Guy Debord: we are being controlled via entertainment media - Page 2 - Politics Forum.org | PoFo

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#15315045
wat0n wrote:Or maybe it's an inanity because commercial media is not as important as it used to be when you were 15.

Media has become a lot more intrusive and powerful than when I was a kid.

At least back then, you couldn't "take TV with you wherever you go" like you can now with cellphones and tablets.

Kids today are more controlled (and damaged) by organized crime media than my generation was at the same stage in our lives. And we were already hopelessly damaged.

By the way, wat0n, you seem to be one of the most media-damaged people on this forum. You come to this thread, not as a participant, but as one of its patients.

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"Tell me, how did the movie make you feel?
Show me on the doll where the movie touched you."
#15315054
QatzelOk wrote:Media has become a lot more intrusive and powerful than when I was a kid.

At least back then, you couldn't "take TV with you wherever you go" like you can now with cellphones and tablets.

Kids today are more controlled (and damaged) by organized crime media than my generation was at the same stage in our lives. And we were already hopelessly damaged.

By the way, wat0n, you seem to be one of the most media-damaged people on this forum. You come to this thread, not as a participant, but as one of its patients.

Image
"Tell me, how did the movie make you feel?
Show me on the doll where the movie touched you."


Oh come on Qatz. You can also just refuse to watch commercial media and just use social media instead, as some people in fact do.

Commercial media has a lot of competition nowadays and it is also very hard to avoid or regulate it.
#15315084
wat0n wrote:...commercial media...social media...


Commercial media can be called "television" for the purposes of this thread. And most people interact today with a mixture of commercial media manipulation of their psyche, AND the added manipulation of collective damage from the same commercial media EXPRESSED as normalcy in social media.

I would like to ride a bike instead of driving an SUV but I can't because I watch entertainment media.

I would like to stop voting for genocidal vassals but I can't because I watch entertainment media.

I would like to participate in my community but I can't because I watch entertainment media.

I would like to improve my relations with other people and make peace with myself but I can't because I watch entertainment media.

I would like my species to survive as long as it possibly can but we won't because we watch entertainment media.

I would like to escape commercial media manipulation by interacting on social media, but I can't because commercial media now places people in social media as influencers.
#15315092
QatzelOk wrote:Commercial media can be called "television" for the purposes of this thread. And most people interact today with a mixture of commercial media manipulation of their psyche, AND the added manipulation of collective damage from the same commercial media EXPRESSED as normalcy in social media.

I would like to ride a bike instead of driving an SUV but I can't because I watch entertainment media.

I would like to stop voting for genocidal vassals but I can't because I watch entertainment media.

I would like to participate in my community but I can't because I watch entertainment media.

I would like to improve my relations with other people and make peace with myself but I can't because I watch entertainment media.

I would like my species to survive as long as it possibly can but we won't because we watch entertainment media.

I would like to escape commercial media manipulation by interacting on social media, but I can't because commercial media now places people in social media as influencers.


Oh come on, you can find all sorts of people in social media (including the typical conspiracy theorists who would get no showing in commercial media for being a fringe). If social media has allowed one thing is giving viewers a choice of what to watch.
#15315099
QatzelOk wrote:The billboards that you pass in your car every day are a complement to the commercial radio you listen to in the same car every day.

Notice that on the radio, you have three minutes of music (Baby, love, mama!) followed by three minutes of ads that are voiced by people you might like to know... if you weren't always alone in your car.

Mama loves you and wants you to buy the products you hear the voices announce. And you're Mama's baby, so react like a baby with pure emotion please.

The billboards attack you as part of the environment that you "experience" at the same minute of your commute every day. "Enjoy Coca-Cola" is more of a command than a suggestion when you pass it every day at 8:33 am.

They just want to sell you products to make money. People still have free will to make consumer choices, including ignoring ads. Don't let people off the hook so easily, people aren't helpless victims, we all have agency and power of choice.

Some adult humans are like children and compulsively buy products as an emotional response they have trouble controlling. Luckily I don't have this problem, my parents were also very immune and content without purchases. Others have to keep up with the Jones', and live paycheck to paycheck no matter how much money they make. Delaying gratification is a sign of adulthood. Keep the hand out of the cookie jar to avoid spoiling dinner. I don't feel bad for adult children who can't control their emotional impulses. As a kid I wanted so many of the toys they advertised on TV. Then i grew up.
Advertising is used for influence, the final decision is on the individual.

Now your peers also convince you that you need the latest iPhone and a smart watch and a Tesla or an Audi to be cool. I can afford an Audi but I drive a bucket that's old enough to get its own learners permit :lol: We shouldn't seek the validation of others, just be content.

There will always be people who are sheep and easily manipulated. Best not to worry about things you can't control, it's a complete waste of time and energy.
#15315220
Never having read the book or the texts that explain what is about, Unthinking Majority wrote:They just want to sell you products to make money.

Entertainment media wants to sell you more than products, it wants to sell you your entire lifestyle and political system.

But when psychological manipulation is involved, this isn't just selling. Edward Bearnays and Sigmund Freud weren't used car salesmen. They dabbled in human psychological manipulation, and then weaponized this psychological research to sell you "a product that your psyche can't refuse."

People still have free will to make consumer choices, including ignoring ads. Don't let people off the hook so easily, people aren't helpless victims, we all have agency and power of choice.


Some adult humans are like children and compulsively buy products as an emotional response they have trouble controlling.


According to Debord, entertainment media is not simply a market for new ideas. It is a way of controlling people so that they don't have free choice anymore.

Read some of the OP literature to find out more about what Debord wrote before criticizing "a general impression of what this thread might be about, sort of, I guess."
#15315381
wat0n , I think I found a quote that might help both you and Unthinking Majority to understand what exactly Debord means by media being a "regime" that maintains power for a cluster of powerful institutions including organized crime.

Mr_Chow_Mein wrote:...Within one hundred years we have destroyed ourselves.

Look at any movie or screen since television first entered our lives and you can see the training of our minds for short attention.

Look at how many cuts in action from one view to another that is employed within ten seconds…we train the mind for short intervals of attention, turn the tv or screen off and try and relax for a moment, you will start to quickly become agitated, restless and yearning for stimulation…its like a visual drug of dependence....


The "rapid cuts" that the commenter speaks about is related to the faster and faster cuts from one scene to another in movies. This fast-paced scene-changing actually shortens human attention spans and causes psychological distress, and leaves the entertainment-media victim unable to pursue long developed thoughts.

Of course, I disagree with him when he writes: "we have destroyed ourselves." It is more like "we have been destroyed by a technological fad."
#15315389
QatzelOk wrote:wat0n , I think I found a quote that might help both you and Unthinking Majority to understand what exactly Debord means by media being a "regime" that maintains power for a cluster of powerful institutions including organized crime.



The "rapid cuts" that the commenter speaks about is related to the faster and faster cuts from one scene to another in movies. This fast-paced scene-changing actually shortens human attention spans and causes psychological distress, and leaves the entertainment-media victim unable to pursue long developed thoughts.

Of course, I disagree with him when he writes: "we have destroyed ourselves." It is more like "we have been destroyed by a technological fad."

Nobody denies that media is influential, in many ways. Some of it is negative, some positive. At the end of the day, adults are in control of what they choose to expose themselves to in order to entertain themselves. Parents are in control of what media they let their kids be exposed to in the home.

People are being influenced, they aren't being controlled. The problem is that some if not many people don't manage their exposure to media properly, or for their children. Whose fault is that? We all have freedom. Companies have freedom to broadcast, and people have freedom to tune in or not.
#15315397
QatzelOk wrote:wat0n , I think I found a quote that might help both you and Unthinking Majority to understand what exactly Debord means by media being a "regime" that maintains power for a cluster of powerful institutions including organized crime.



The "rapid cuts" that the commenter speaks about is related to the faster and faster cuts from one scene to another in movies. This fast-paced scene-changing actually shortens human attention spans and causes psychological distress, and leaves the entertainment-media victim unable to pursue long developed thoughts.

Of course, I disagree with him when he writes: "we have destroyed ourselves." It is more like "we have been destroyed by a technological fad."


Ok, but much of that is not created by commercial media or at least not the traditional one. Many are just amateur creators (influencers) and some don't even aim to make a living out of it, being lucky if they ever monetize it at all.

That's why social media allows you to watch pretty much anything you want (since it allows you to create pretty much anything you want).
#15315421
Unthinking Majority wrote:...At the end of the day, adults are in control of what they choose to expose themselves to in order to entertain themselves. Parents are in control of what media they let their kids be exposed to in the home...


Yes, and parents were "free" to give their children opium (or not) a century ago. But because they weren't told of the side effects, you could say that parents were "tricked" into giving their children a dangerous drug back then.

Public Health wrote: ...In the 19th century, recreational smokers sought opium for euphoria and relaxation, while parents soothed restless and teething babies with opiate-laced syrups. Women sipped opium tinctures for everything from menstrual cramps to anxiety...

In 1898, The Bayer Co. introduced its new remedy for cough and pain: heroin. Some believed it would prove less addictive than the morphine it was derived from, but reports of heroin addiction soon proved otherwise...


Back then, the general public were NOT informed concerning the side effects of addiction-causing of these well-marketed "cures." Drug dealers then, like now, could just see dollar signs.

We live in the same kind of capitalist system today, and drug dealers (and media dealers) are just as prominent.

***

wat0n wrote:...That's why social media allows you to watch pretty much anything you want (since it allows you to create pretty much anything you want).

Social media is currently under attack by the Media-dealers and Drug-dealers of our system. We are able to view whatever these forces-of-control don't manage to censor, and they are censorring more and more of our content, trying to reappropriate their ability to manipulate us into top-down conformity.

Notice our inability to address the "content" of the book: "We are controlled by media, and media is deployed by organized crime, banksters and the media industry." Instead, we are talking abstractly about human freedom and how much better social media might be.

Quoting Debord, Tom Bunyard wrote:‘Of all those who have quoted from this book in order to acknowledge some importance in it’, he wrote in 1979, ‘I have not seen one up till now who took the risk to say, even briefly, what it was about’.


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In the 1960s, women learned from TV that their role was to stay in the bungalow all day baking cakes and wearing aprons. Anti-depressants were invented for these women a few years later.
#15315760
wat0n wrote:I don't find it surprising mainstream media will attack the competition, this goes both ways as this thread shows, but I don't think social media can be stopped at this point.

Yes, and the Titanic was the ship that God couldn't sink.

Perhaps that ship was intentionally sunk and the iceberg was a "false flag." It's true that a lot of WASP elite were aboard, and that other groups with organized crime characteristics were waiting in the wings.

Guy Debord DOES mention how commercial media is a "mob" operation.
#15315779
wat0n wrote:How do you stop social media, @QatzelOk?

How do you destroy Palestine, wat0n?

If you can do one, you can do the other.

And even if you fail, you will do great harm to the human condition in the process.

When has this ever stopped the controlling elites? :eh:
#15315848
wat0n wrote:So you have no response, like really, how exactly do you get rid of something as ubiquitous as social media?...


The fact that I can't tell you how to destroy social media... doesn't prove that it can't be destroyed.

I also don't know how to destroy the world trade center, or how to bomb Libya to shreds. But someone know how to do it, and did it.

Radio used to be democratic and social media-ish... until it was regulated to what it is today: canned DJ voices and song listings in a loop. Social media is on the hot seat right now, and some great minds are thinking of how to "stop the freedom of expression" in it as we speak...

Guy Debord mentions that "the mafia" are involved, so don't expect them to give up.

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