[Pants-of-dog]

I'd financial success resulting from one's career success is a better indicator of intelligence for the simple reason that you pay to get a diploma, and you get paid for being successful in your career. It's simply a better test when you convinced people to pay you, than when you convinced a business to give you a $200,000 piece of paper.

That would mean that the person getting paid to clean toilets is smarter than an intern engineer, since the former is getting paid while the latter is paying.

Since that is clearly not true in moat circumstances, your argument seems incorrect.

[Cosmo]

That would mean that the person getting paid to clean toilets is smarter than an intern engineer, since the former is getting paid while the latter is paying.

No, it would mean you are deliberately misrepresenting my argument by specifically omitting the fact that I was discussing long-term career financial results, as is obvious from post #15333368.

Since that is clearly not true in moat circumstances, your argument seems incorrect.

Let me know when you're done burning down your strawman.

[Pants-of-dog]

No, it would mean you are deliberately misrepresenting my argument by specifically omitting the fact that I was discussing long-term career financial results, as is obvious from post #15333368.
Let me know when you're done burning down your strawman.

If you are discussing long term financial success, then many tradespeople are far less intelligent than gender studies graduates.

Here in the oil extraction industry, most guys make a ton of money and then spend it all quickly, thereby nullifying any long term success. Meanwhile, people with degrees get jobs with retirement and other benefits that serve them well in the long term.

[Cosmo]

If you are discussing long term financial success, then many tradespeople are far less intelligent than gender studies graduates.

Here in the oil extraction industry, most guys make a ton of money and then spend it all quickly, thereby nullifying any long term success. Meanwhile, people with degrees get jobs with retirement and other benefits that serve them well in the long term.

Looks like bait-and-switch.

[Pants-of-dog]

How is it a bait and switch?

Are you saying that it is a bait and switch because “people with degrees” are not the same as “people with gender studies degrees”?

The idea that gender studies degrees are worthless seems like a stupid stereotype believed by conservatives. There is no reason to treat that as a fact.

[Skinny Bob]

So very crudely speaking we have two choices.

1 We can attempt to make our beliefs conform to reality

2 We can attempt to make reality conform to our beliefs

So Steve Jobs is often given as an example of someone who was successful at the latter. Now some people may argue he wasn't quite so successful when it came to his beliefs about cancer, but overall I think we can give him pretty high marks. Now I don't think many people think that Steve Jobs was stupid. So 1 may be difficult and it really helps to be intelligent, but arguably 2 has an even greater need for intelligence.

I had a personal advantage in understanding this before I saw this video. My father's father was a carpenter. My father went to university, at a time when very few working class boys went to a university. He got a first class honors, when that still really meant something. He got a PHD. But he was a Christian. Later he got another degree in Theology. He was never a priest or a Bishop, but rectors and vicars, not to mention the lay people often felt intellectually intimidated by him. its funny, but this is the irony, highly intelligent people have a huge advantage when it comes to maintaining beliefs that are not true. Super intelligent people really shine, super intelligent people really come into their own when it comes to defending beliefs against overwhelming evidence.

A high IQ, as history shows us, over, and over, and over, again, is no assurance of wisdom.

Therefore, if intelligence and wisdom reside in the same human being, it is a coincidence.

Therefore, intelligence isn't the thing, wisdom is the thing.

We're stuck with our IQ at birth, pretty much. It might vary a little over time. Since I was a teen, I've taken five IQ tests over the course of my 70+ years on this earth, and each time, I scored exactly 120. Not a genius, but not stupid, either. I'm content with what I've been dealt by providence. However, I do not claim to be wise. I suppose we are all equalized at death, so what does it matter?

Anyway, I would say that during one's life, wisdom can be acquired.

No test can measure wisdom because it will vary depending on what you align it with.

If we align it with money, then for the lack of it we could be said to be unwise.

If we align it with happiness, then money may or may not coincide, nor prove we are wise.

For me, wisdom is the pursuit of spiritual consciousness, knowledge, awakening & enlightenment.

But, of course, a little dough in the bank won't hurt, either.

What would you align it with, what would be your metric for 'wisdom'?

And since books have been written about it, then the mere reading of a dictionary definition will not make one wise -- nor will it bestow upon you what is, or isn't, wisdom, 'in my opinion'.