[Sephardi]

Current numbers say that a coalition of SLD, PUC, and PNL will not have enough seats. A Blue and Orange Coalition of SLD, PUC, PNL and CA will have enough seats to create a government. I thought we needed to start a thread about a Blue and Orange Coalition so we can talk it out. PNL and the PUC are alright with the CA and the SLD and PUC is alright the PNL. The CA and SLD are the only two parties of the coalition that need to straighten things out with each other before a Blue and Orange Coalition can take place.

[Karl_Bonner_1982]

I imagine that taxes, welfare, health care, union rights and income distribution are all going to be hot issues between the SLD and the CA, am I wrong?

Where did the centre-centre-left's majority go to? Was it drawn off into the THP?

This is not going to be easy. The SLD and CA are sufficiently far apart on economics that no middle-of-the-road compromise will come especially close to both parties' constituencies. If we're really going to go blue-orange, though, then I'd like to know who is in charge of the CA's economic policymaking so we can have some important discussions.

[Sephardi]

This is not going to be easy. The SLD and CA are sufficiently far apart on economics that no middle-of-the-road compromise will come especially close to both parties' constituencies. If we're really going to go blue-orange, though, then I'd like to know who is in charge of the CA's economic policymaking so we can have some important discussions.

Dan is the chairman. We are going to have to come to some sort of agreement because this looks like the only coalition that can happen if the Fascists, Libertarians, and Marxists are not going to be involved. It's a coalition of the moderate parties.

I'm sure the CA can make some concessions. I want to review the economic policy of the SLD for now.

[Gnote]

It appears to me that virtually every single component of the CA platform violates the SLD's fundamental principles of Opportunity, Well-being, Freedom, and Stewardship.

[Sephardi]

Opportunity, Well-being, Freedom, and Stewardship.

?

Most of the SLD's platform goes against Opportunity and Freedom. That's Libertarian turf. Best not get lost in it.

Tell me what you think we should change.

[Gnote]

Libertarian philosophy is strictly in opposition to Freedom and Opportunity, as appropriately defined by the SLD.

The cornerstone of CA economic policy is a flat tax. This flies in the face of all four of the SLDs fundamental principles.

[Sephardi]

The cornerstone of CA economic policy is a flat tax. This flies in the face of all four of the SLDs fundamental principles.

Maybe you shouldn't punish people for doing something good?

Anyways, not to be a Political Compass Whore, but are you really over -8 in economics? This seems a little socialist instead of Center-Left.

[NYYS]

The SLD's opposition to economic growth, innovation and technological advancement runs directly counter to the CA's platform. I will not sit with the SLD without some significant changes to their economic policy as I have no desire to see our nation exist in 2009 forever.

[Gnote]

I think you should read the SLD platform, and interpret our political position from the content, rather than accept attempts to broadly pigeon-hole us into the 'centre-left', or any other position along the spectrum.

I will not be supporting any political parties, or coalition thereof, that fail to support (let alone oppose) the four fundamental pillars of the SLD.

The CA positions on tax policy, health care, and education are completely, 100% unacceptable.

[dilpill]

I too refuse to be in a coalition with the CA.

[Sephardi]

A Black And Blue Coalition is still in the realm of possibility. Don't make us go there SLD.

And your policies go against Natural Rights, Freedom, and Opportunity. You're basically a big government faux-liberal party.

[Karl_Bonner_1982]

The SLD's opposition to economic growth, innovation and technological advancement runs directly counter to the CA's platform. I will not sit with the SLD without some significant changes to their economic policy as I have no desire to see our nation exist in 2009 forever.

Just hat is it about the SLD economic proposals that you think are going to bring economic growth and technology to a halt? Please be somewhat specific.

[Fasces]

The CA shares little with the SLD. They disagree economically, and socially. At least the PoP shares economic, health, and environmental platforms with the SLD.

[Gnote]

And your policies go against Natural Rights

Why would our policies support a concept derived from mysticism?

Freedom

We have simply taken a more accurate, practical, realistic definition of freedom.

Opportunity.

Opportunity, in a society influenced by the SDL, is not restricted to the wealthy.

[Dave]

Why would our policies support a concept derived from mysticism?

So does that mean you guys oppose humanism?

[NYYS]

Where is the most recent version of the SLD's platform? I've followed along a little bit and I just read one in your main thread, but am not sure if that's the most recent. It wasn't as ridiculous as I expected it to be, there is a chance we can work together.

Frankly, it might end up being better if Gnote and I stay out of any negotiations between our two parties and simply agree to go along with whatever comes out of it (if we do have a mutual desire to marginalize the far left). We both represent the economic extremes of our parties, it's very, very unlikely we're going to be able to create a coalition with Gnote and I helming the discussion, especially wrt economics.

[Gnote]

Frankly, if one extreme is to hold power, I would much prefer it were the left than the right, in this arrangement.

The working version of SLD Party Platform:

The Party’s stance

The Social Liberal Democrat Party (SLD) sees itself as a party of social liberalism and social democracy.
We consider liberty and equality to be the defining aims of our policies, represented by an emphasis on personal freedom, as well as social, economic and environmental justice. We believe in both positive and negative freedom for the individual, in the value of social cohesion. The SLD stands for freedom of speech, rule of law, a transparent system of government and liberal democracy as defined by the thinkers of the Age of Enlightenment. Our basis of a legitimate political order and civil society is a social contract with the sovereignty in the hands of the people. We believe in upholding the constitution, in democratic representation of the people and in a government that governs by reason and duty.

The state itself should only be the instrument of the community, it should assume no power which conflicts the fundamental rights of the citizens and with the conditions essential for a responsible and creative life, we do however support the Rawlsian concept of minimax: maximising the welfare of those who are least well-off. Thus, we do not oppose all inequality, but insist that any inequality must be to the benefit of those at the bottom.

Social Liberal Democrats strive to facilitate, for all citizens, four characteristics that we believe comprise the highest possible quality of life: Opportunity, Well-being, Freedom, and Stewardship. These foundational pillars, while interconnected and not mutually exclusive, serve as the strategic goals of our party, and the framework around which we craft our economic, social, foreign, and environmental policy.

Opportunity. Social Liberal Democrats believe all citizens should have a reasonable opportunity to craft their life as they desire. Current realities the world over are not designed to ensure this sort of opportunity for all citizens. While we do not believe that equality of economic outcome is realistic, we strive to place all citizens in a position from which they can reasonably expect upward social mobility, if that is what they desire.

Well-being. Social Liberal Democrats believe that citizens have a right to define individual progress on their own terms, and strive for that individual progress in kind. As such, a society influenced by Social Liberal Democratic public policy will facilitate and promote spiritual, social, cultural, and community growth in conjunction with economic growth, rather than as secondary priorities.

Freedom. Social Liberal Democrats believe a properly functioning society requires personal freedoms. Social Liberal Democratic public policy will seek to optimize the balance between one’s freedom to act as one desires with one’s freedom from the negative repercussions that may result from the actions of other citizens.

Stewardship. Social Liberal Democrats believe every society has a responsibility to respect the broader world. Social Liberal Democratic public policy will therefore seek to minimize the negative impact that our society’s activities have on the rest of the world, and, where possible, maintain a steady, positive presence in environmental and foreign affairs.


Economic policy

The SLD is a party that endorses the neoclassical synthesis: the combination of Keynesian macroeconomic thought and neoclassical microeconomics.
We believe in economic freedom, we oppose any violation of it – whether by the state or by private monopolies, cartels and trusts.

Minimum wage: In our opinion, a minimum wage should be pegged to inflation, so as to avoid covertly reducing everyone's wages. We would also consider a guaranteed minimum income as a replacement for minimum wage and welfare to increase the standard of living for the poorest and most vulnerable members of society.

Welfare: The SLD favours a welfare state; however this welfare state should not encourage laziness and unproductivity but rather aid the community and the working class. We believe that this continuous betterment of the conditions of the working class is essential to a more just and equal society. We are in favour of replacing the welfare system with a guaranteed minimum income, so as to eliminate the "welfare trap" which prevents people from seeking jobs.

Banking: The SLD believes in more strict regulation and better oversight of the banking sector and implementing policies which encourage long-term investment over short-term speculation.

Taxes: We generally support a progressive tax regime. This can include a graduated income tax, a negative income tax, capital gains tax, and/or a land value tax. We also support certain pigouvian taxes, particularly with an environmental focus, such as a carbon tax or cap-and-trade.

Nationalisation: We admit state ownership only to a certain degree and only when private ownership has failed. It should only be used as a last resort when there is no other option available, if however this scenario were to happen we believe the state should act swiftly and without hesitation.

Monetary policy: The SLD favours a Keynesian monetary system.

Fiscal Policy: We endorse Keynesian spending measures to control the boom-bust cycle.

Unions: We stand by the unions in their right to organize for better wages and working conditions.


Environment

Sustainability: We seek to live peacefully with our environment, and will actively support policies which conserve the environment and make business and society more sustainable.

Tax Incentives for Carbon Neutral actions by private companies: Lower taxes for carbon neutral companies and Lower even more for those who are further pro-active in environmental protection and pollution depletion.

Tax Incentives for the promotion of Green Energy Products: Lower taxes on in a Green Energy Industry to allow private business to expand in this area and offer individuals to purchase green energy products such as solar panels, water tanks to re-use water and so forth at a cheaper rate.

Phasing out of Coal Power: Phase out of coal power stations to switch to Wind and Solar. Wind farms to be created in conjunction with communities and private industry both on land and offshore.

Recycling: Recycling should either be encouraged by lowering of taxes or made into law through legislation that would stop other practices - the promotion of recycled paper in both industry for printing documents and toilet paper.

Forestry: All forestry must be sustainable. This may take the form of tree-farming however areas that are subject to plantations must not be one-crop zones as this may deem the area unusable for other crops at another time. Old Growth Forests, Rainforests and areas deemed National Parks are protected from any form of forestry and logging.

Agriculture: Depending on climate and water, suitable farming must be promoted. For instance, if a region has less water, agricultural products such as rice and cotton should be opposed in some way, whether through legislation or higher taxes on that product if grown in such areas. Similarly agricultural areas must meet sustainabilty standards which ensure any type of farming or crop growth does do lasting damage to the land. All areas deemed to be Protective Forest must not be destroyed for farming practices, especially to ensure salinity levels remain low to improve farming.


Healthcare

Universal Healthcare: We believe that for the nation to be strong and successful, its people must be healthy. We believe that taxes should be distributed towards a high-tech and professional health system where everyone may enjoy its benefit.

Private Healthcare: While universal, the SLD believe that individuals should also have the option to choose their own health care policies and therefore in conjunction with the state-run, quality healthcare system, we believe that private operators have the right to create and run their own hospitals and health care policies. Privately run hospitals and policies however have zero input from the state-run system and patients would not benefit from certain measures that are within the state-run system.

Free Coverage: The SLD believe that all General Practice appointments and necessary surgery and time in hospital should come free of extra charges to the user other than their tax payments. However, the cost of medicines stemming from treatment will cost the patient an amount of money. For those living on a Low Income, the cost of medicines will be completely subsidised by the Government and be free of charge to the end user through a Low Income Health Care Card system. All domestic students from K-12 and Tertiary will also benefit from this. For those earning a regular wage, the Government will subsidise the cost of medicines 50 cents in the dollar, equating to half-price medicine for Middle Income earners. The SLD believe that High Income earners should pay the full price for medicine. However, a certain amount of medicines which may be deemed crucial yet high in cost to the end user will be placed on a Pharmaceutical Benefits Scheme or PBS, in which case these medicines are completely free of charge to the end user.

Subsidies: The SLD believe that this system of government subsidies is more beneficial to the advancement of medicine technology and creation than a system that would remove the incentive of investment in the pharmaceutical industry through a removal of patents. However, the SLD are opposed to pharmaceutical companies expunging large amounts of money from government and the citizenry for their healthcare and therefore believe that a patent of 8 years be implemented as a middle ground position. After this 8 year period other companies are free to make the same medicines to ensure a cheaper cost for the end user and government.

Elective Surgery: Elective surgery (surgery that is not necessary for a basic quality of life) is not subsidised by government. This includes cosmetic surgery. Citizens can get these procedures completed at state-run hospitals but they will incur the full cost of the procedure. Individuals may see a payment plan with a private healthcare operator as beneficial in these instances.


Education

Public Education: Education is the foundation of society and the crucial component for the advancement and long term security of the nation in a globalised world. The SLD believe that every child has the right to an equal opportunity to attain their own personal goals in life and to that end the SLD believe in a national system of state-run education that is free of charge for the end user from K-12.

School Choice: The SLD believe that the state-run system should be optimal for the majority of students, however the SLD also understand that some families may prefer a private system education due to the needs of their child or faith. To that end the SLD believe that secular charter schools and privately run faith-based schools may also operate within the education system. However, where charter schools are eligible for funds from Government, faith-based schools are not, due to the SLD’s strong commitment to a separation of church and state. All schools within the education system must also base their curriculum off the national system however they may also have minimal changes where necessary as long as it is compatible with the national curriculum.

Tertiary Education: The SLD believe that tertiary education is crucial to the advancement of the nation and its citizenry. To that end the SLD aim to put in place a system of free tertiary education for all of its citizens. This includes both traditional tertiary education providers such as universities as well as trade schools. However, every student, to attain entry into an institution must complete within their high school education a set number of hours of work within a community organisation that has some relation to the course they wish to study at a tertiary level. Successful completion of this community involvement in addition to final year scores in Secondary Education determine a student’s entry into Tertiary education.

[Dr House]

Frankly, if one extreme is to hold power, I would much prefer it were the left than the right, in this arrangement.

Gnote, the extreme right has a grand total of four votes (11 if you count the Libertarians as extreme).

Tell me, would you be willing to sit in a coalition with the CA if it were kept on a tight leash? The other two center-right parties (PNL and PUC) are very similar to yours economically.

[Sephardi]

Banking: The SLD believes in more strict regulation and better oversight of the banking sector and implementing policies which encourage long-term investment over short-term speculation.

Taxes: We generally support a progressive tax regime. This can include a graduated income tax, a negative income tax, capital gains tax, and/or a land value tax. We also support certain pigouvian taxes, particularly with an environmental focus, such as a carbon tax or cap-and-trade.

Nationalisation: We admit state ownership only to a certain degree and only when private ownership has failed. It should only be used as a last resort when there is no other option available, if however this scenario were to happen we believe the state should act swiftly and without hesitation.

Monetary policy: The SLD favours a Keynesian monetary system.

Fiscal Policy: We endorse Keynesian spending measures to control the boom-bust cycle.

All of these support tyranny and a huge government that tells people what to do. I guess it's true. Social Democrats derive their economic ways from Fascists.

[Gnote]

I would be willing to allow the CA to support the SLD platform, Dr House. The party platforms are diametrically opposed.