What does conservatism mean to you? - Politics Forum.org | PoFo

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#14816803
What does conservatism mean to you? Not in terms of a definition per se, but in terms of how you relate to it. Is it a worldview that guides you to certain moral conclusions? Is it just a description of a general set of policy positions? Is it merely a reaction against or the negative of liberalism or socialism?
#14816855
It means pretending to be a patriot while trying to stop the majority of you nation getting decent healthcare, it means pretending to love your country while privatising its assets and handing them to foreign millionaires, it means pretending to be pro military while sending young men to die in pointless conflicts fighting people who pose no thereat whatsoever to your country.

In essence the most conservative of all traits is shameless hypocrisy.
#14817139
minivanburen wrote:That's not an especially helpful response.


As Pote said it is 100% accurate, the people who have done the most damage to my country are conservatives. In the past we used to have full employment, we used to be free to tell our bosses to fuck off on Friday and have a new job by Monday, we could earn enough from just one wage to feel a family and buy a home. The workers owned the homes, the electricity network, the gas network, we owned everything of any real importance. People were happy.

What do we have now? Nothing. The conservatives stabbed the whole county in the back and took everything away to give it millionaires in India and in China and in Europe. There is nothing a conservative hates more than his own countrymen, his actions prove it.
#14817367
Decky wrote:As Pote said it is 100% accurate, the people who have done the most damage to my country are conservatives. In the past we used to have full employment, we used to be free to tell our bosses to fuck off on Friday and have a new job by Monday, we could earn enough from just one wage to feel a family and buy a home. The workers owned the homes, the electricity network, the gas network, we owned everything of any real importance. People were happy.

What do we have now? Nothing. The conservatives stabbed the whole county in the back and took everything away to give it millionaires in India and in China and in Europe. There is nothing a conservative hates more than his own countrymen, his actions prove it.


I'm not disputing the merits of conservatism here; as a social democrat I of course find it to be a deplorable ideology. That said, I am interested in how conservatives relate to their ideology--is it a lens through which they view the world, merely a term that connotes a certain set of policies, or something else.
#14817417
Conservatism is to try and preserve old orders and traditions against change, or to take actions "conservatively" or carefully. The problem with this to my understanding is that as more time passes, just what is to be conserved gets confusing. It's usually irritating to people with bad family backgrounds since it is associated with families, although it's completely possible to be a conservative without a family.

Employment changes have to do with changes in technology, they aren't due to there being something fundamentally wrong with conservative outlooks.
#14817427
I doubt conservatism is really an ideology in itself, rather it is an attitude that anyone will take when the values, forms or beliefs that they like are challenged or attacked.

There is hardly anyone more conservative than a radical communist when someone criticises their ancient belief system.
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SolarCross wrote:I doubt conservatism is really an ideology in itself, rather it is an attitude that anyone will take when the values, forms or beliefs that they like are challenged or attacked.

There is hardly anyone more conservative than a radical communist when someone criticises their ancient belief system.


As an outlook perhaps; but in the United States it also refers to a set of policies which, if enacted, would drastically change the way our society works.
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minivanburen wrote:What does conservatism mean to you? Not in terms of a definition per se, but in terms of how you relate to it. Is it a worldview that guides you to certain moral conclusions? Is it just a description of a general set of policy positions? Is it merely a reaction against or the negative of liberalism or socialism?


Of course it depends on the context. "Conservative" dress or decor is something quite different than how sociopolitical conservatism is defined in 21st century America. But assuming that you were thinking of the latter with your question:

To me conservatism is liberty to be who and what you are so long as reasonable law and the rights of others are not violated. It is common sense societies organized and structured to allow both allow reasonable maximum liberty while reflecting the culture and values that a people wishes to have. Again the goal is not acceptance by others but rather the right to have the kind of society we wish to have.

Philosophically it is the ability to change what needs to be changed while preserving that which has served us well as a people. It puts results and consequences as more important than motive or method, and it looks to find what works and discontinue what does not and/or that produces unintended unacceptable consequences.

In America it is appreciation for and ability to know, understand, and learn from our history and the symbols of it, both the good and the bad as well as the value of common language, borders, culture. Conservatism understands that good laws and regulations are necessary for a country and the societies within it but these should be kept to what is absolutely beneficial and necessary to produce an orderly society that respects the rights of all.

And finally it is appreciation for the blood and treasure expended to adopt a Constitution that has produced the most free, most prosperous, more charitable, most beneficial to all nation that has ever existed on Planet Earth, and a belief that such Constitution limited all branches of the federal government to a narrow range of specific responsibilities. Everything above and beyond those responsibilities are unconstitutional.
#14868332
Conservatism to me is about backwards thinking. Just doing the things that ancestors did thousands of years ago and refusing to change. The saying, "If it ain't broke, why fix it?" phrase comes to mind. Having worked for some conservative companies I can say from experience that this type of company is hard for young generations of workers to survive in. Management is often inflexible and stiff, you either follow the old clumsy ways or you get pushed out the door.

The hypocrisy as mentioned in this thread, I agree. I used to be a Christian but once I realized in my teens that they didn't practice what they preached, then I turned away. They can say that honesty is important but if they expect to get away with lying to others, then I just can't get along with those types.
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SolarCross wrote:I doubt conservatism is really an ideology in itself, rather it is an attitude that anyone will take when the values, forms or beliefs that they like are challenged or attacked.

There is hardly anyone more conservative than a radical communist when someone criticises their ancient belief system.

That's more accurately described as being dogmatism .
MistyTiger wrote:The hypocrisy as mentioned in this thread, I agree. I used to be a Christian but once I realized in my teens that they didn't practice what they preached, then I turned away. They can say that honesty is important but if they expect to get away with lying to others, then I just can't get along with those types.
Christianity , as I understand it to be , is supposed to be about who Jesus is , especially in relationship with us humans . Even if imperfect people fall short of the glory of God , it shouldn't reflect upon , or detract from who Jesus is . Stacie Orrico put it best , I think .
I do get though how it can be to be fearful that you're not good enough to continue in God's good graces , only to realize that even those who are supposedly entirely sanctified are disappointing , in how they conduct themselves . I largely grew up in such Holiness churches as the Church of the Nazarene , so I do get where you are coming from , maybe more than most . I just believe that , whether or not Jesus is God , or even if there's a God , should not be dependent upon the character of self declared Christians as a whole . Also , those supposed Christians might not have been sincere in the profession of faith that they made , and were acting out of convenience , rather than conviction . Actions speak louder than words , and as the Bible states , " You shall know them by their fruits " . https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Matthew+7%3A16-20&version=NKJV
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@Deutschmania I believed in Christianity as a child, due to my mom's influence. She read to me and really taught me a lot. My sense of morality is from her and lessons from the Bible. I understand how comforting it can be to feel forgiven for sins and to feel like a deity can heal us. The act of praying can be freeing. I used to pray every week as a kid.

My distancing from Christianity started at 13 and is still going on. It is strange to me to just believe in someone that has never been seen, it cannot be proven that God or Jesus truly existed. I do not dislike religion, I just decided that I wanted to be more openminded and more secular. I also do not want to go to church. If I ever get married it will be outdoors, never in a church. Some churches have a depressing or creepy feel to them.
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MistyTiger wrote:it cannot be proven that God or Jesus truly existed.

It can be shown that Jesus almost certainly didn't exist and that even if there was some particular historical individual behind the myth we know almost nothing about him. Take the story of Judas's betrayal. This is not some story about a historical person called Ioudas or Yehudha, its just a rewriting of the story of Judah son of Jacob, selling his brother into slavery.
#15075811
Trump supporters, waving Confederate flags, yelling, "USA USA USA!", while defacing pictures of Greta Thunberg with the word 'OIL'.

:|

That's Conservativism, today.
#15075812
minivanburen wrote:What does conservatism mean to you? Not in terms of a definition per se, but in terms of how you relate to it. Is it a worldview that guides you to certain moral conclusions? Is it just a description of a general set of policy positions? Is it merely a reaction against or the negative of liberalism or socialism?


Conservatism is the ying to the progressive's yang. 2 sides of the same coin, neither better nor worse than the other generally. It's like saying cold is better than hot. Some people prefer a cold room, some people prefer a hot room. Sometimes cool or warm is nice, but I prefer it room temperature mostly, relatively balanced. Too far on the extremes and people start to die.
#15075816
Godstud wrote:Trump supporters, waving Confederate flags, yelling, "USA USA USA!", while defacing pictures of Greta Thunberg with the word 'OIL'.

:|

That's Conservativism, today.


Yes you're right. And people post pictures of them holding Trump's decapitated head, they want safe spaces and trigger-warnings, and anyone who doesn't comply with their views censored and banned. That's today's progressiveness. Neither progressives nor conservatives are better than the other, both filled with enough nutters.

I would know, i've been both a progressive and a conservative in my life. 2 sides of the same coin. What they both lack is empathy to the opposing side, almost always. They're both blind. If you're standing on the edge of the coin you can see both sides, but if you're on one side or the other you can't see the other side at all.
#15075818
One comedian made a joke in extremely bad taste(panned by EVERYONE). Only a small number are nutters, but on the other hand, you have tens of millions of Trump supporters(the new strain of conservatives).

Did I mention them driving cars thru protesters and killing them? Carrying torches and yelling racist slogans?

The current strain of conservativism isn't a reflection of the progressivism and doubt you've EVER been progressive! I call BULLSHIT, @Unthinking Majority !!
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