My reflections on 2020 AD - Page 8 - Politics Forum.org | PoFo

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#15125778
Some thoughts on the 2020 US Presidential Election.

President Trump is going to win the election, but more importantly, VP Biden is going to lose, him and Harris. No Liberal will understand why either, absolutely guaranteed.

How Pence is treated by the Establishment Media after his debate with Harris tonight is either going to confirm or end a suspicion of mine about his role in the future, if any. Tonight will tell me, if my gut instinct is right or if my head is, about VP Pence's treatment by the media after the debate.

Pence is a better man than Trump, by almost anyone's estimation, although Trump is a great President just for winning in 2016, just as Obama was a great President because he in 2008 denied the White House to Hillary Clinton.
#15125796
annatar1914 wrote:Some thoughts on the 2020 US Presidential Election.

President Trump is going to win the election, but more importantly, VP Biden is going to lose, him and Harris. No Liberal will understand why either, absolutely guaranteed.

How Pence is treated by the Establishment Media after his debate with Harris tonight is either going to confirm or end a suspicion of mine about his role in the future, if any. Tonight will tell me, if my gut instinct is right or if my head is, about VP Pence's treatment by the media after the debate.

Pence is a better man than Trump, by almost anyone's estimation, although Trump is a great President just for winning in 2016, just as Obama was a great President because he in 2008 denied the White House to Hillary Clinton.


In making a post like this one, one might wonder if I actually am a ''conservative'' and not a ''socialist'', right?

Wrong. In objectively and dispassionately looking at the political situation, it's clear to me that both ''Conservatives'' and ''Liberals'' in the United States are headed for a fall. But if the Liberals fall, the ''fake left'' falls, then there is the opportunity for a new political movement to arise in this country; not opposed to the family, to faith, but genuinely interested in representing the workers both urban and rural in America.

Trump with his Nationalism and Anti-Globalism and Populism, will force his opposition to respond to the needs of real people as people universally, not divided by Identity Politics. That is, if they want to win and without deranged fantasies of secession and civil war.
#15125844
annatar1914 wrote:
How Pence is treated by the Establishment Media after his debate with Harris tonight is either going to confirm or end a suspicion of mine about his role in the future, if any. Tonight will tell me, if my gut instinct is right or if my head is, about VP Pence's treatment by the media after the debate.



President Trump is going to win the 2020 Presidential election. Vice-President Pence.... My ''gut instinct'' about tonight's Vice-Presidential Debate has proven certain things to me.
#15125848
annatar1914 wrote:President Trump is going to win the 2020 Presidential election. Vice-President Pence.... My ''gut instinct'' about tonight's Vice-Presidential Debate has proven certain things to me.


My dear Annatar, I think you are right about both the liberals and the conservatives are headed for a fall.

But, the reality is that having bad leadership for a very long time destroys nations Annatar.

I think you are out of sync with the current crop of value system people in the USA political system.

I say again, put your energies into staying true to your own ethical standards and don't waste time expecting change from those unwilling to work on themselves and change.

You are a good man. In the end? That is all that counts in this world. How faithful you are to yourself and your own value system.

No one is perfect. Work on what you can do to make yourself improve every day.

I am happy with my choices. That is very important.

I don't know who is going to win Annatar. But Biden was chosen with a lot of false manipulations. Trump is a terrible human being. And he has a lot of mundane power that he should not have.

Things are going to go into an overdrive crisis.

But good things come from crisis in human history.
#15125875
@Tainari88 , they are both headed for a fall, the ''Liberals'' and the ''conservatives'', because they cannot see the crisis is of their own making. I'm hopeful though that there are enough people out there with wiser heads who can step back from the brink.
#15125883
annatar1914 wrote:@Tainari88 , they are both headed for a fall, the ''Liberals'' and the ''conservatives'', because they cannot see the crisis is of their own making. I'm hopeful though that there are enough people out there with wiser heads who can step back from the brink.


Annatar, you have to realize and you know it as a man with experiences? Consequences are baked in to every important decision you make or don't make in this world. You can live in denial but the consequence is going to have to snap you out of it. The USA gov't is going to have consequences due to the low quality of leadership that they engage in.
#15126010
Tainari88 wrote:Annatar, you have to realize and you know it as a man with experiences? Consequences are baked in to every important decision you make or don't make in this world. You can live in denial but the consequence is going to have to snap you out of it. The USA gov't is going to have consequences due to the low quality of leadership that they engage in.


@Tainari88

New socio-economic orders are not built in a vaccuum, they experience failures, fits and starts, and are modified by human nature and all the other intangibles involved. I take some comfort in that maybe ironically, because all that we are fussing and fighting about now will be looked back at in incomprehension... Just as we look back at the ancient and medieval times with their slavery and serfdom.

Now, my point about that is this; we look back at history and see who we think the good leaders are and we divorce them to some extent from the political and socio-economic system they were a part of. We also tend to look at them more objectively the further back in time we are from them.

Chou En Lai if I remember correctly was asked once about what he thought of the French Revolution, to which he replied; ''it's too early to tell''.

I saw the hand of Divine Providence in human affairs in America twice for sure; in 2008 when Barack Obama beat Hillary Clinton, and in 2016 when Donald Trump beat Hillary Clinton. Both men have shaped America in important ways, and are closer politically than the media and their own words would suggest; Barack Obama a ''political outsider'' from the Liberal end of the spectrum but who used Populist and Nationalist tropes, who was nonetheless groomed to an extent for the US Presidency, and Donald Trump, who was also a ''political outsider'' who uses Populist and Nationalist tropes and who was groomed to an extent for the US Presidency as well.

I look back, and there's not really much of a difference. The political system in place is far sturdier than media hysteria would have us believe.
#15129818
One of the political events that particularly struck me in 2020 on a spiritual level, that made me reflect in a spiritual way on the ''Kairos'', the spirit of the times we live in, was the drone strike that killed Iranian General Suleimani and others this past year.

Drone strikes have often been justified by their targets position as a terrorist by some, but leaving the morality of that aside, General Suleimani was a uniformed officer of a military organization, a government representative of a country with which the United States is not legally and formally at war with.

So now, the United States can target government officials of other countries with drone strikes and other military options, and this is not in itself to be considered an formal act of war not necessitating a formal declaration of such a state of conflict?

And then there are my moral qualms about things like snipers and modern long distance push-button warfare, like something out of a video game of extreme violence at a distance however, that people are already heavily desensitized to.

I have a problem with that, despite any objection some American ''Conservative'' might make for example. I feel that it was dishonorable, and invites retaliation in kind at some point.

The West is dangerously close to turning into a bunch of vicious and stupid cowards. That more than anything else has informed my thinking ever since this year, like a irritating pebble in one's shoe that one can't seem to get out. We in the West just don't seem to understand really, or to even want to.
#15129849
annatar1914 wrote:One of the political events that particularly struck me in 2020 on a spiritual level, that made me reflect in a spiritual way on the ''Kairos'', the spirit of the times we live in, was the drone strike that killed Iranian General Suleimani and others this past year.

Drone strikes have often been justified by their targets position as a terrorist by some, but leaving the morality of that aside, General Suleimani was a uniformed officer of a military organization, a government representative of a country with which the United States is not legally and formally at war with.

So now, the United States can target government officials of other countries with drone strikes and other military options, and this is not in itself to be considered an formal act of war not necessitating a formal declaration of such a state of conflict?

And then there are my moral qualms about things like snipers and modern long distance push-button warfare, like something out of a video game of extreme violence at a distance however, that people are already heavily desensitized to.

I have a problem with that, despite any objection some American ''Conservative'' might make for example. I feel that it was dishonorable, and invites retaliation in kind at some point.

The West is dangerously close to turning into a bunch of vicious and stupid cowards. That more than anything else has informed my thinking ever since this year, like a irritating pebble in one's shoe that one can't seem to get out. We in the West just don't seem to understand really, or to even want to.

We live in a corrupted and degenerate society, @annatar1914. Decades of Cold War propaganda have rendered most people indifferent to any meaningful political issues, rather than the staged fakery of what passes for 'politics' in the USA and Europe now. Real politics is happening in places like Mexico, Bolivia, Iran or Hong Kong. Not here.

And 'homo economicus' has replaced humanity created in the image of God. Our social being has been and is continually being replaced by the rational self-interested calculations of a collection of alienated, atomised individuals. And our alienation even extends to an alienation from reality itself. We use machines to do our killing for us at a safe distance, while we passively observe it like a video game.
#15129887
Potemkin wrote:We live in a corrupted and degenerate society, @annatar1914. Decades of Cold War propaganda have rendered most people indifferent to any meaningful political issues, rather than the staged fakery of what passes for 'politics' in the USA and Europe now. Real politics is happening in places like Mexico, Bolivia, Iran or Hong Kong. Not here.

And 'homo economicus' has replaced humanity created in the image of God. Our social being has been and is continually being replaced by the rational self-interested calculations of a collection of alienated, atomised individuals. And our alienation even extends to an alienation from reality itself. We use machines to do our killing for us at a safe distance, while we passively observe it like a video game.


I agree wholeheartedly @Potemkin , it was this event, the state-sanctioned murder of a uniformed government official of an formally non-belligerent country, that impressed upon me even more the very truths which you have laid out.

But actual war is not a video game. Nor will it be played out as one either, when it comes. People will be forced to face reality then.
#15129888
annatar1914 wrote:I agree wholeheartedly @Potemkin , it was this event, the state-sanctioned murder of a uniformed government official of an formally non-belligerent country, that impressed upon me even more the very truths which you have laid out.

But actual war is not a video game. Nor will it be played out as one either, when it comes. People will be forced to face reality then.

Indeed they will, @annatar1914. And they're not going to like it. Not one little bit.
#15129911
Potemkin wrote:Indeed they will, @annatar1914. And they're not going to like it. Not one little bit.


@Potemkin

This is why the phrase ''Socialism or Barbarism'' resonates so much with me this year. Biden will have us in war all over the place, Trump will likely not unless all his preparations have been to have war with Iran at last, or worse....

Nations that are Socialist have little reason to go on offensive wars in this era, they have an autarky that militates against it. Whereas with Capitalism, war is the answer, the ultimate answer, to all it's problems.
#15129923
annatar1914 wrote:@Potemkin

This is why the phrase ''Socialism or Barbarism'' resonates so much with me this year. Biden will have us in war all over the place, Trump will likely not unless all his preparations have been to have war with Iran at last, or worse....

Nations that are Socialist have little reason to go on offensive wars in this era, they have an autarky that militates against it. Whereas with Capitalism, war is the answer, the ultimate answer, to all it's problems.

Which is precisely why the ruling elite of the USA are almost all mad keen on fighting as many wars as possible, in as many far-flung parts of the globe as possible. The Founding Fathers would have been horrified by this development; they specifically warned the American people against getting involved in "foreign entanglements". But America's political elite are being driven by the capitalist system itself to wage unending war everywhere, because capitalism poses a question which only war can answer. This process got started with the USA's sudden burst of imperialist expansion at the turn of the 20th century, and has been accelerating ever since.
#15129926
late wrote:Wars cost money, and we are in fairly deep financial doodoo...

Sorry if I dumped all over your fantasy.

Wars cost the ordinary working people money, not to mention their health, sanity or lives. But wars cost the ruling elite nothing.
By late
#15129928
Potemkin wrote:
Wars cost the ordinary working people money, not to mention their health, sanity or lives. But wars cost the ruling elite nothing.



Again, enjoy the fantasy.
#15129932
Potemkin wrote:Which is precisely why the ruling elite of the USA are almost all mad keen on fighting as many wars as possible, in as many far-flung parts of the globe as possible. The Founding Fathers would have been horrified by this development; they specifically warned the American people against getting involved in "foreign entanglements". But America's political elite are being driven by the capitalist system itself to wage unending war everywhere, because capitalism poses a question which only war can answer. This process got started with the USA's sudden burst of imperialist expansion at the turn of the 20th century, and has been accelerating ever since.


Precisely so. Which is why militaristic empires wind up getting taken down by coalitions of enemies, like the Assyrian Empire was crushed by the alliance of the Scythians, Medes, and the Babylonians.
#15129945
annatar1914 wrote:Precisely so. Which is why militaristic empires wind up getting taken down by coalitions of enemies, like the Assyrian Empire was crushed by the alliance of the Scythians, Medes, and the Babylonians.

Indeed. The Assyrian Empire lasted for more than 700 years, but in retrospect its fall was inevitable. They spent those seven centuries racing around their empire suppressing rebellion after rebellion. It was only a matter of time before one or more of those rebellions succeeded, or before their many, many enemies put aside their own differences and united against them. What makes the Americans think the same cannot happen to them one day...?
#15129947
Potemkin wrote:Indeed. The Assyrian Empire lasted for more than 700 years, but in retrospect its fall was inevitable. They spent those seven centuries racing around their empire suppressing rebellion after rebellion. It was only a matter of time before one or more of those rebellions succeeded, or before their many, many enemies put aside their own differences and united against them. What makes the Americans think the same cannot happen to them one day...?



''Then saith Jesus to him, Return thy sword to its place; for all who take the sword shall perish by the sword.''


Militarism ends in military defeat, eventually.

''But America is exceptional and unique, and outside the laws of history'' :excited:
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