Official SN-RF Party Thread (Members Only) - Page 4 - Politics Forum.org | PoFo

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User avatar
By ingliz
#1900729
I too believe we should allow our MP's the freedom to vote their conscience otherwise what was the point of these last few weeks.

The portfolios will need tweaking but I see no need to start again.

Vera:

Yes comrade; Welcome to the party. Your vote will ensure our 10th seat.

Any policy area you are interested in? We lack financial expertise, hint, hint.
User avatar
By HoniSoit
#1900730
This is the list:

List wrote:Treasurer - Brio (RF)
Legal Affairs - Spokesperson Subversive Rob (SN), MistyTiger (SN), & albionfagan (RF)
Defence - Spokesperson Konulu (RF) & FallenRaptor (SN)
Education - Spokesperson Red Star (RF), Le Rouge (SN), & Potemkin (SN)
Labour and Union Affairs - Spokesperson ingliz (RF), Vlad (SN), & Holt (SN)
Environment - Spokesperson TIG (SN)
Trade and Finance - Spokesperson Vlad (SN)
Foreign Affairs - Spokesperson HoniSoit (RF) & Red Army (SN)
Home Affairs - Spokesperson FallenRaptor (SN) & ingliz (RF)
Culture and the Arts - Spokesperson Potemkin (SN) & Brio (RF)
Health - Spokesperson Zyx (SN) & MistyTiger (SN)
Agriculture - Spokesperson psyche (RF), Le Rouge (SN) & Mazhi (SN)


Kon has since dropped out of the game and psyche hasn't voted yet. :hmm:
User avatar
By Subversive Rob
#1900734
Not sure I agree with the idea that every MP should be able to vote with their conscience. Firstly, I don't think that we've had a thorough enough vetting procedure for that to be a good idea, there may well be people with some odd ideas on some things. Secondly, this is not the same thing as bloc voting. It was always said that a party could vote on bloc provided each individual MP cast the vote individually. The constitution and the GM have (rightly) nothing to say about internal party procedure. The problem was that a party with no active base could still dominate proceedings. If we embraced some form of democratic centralism (freedom in criticism, unity in action) this really wouldn't be the same thing as bloc voting. This also brings up the point that this would actually encourage non-MPs to participate. If, ultimately, an MP could just do whatever, what is the point of the party apparatus outside of those MPs?

I think we have to talk a little bit less flippantly about the relationship of MPs to the party, its members and the party programme, as well as working out what - if any - mechanisms we want for party discipline and - ultimately - expulsion.
User avatar
By ingliz
#1900735
We have 10 seats, and barring surprises, we will be a government. Do you want me to tweak the package?
Last edited by ingliz on 09 May 2009 14:45, edited 1 time in total.
User avatar
By HoniSoit
#1900736
Rob - I hear what you're saying. Like I said, unity in action is very desirable but it shouldn't be forced. I think we could often reach some kind of consensus through free and open discussion, and if still some MPs would like to dissent they should be able to vote with their conscience.

ingliz - yes, please. I think we have about enough MPs to staff most ministries.
User avatar
By Subversive Rob
#1900737
if still some MPs would like to dissent they should be able to vote with their conscience.


On every issue? With no possibility of sanctions? If that's the case I really think we have to be very careful about who we let on board as an MP. Given things are going to be balanced on a knife edge (the right is still going to be big and I think we may have irrevocably damaged our relationship with the THP) there may be issues in which have to be sure we can count on people).
By psyche
#1900743
Gosh, don't you guys know it's a busy time down on the farm! My secretary got all your PMs, thanks. I'll vote in a minute or two!
User avatar
By ingliz
#1900744
Treasurer - Albionfagan (RF)

Legal Affairs - Subversive Rob (SN)

Defence - ingliz (RF)

Education, Culture and the Arts - Potemkin (SN)

Labour and Union Affairs - Holt (SN)

Agriculture & the Environment -Gletkin (RF)

Trade and Finance - Vlad (SN)

Foreign Affairs - HoniSoit (RF)

Home Affairs - FallenRaptor (SN)

Health - MistyTiger (SN)
Last edited by ingliz on 09 May 2009 19:07, edited 1 time in total.
User avatar
By HoniSoit
#1900745
Rob wrote:On every issue? With no possibility of sanctions?


Obviously on issues where one or two vote can tip the balance, we need to work really hard to persuade our members; but more often than not, I believe people would clearly perceive the situation and make appropriate decision.

The nomination for MPs so far looks impressive. I don't think we need to worry about our/their judgement.

Rob wrote:I think we may have irrevocably damaged our relationship with the THP


To be more precise, they voted to terminate the alliance without consulting the SN-RF. We didn't damage the relationship; some in the THP did.

And don't forget the SLD. It's possible to work with them on certain issues.
User avatar
By HoniSoit
#1900747
psyche wrote:Gosh, don't you guys know it's a busy time down on the farm! My secretary got all your PMs, thanks. I'll vote in a minute or two!


:lol:

No problem. You didn't abandon us after all. ;)

ingliz - thanks for that. I won't take a ministry and also perhaps we should still include people who want to help with certain portfolio as part of the civilian bureaucracy.
User avatar
By ingliz
#1900748
I think we may have irrevocably damaged our relationship with the THP

What relationship?


ps.Honi you will have to take something
Last edited by ingliz on 09 May 2009 15:09, edited 2 times in total.
User avatar
By ingliz
#1900752
Or do you want me in charge of Foreign Affairs? ;)
User avatar
By Subversive Rob
#1900754
I'm thinking more of the future I guess, particularly as there may be some opportunists who see membership of the RF-SN as the route to power.

I think we need to acknowledge some of the responsibility for the THP situation. Firstly, I get the impression that they weren't really consulted when our minority coalition attempted to assume power. Secondly, I think post the split, we have perhaps behaved more acrimoniously than we should have. Given the increased size of the right, and the complete implosion of the SLD vote, we really have to be a lot more constructive with the THP.
By psyche
#1900755

No problem. I thought you abandoned us. ;)


You should work on those abandonment issues, Honi dear. ;)
Last edited by psyche on 09 May 2009 20:22, edited 1 time in total.
User avatar
By ingliz
#1900757
Firstly, I get the impression that they weren't really consulted when our minority coalition attempted to assume power

They were very well informed as was the whole board.
User avatar
By HoniSoit
#1900758
Rob - I basically agree with your assessment. I wouldn't rule out future cooperation with THP; but alliance is not really being considered.
User avatar
By Subversive Rob
#1900760
But as allies, or potential allies, I think we should have given them a bit more consideration than the rest of the board. I'm not trying to point fingers, because that would be pointless, I just think we have to acknowledge some responsibility here if we want to move forward. Otherwise, we will have to rely solely on the SLD, who may be going in a better direction but still probably have members quite far to the right of us.
User avatar
By ingliz
#1900762
SR:

particularly as there may be some opportunists who see membership of the RF-SN as the route to power.

The whole point of being a member of a parliamentary party is "power"; the whole point of being a member of a political party is to gain "power" for your parliamentary party. I would be very disappointed if the members of my party did not want "power" as in any bourgeois parliamentary system having "power" is the only way to get anything done, the opposition merely opposes.

The THP - How do you come to the conclusion they are a left wing party? As plainly they are not given their willingness to jump into bed with the PNL, the CA, the LC, and the PoP. :lol:


OK,

We have 10 seats, maybe 11, and Subversive Rob wishes to vet our proposed MP's.

First we need to find the most active as there is no point in having MP's if they are not sitting.

The Party list:

#1 Honi, Party Leader (RF) - Seated

#2 Subversive Rob(SN) - Seated

#3 ingliz(RF) - Seated

#4 Potemkin(SN) - Seated

#5 FallenRaptor(SN) - Seated

#6 Gletkin(RF) - Seated

#7 Vlad(SN) - Seated

#8 MistyTiger(SN) - Seated

#9 Albionfagan(RF) - Seated

#10 Holt(SN) - Seated

#11 Mazhi(SN)


Let's go through the list as it stands and see if there are any members who cannot fulfil their duties by reason of their inactivity.
User avatar
By ingliz
#1900905
The maritime policy is in the worker's group, look for it there. As to the rest you will have to wait as I have only just taken over this portfolio from a member who is currently indisposed.
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