Vast protest in Hong Kong against extradition law - Page 5 - Politics Forum.org | PoFo

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#15012816
Rancid wrote:Actually... was Hong Kong ever an independent city-state before British rule? I've always assumed no. Maybe I'm wrong there.


Hong Kong was basically a fishing island with about 3000 people before the British landed there, literally founding and building the city itself.
#15012860
Patrickov wrote:I fully agree that the events highlighted in your message is still possible to happen, because:
  1. Carrie Lam still isn't fired
  2. No officials from China publicly admit they were wrong by even remotely supporting it. (I agree that they don't have to be actively involved though)
  3. Xi Jinping is not someone who will easily back down

However, denouncing the protesters as having "Munchhausen syndrome" and claiming there are "Usual suspects", means you are indeed just another pro-China troll. As a matter of fact, you are insulting almost everybody I know, including almost all members of my extended family. This point alone can render you "not worth living". Count your blessings because I am not Himmler.


I'm simply being a realist. If that hurts, it's on you. No need to threaten me with extermination. There are indeed the usual suspects, i.e Britain and the US. And the Munchhausen while hyperbolic could be maybe better worded as 'a dependency by segments of the Hong Kong population on a status quo that no longer exists'.

Hong Kong is a microcosm of a bigger scenario playing out. It can't possibly hope to retain its British colonial institutions while under full Chinese control. And that control is scheduled to be implemented. Only Beijing can stop that from happening, so a constructive question would be 'why would Beijing grant Hong Kong perpetual autonomy?' One that can be answered fairly decisively; 'it won't because there is no reason to keep it autonomous in perpetuity'. It's a liability in such a condition because it's an entry point for US and British activism groups.

Not really. China is actually rather eager to take away foreign presence in Hong Kong, and probably many will not be happy. Besides, if Hong Kong falls the next will be Taiwan, and this severely threatens American influence in the West Pacific.


There you go, you actually get it.

Furthermore Hong Kong actually lost relative real-world importance post-handover. It went from comprising 17% of Mainland's GDP to just 1.7%. By the time Beijing is actually enforcing assimilation into Guangdong it will comprise even less. It's not even a relatively important import/export port anymore in the province. Guangzhou has bigger facilities.

Hong Kong's importance is purely political in 2019. A tool for the western media to use and abuse. It can't rise above that noise, no matter how many Hong Kongers turn out to protest. Carrie Lam isn't even a blip on the geopolitical radar. She will be replaced if she goes, by somebody even closer to Beijing's bottom line.

Hong Kong tells the chicom gulagist regime to fuck off


Ignoring for a moment that the 'chicoms' are actually model Fascists, having abandoned communism in the 80's, the appropriate caption for this video is 'Pro-Western Hong Kong activists smile for the western media' because the other 1.43 billion Chinese don't even care about their perceived struggle. It's imaginary, it only exists in their heads. The practicalities will play out as Beijing demands, assimilation is not an if, but a when.

Hong Kong was basically a fishing island with about 3000 people before the British landed there, literally founding and building the city itself.


The city was built with Chinese labor, Chinese goods and British protectionism; taking advantage of its position as a tax haven and middle man between the huge mainland market and the rest of the globe. Yet Shenzhen achieved more in a much shorter time. British imperial achievements are looking less interesting with every passing day. No the British didn't single handedly build hong kong.
#15012880
Rancid wrote:A better argument can be made that Taiwan really is an independent nation. That cannot be said of Hong Kong.

The difference between Taiwan and HK is rather geopolitical. Taiwan is bigger and further from the mainland, so it could become independent, but it's China too and it's just a renegade island. Tibet and Xinjiang could ask for independence from China more legitimately.
#15012889
Igor Antunov wrote:Only Beijing can stop that from happening, so a constructive question would be 'why would Beijing grant Hong Kong perpetual autonomy?' One that can be answered fairly decisively; 'it won't because there is no reason to keep it autonomous in perpetuity'. It's a liability in such a condition because it's an entry point for US and British activism groups.


Beijing would be stupid not to renegotiate the agreement and consider granting an extension at least in 2047 unless Hong Kong itself votes to have formal entry into Guangdong.

Simple answer... Hong Kongers are obviously still going to cause trouble in 2047 unless some big changes happen. They will still hate the CCP in large enough numbers. They will still want independence.

Sending in the Military to Hong Kong would be a worse disaster for Beijing's international reputation than the Tiananmen Square Massacre was. Only an idiotic government would do that (again).

Beijing in 2047 may be in a very different situation than today and you and I both know it. Probably be a major war or a disaster in China between now and then, and that could still to cripple the government.
#15012903
The hong Kong separatism/revolt situation doesn't even begin to compare to that in western China playing out right now in scale and severity. And guess what...nobody is doing anything, not even sanctions this time. China is too big and too connected to the global markets. Only reason there was even a limp response after Tienanmen is because China wasn't as connected as it is now. You exaggerate the importance of this tiny territory that is Hong Kong.
#15013255
Rancid wrote:I feel like she's starting to become the left wing equivalent of a conspiracy theorist. :hmm: Everything is a grand conspiracy.


Her argument is that any event in the world means that the CIA/USA/State department is behind it. Especially if she doesn't like it.
#15013258
skinster wrote:https://twitter.com/redniangzijun/status/1137901281224331271



Did it take you two weeks to find this thread, or did you just wait for our rage to (temporarily) subside before doing what you are paid to do?

Being able to rally 2 million people, including most of my immediate and extended family, as well as almost everyone I know in my life, can only be the Chinese Government's fault. Not even Communist trolls in Hong Kong dare to put a word. HOW DARE YOU!?

As I said to Igor, propaganda people, especially those who work for oppressive and secretive regimes, like you and whoever you quoted, are not worthy for life, and if there are people that should be put into Nazi gas chambers it will be you guys.

FUCK OFF before I request the moderators to do it for you forcibly!
Last edited by Patrickov on 21 Jun 2019 00:42, edited 1 time in total.
#15013261
JohnRawls wrote:Her argument is that any event in the world means that the CIA/USA/State department is behind it. Especially if she doesn't like it.


Indeed, that's kind of my point. Everything is that grand CIA conspiracy.

Relying on twitter to make 95%+ of her "arguments" is the cherry on top.
#15013264


So we have Rugoz talking shit on me, he who was wrong about Syria, Venezuela and is pro any dumb neocon policy.

JohnRawls the shit-neolib doing the same, never interesting in any way.

Beren, he who very recently made an embarrassing thread about DPRK defectors that don't exist, amongst being wrong about other things.

And Rancid, who knows very little about foreign policy because, America.

Any actual arguments here? :lol:
#15013265
skinster wrote:So we have Rugoz talking shit on me, he who was wrong about Syria, Venezuela and is pro any dumb neocon policy.

JohnRawls the shit-neolib doing the same, never interesting in any way.

Beren, he who very recently made an embarrassing thread about DPRK defectors that don't exist, amongst being wrong about other things.

And Rancid, who knows very little about foreign policy because, America.

Any actual arguments here? :lol:


And what is your argument apart from pro-oppression propaganda?

That doesn't mean what you post are correct. Prove how that can rally 2 million people. Are you suggesting everyone I know in my life are mindless dumbasses?

As I warned I will report propaganda posts you make here, starting with this one.

[KS mod edit: Rule 1.]
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