"Nightmare for NATO": how the West is afraid of S-400 - Politics Forum.org | PoFo

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#14999506
The journalist of the German edition "Stern" called the acquisition by Turkey of four battalions of the S-400 "Triumph" anti-aircraft missile system a "nightmare" for NATO, and also that these air defense systems could become a serious problem for the West. He noted that the technical equipment of Russian weapons is superior to American. Moreover, according to his words, the deal with Russia is more profitable for the Turkish side, since the cost of its military equipment is two times less. "For the Kremlin, the anti-aircraft missile system is a bestseller, while for NATO it is a nightmare", Gernot Krumper writes in his article.

The author of the article says that the exact characteristics of this military equipment are unknown to Western countries. Meanwhile, Russia claims that one of its possibilities is the defeat of the "invisible" US military aircraft. And the fact that Ankara and other countries prefer to buy Russian weapons, and not American, indicates that Russia was able to convince the heads of state of the respective capabilities of their systems. "Only the presence of Russian division in Syria led to the fact that Western fighters could no longer control the airspace, or each sortie became unpredictable", the author writes.

Furthermore, according to his words, the anti-aircraft missile systems manufactured in Russia proved to be more profitable for Turkey. They are considered more advanced than the US "Patriot" missile defense system, and at the same time cheaper. Now Turkey, having purchased weapons, has embarked on the path of "less dependence on NATO".

According to the head of the Turkish Foreign Ministry, Mevlut Cavusoglu, Ankara can order additional S-400s from Russia. The Turkish side is implementing this idea, if it is not allowed to purchase the American missile defense system "Patriot". He explained that Ankara would also be forced to buy planes from another country if Washington refuses to sell fifth-generation F-35 fighter-bombers to it.

According to the American side, the F-35 American fighter-bombers and the Russian S-400 anti-aircraft missile systems cannot be armed with the Turkish army because it is technically impossible. And on April 1, 2019, it became known that the United States canceled the supply of materials for F-35 fighters for Turkey. The reason was the acquisition by the country of the Russian S-400 air defense system, "Reuters" reported, citing sources.

The US Department of Defense demanded from Turkey an "unconditional refusal" of the Russian S-400. However, the authorities of the country do not intend to do this, even in the case of the purchase of the US "Patriot" air defense system. The administration of the head of the Turkish state believes that these topics are "not related to each other".

It should be recalled that the agreement on the acquisition of Russian air defense systems S-400 was concluded between Ankara and Moscow in September 2017. As part of the agreement between the countries, four anti-aircraft divisions should be delivered to Turkey.
#15000196
Turkish officials appealed directly to President Donald Trump this week to waive potential US sanctions if Turkey takes delivery of the Russian S-400 air defense system.

But any possible exemption would face significant obstacles in Congress even if Trump got on board.

The sanctions risk comes from a 2017 law, the Countering America’s Adversaries through Sanctions Act (CAATSA), targeting the Russian military and defense industry and its customers. Turkish presidential spokesman Ibrahim Kalin told reporters in Washington on Tuesday that Ankara “will expect President Trump to use his power for a waiver on that issue.”

Read more: https://www.al-monitor.com/pulse/origin ... z5lfOtHhaE


Turkey is likely to face sanctions over the purchase as it violated NATO rules. Pompeo said that Ankara would be kicked out of the F-35 program if it takes delivery of the S-400. Ankara cannot expect President Trump to use his power for a waiver. The Trump administration placed tough sanctions on Turkey last August, and at one point vowed to “devastate” the country’s economy.
Last edited by ThirdTerm on 20 Apr 2019 22:13, edited 1 time in total.
#15000198
layman wrote:Surface to air missles have always underperformed. The Russians outperform in this single area which is probably of limited use.


I would have thought that at a time of missile warfare, where most "civilized" countries are loath to put boots on the grounds, the ability to intercept those missiles would be of great importance. The Russians claimed to have intercepted most of the 100 odd missiles launched by the US, UK and France against Syria last year with a system that predates the S-400. If true, the West is in serious trouble.
#15000300
ThirdTerm wrote:The Trump administration placed tough sanctions on Turkey last August, and at one point vowed to “devastate” the country’s economy.

CNN wrote:President Donald Trump said Sunday the US would "devastate Turkey economically" if the NATO-allied country attacks Kurds in the region.

"Will devastate Turkey economically if they hit Kurds," but followed up in a second tweet, "Likewise, do not want the Kurds to provoke Turkey."

Trump threatens to 'devastate' Turkey's economy if they attack Kurds in Syria

I remember this because it was one of the rare occasions when I agreed with him.
#15000665
@Atlantis i doubt the Russians were telling the truth.

Both in Vietnam and in Iraq, quite a few allied planes were shot down but far more by traditional anti aircraft guns. Having said this, the Sam battery’s we’re indirectly helping there by forcing planes to fly low.

I am not an expert on these matters but I know that in the 60s many people thought these systems would render planes obsolete. They turned out to be a bit of a disappointment.

The newest systems may be “game changers” but we can file the under “unproven”

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