemaic kings on reclaimed lands.[7][8] Native Egyptians also came to settle in Faiyum from all over the country, notably the Nile Delta, Upper Egypt, Oxyrhynchus and Memphis, to undertake the labor involved in the land reclamation process, as attested by personal names, local cults and recovered papyri.[9] It is estimated that as much as 30 percent of the population of Faiyum was Greek during the Ptolemaic period, with the rest being native Egyptians.[10]

Modern Studies conclude that the Faiyum portraits represent Greek settlers in Egypt.[11][12] Victor J. Katz notes that "most modern studies conclude that the Greek & Egyptian communities coexisted with little mutual influence".[13]
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Greeks_in_Egypt
#14718041
noemon wrote:So you are ignoring the facts and then complain too, I guess victimisation has seeped into your brain.


I do not know where you got your "facts" from, no links...

Hundreds of eyewitnesses, including the neutral United States and the Ottoman Empire's own allies, Germany and Austria-Hungary, recorded and documented numerous acts of state-sponsored massacres.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Armenian_Genocide


If the policy of Germany was to support the Ottoman Empire in their genocide, why would German officers record and document the facts about this genocide?

Sorry, but this does not make any sense.

In this Wiki-Article they do not mention any Fritz Bronsart von Schellendorf.
Even if this guy hated Armenians and really supported the "Young Turks" in their plans against Armenians, what has this to do with the Kaiserreich?

In the German Wiki-Artikle they say that Vahakn N. Dadrian believes that this German officer gave the command to deport the Armenians.

But let us look who this guy is:

In 1991, Dadrian was dismissed from State University College at Geneseo for sexual harassment after a female student had complained he had kissed her on the lips. In 1981, a college arbitrator had found him guilty of four charges of sexual harassment, but had allowed him to return to work because the arbitrator believed they were "singular events that would not happen again."[8]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vahakn_Dadrian


A guy who was sexually harassing women should be trusted as moral authority and an unbiased researcher?

Give me a break!

:D

And here more facts about the Egyptian mummies from the mentioned Wiki-Article:

But research in papyri dating from the early centuries of the common era demonstrates that a significant amount of intermarriage took place between the Greek and Egyptian communities chiefly Greek men taking Egyptian wives.
#14718058
ArtAllm wrote:I do not know where you got your "facts" from, no links...


An academic article has been provided to you about Greek ethno-centrism and more specifically in Egypt and all the sources explicitly state that the Faiyum mummies represent ethnic-Greeks, also the academic consensus is that Greeks and Egyptians lived separately.

If the policy of Germany was to support the Ottoman Empire in their genocide, why would German officers record and document the facts about this genocide?
Sorry, but this does not make any sense.
In this Wiki-Article they do not mention any Fritz Bronsart von Schellendorf.
Even if this guy hated Armenians and really supported the "Young Turks" in their plans against Armenians, what has this to do with the Kaiserreich?
In the German Wiki-Artikle they say that Vahakn N. Dadrian believes that this German officer gave the command to deport the Armenians.
But let us look who this guy is:
:D


Dadrian kissed a student in the lips and his research is bad you say, whatever, that is a logical fallacy and it does not prove that the original documents cited in the research are false and...It is not just Vanakh Dadrian, it is also:

[2] Deborah Dwork and Robert Jan van Pelt, The Holocaust: A History (New York: W.W. Norton & Co., 2002),p. 38.

and

[6] Bryce, Treatment of the Armenians.

In notes written after a meeting with Young Turk leaders of the Committee of Union and Progress known as ‘Ittihad’, Max Scheubner-Richter, a German vice consul and commander of a joint German-Turkish special guerrilla force, described plans to “destroy” the Armenians of the Ottoman Empire.

The first item on this agenda concerns the liquidation of the Armenians. Ittihad will dangle before the Allies a specter of an alleged revolution prepared by the Armenian Dashnak party. Moreover, local incidents of social unrest and acts of Armenian self defense will deliberately be provoked and inflated and will be used as pretexts to effect the deportations. Once en route, however, the convoys will be attacked and exterminated by Kurdish and Turkish brigands, and in part by gendarmes, who will be instigated for that purpose by Ittihad.[2] Deborah Dwork and Robert Jan van Pelt, The Holocaust: A History (New York: W.W. Norton & Co., 2002),p. 38.
#14718595
noemon wrote:
An academic article has been provided to you about Greek ethno-centrism and more specifically in Egypt and all the sources explicitly state that the Faiyum mummies represent ethnic-Greeks...


I have provided a better scientific work that quotes ancient documents that confirm that the first "ethnic male Greeks" who settled in Egypt married local women.

BTW, the Mestizos in South America also define themselves as Castellanos and they segregate themselves from Amerindians.

The same with black Jews in Ethiopia, they segregate themselves from other black people and claim that they are "Hebrews".

So "ethnocentrism" and "isolationism" does not prove anything.

If a mixed group segregates themselves from their cousins, then this group does not become less mixed.


noemon wrote:Dadrian kissed a student in the lips and his research is bad you say...



He sexually harassed at least 4 girls, he used his position to extort "love".

The moral depravity of this extortionists is obvious.

It is known that German taxpayers can be easily extorted, so why not try a conspiracy theory about German Kaiser being responsible for the killing of Armenians, just let us pretend that the "Young Turks" (Jews and Marxists were hugely overrepresented in this group) did not have any intention to deport Armenians, and that they received their orders " for the final solution" from the German Kaiser via his generals and officers.

:D


noemon wrote:
It is not just Vanakh Dadrian, it is also:

[2] Deborah Dwork and Robert Jan van Pelt, The Holocaust: A History (New York: W.W. Norton & Co., 2002),p. 38.

and

[6] Bryce, Treatment of the Armenians.



I would not be surprised when the people who helped him to escape prison (Carol Wittenberg and Co) and become director of Genocide Researche at Zorian Institute were from the same group.


After this molester was acquitted by the judge, hundreds of students and processors protested against this decision, because they were sure that this guy will not stop.


:D

Do you really not understand that what you quoted makes my point, not yours?

This Armenia guy could be easily blackmailed , too, he owned a lot to people that saved him from prision!

BTW, why do these "think tanks" that research genocides, never talk about the Nakba or Holodomor, or other genocides, committed by Bolsheviks?

Armenians and Jews were overrepresented in the NKWD and in terrorist organizations that targeted civilians, but nobody talks about these genocides against Europeans and other people, including the genocide against the ethnic Germans in the ex-SU.

Shimon Peres told the "Ukrainians" : "My first advice would be if I lived in the Ukraine - it is to forget the past".

Why do we have to remember only carefully selected genocides, why can you not question all genocides, why are some genocides "more equal" than others?

And why do we have to forget other genocides, like the Holodomor, and why do they not mention these victims, why do they diminish them, why does Hollywood never produce movies about Lazar Kaganovich, Naftali Frenkel, Genrikh Yagoda or Ter-Petrosjan?

[that was a rhetorical question, we know why]

Here are facts about other genocides nobody talks about:

https://library.ndsu.edu/grhc/order/general/sinner.html


https://www.amazon.com/Open-Wound-Genoc ... 1891193082


https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Categor ... ant_groups

http://armenians-1915.blogspot.de/2007/ ... m.html?m=1


https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Bla ... _Communism
#14718596
And why do we have to forget other genocides, like the Holodomor, and why do they not mention these victims, why do they diminish them, why does Hollywood never produce movies about Lazar Kaganovich, Naftali Frenkel, Genrikh Yagoda or Ter-Petrosjan?

Mainly because no-one gives a fuck about them. After all, from the West's perspective, they were "mongoloid Russians" killing other "mongoloid Russians". Why should the American or the British elite have cared about this? The Nazi atrocities were played up because we were physically fighting them during WWII and the people they were killing were, by and large, our allies in that war. Of course we were going to care about it, and use it as grist for our propaganda mill. The Soviet massacres, on the other hand, were regarded as an internal matter for the Soviet Union in the 1930s and 40s, and were never widely publicised during the Cold War because of anti-Slavic racism and because the Cold War never went 'hot'. Moral of the story: if you're going to commit genocide, then make sure you only massacre people whom no-one gives a damn about. It has nothing to do with a worldwide Jewish conspiracy to conceal the truth, as you seem to be implying. :eh:
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