On Illegal + Legal Immigration: The Exact Opposite of What You think is True, is True - Page 4 - Politics Forum.org | PoFo

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#15040789
Finfinder wrote:You take this way too serious. Lighten up. It's funny how you do as you preached should not have been done. Please continue your losing argument.

Note: This is personal because I just got back from a friends house who her husband was killed by an imigrant, a Drunk Driving immigrant. I'm not sure the details but Ill klook for the article.


(shrugs)

You're the one who's saying 'This is personal' - not me remember?

I'm sorry for what happened but it isn't every immigrant's fault.. as you're making out.. there is no point blaming everyone.

If you feel upset, maybe taking out your anger on others on here isn't the way to go? Just saying. My condolences for your friend's hubby..
#15040797
Pants-of-dog wrote:Since the constitution also does not say that citizens cannot vote, this is irrelevant.

It is a historical fact that the founding fathers allowed non-citizens to vote.


And I've never stated anything different, so thank you for coming to your senses and agreeing with me.

Non-citizens, and specifically illegal aliens, should never have the right to vote in our country, at any level...
#15040802
I find it telling that both Finfinder and BigSteve reject states rights. States rights is a bedrock conservative value. Voting is a state issue. There are only two national offices and they are awarded by the states through the electoral college.

A conservative would believe that the right of immigrants to vote is a state issue. The constitution is moot on the subject. It only prohibits denying certain people the right to vote.

But the Big Steve and Finfinder, in their support of Trump and the big spending republican party have shown is that they are not conservatives in any reasonable definition thereof.
#15040826
BigSteve wrote:And I've never stated anything different, so thank you for coming to your senses and agreeing with me.


I am agreeing with you if you said your criticism was irrelevant.

Non-citizens, and specifically illegal aliens, should never have the right to vote in our country, at any level...


Well, the founding fathers disagreed with you.
#15040834
Presvias wrote:(shrugs)

You're the one who's saying 'This is personal' - not me remember?

I'm sorry for what happened but it isn't every immigrant's fault.. as you're making out.. there is no point blaming everyone.

If you feel upset, maybe taking out your anger on others on here isn't the way to go? Just saying. My condolences for your friend's hubby..


So sorry to disappoint you but I just found that out today, so your argument is way off base, don't just make shit up. Go ahead search every single post of mine you find one that supports your smear. Why do you people just make shit up.



Drlee wrote:I find it telling that both Finfinder and BigSteve reject states rights. States rights is a bedrock conservative value. Voting is a state issue. There are only two national offices and they are awarded by the states through the electoral college.

A conservative would believe that the right of immigrants to vote is a state issue. The constitution is moot on the subject. It only prohibits denying certain people the right to vote.

But the Big Steve and Finfinder, in their support of Trump and the big spending republican party have shown is that they are not conservatives in any reasonable definition thereof.


Drlee thinks there is a perfect candidate and a perfect political party and you must agree with everything they do or say or disagree with everything they do or say regardless of common sense. Drlee can't find a single post of mine that says I agree with with big spending which makes Drlee no better than Adam Schciff. They both have to completely fabricate an argument in order to smear their opponents who use facts.
#15040843
^ Wtf are you banging on about, your own post read thus:

"You take this way too serious. Lighten up. It's funny how you do as you preached should not have been done. Please continue your losing argument.

Note: This is personal because I just got back from a friends house who her husband was killed by an imigrant, a Drunk Driving immigrant. I'm not sure the details but Ill klook for the article.""

You wrote 'this is personal'. I made up nothing...
#15040886
Drlee thinks there is a perfect candidate and a perfect political party and you must agree with everything they do or say or disagree with everything they do or say regardless of common sense.


Wrong of course. Not a good try. Try again.

Drlee can't find a single post of mine that says I agree with with big spending which makes Drlee no better than Adam Schciff.


You support Trum, the biggest spending president in history. We are all free to draw our inferences from that.

They both have to completely fabricate an argument in order to smear their opponents who use facts.


Smear? I did not smear you. I just said you are not a conservative. You take that as an insult? :lol:

You shouldn't until you study American conservatism. Then you will know that you are not.
#15040914
^ You really live up to your name. ;)

Btw one liners that are just a smiley tend to get del'd.

@BigSteve

I thought that might happen, kinda tried to hint to ya mate....but when you see red, you see red lol. I'd never report you though, it certainly wasn't me.

If it's any consolation, I'll probably get banned from here soon enough; been banned from at least 2 or 3 other forums for the same thing as you.
:lol:
#15040952
Drlee wrote:I find it telling that both Finfinder and BigSteve reject states rights. States rights is a bedrock conservative value. Voting is a state issue. There are only two national offices and they are awarded by the states through the electoral college.

A conservative would believe that the right of immigrants to vote is a state issue. The constitution is moot on the subject. It only prohibits denying certain people the right to vote.

But the Big Steve and Finfinder, in their support of Trump and the big spending republican party have shown is that they are not conservatives in any reasonable definition thereof.


A conservative, as you claim to be, would never defend allowing non-citizens to vote.

You're no conservative. You're so liberal you make Michael Moore look like Pat Buchanan...
#15040959
BigSteve wrote:A conservative, as you claim to be, would never defend allowing non-citizens to vote.

You're no conservative. You're so liberal you make Michael Moore look like Pat Buchanan...

Modern citizenship was a creation or a recreation of the Liberals / Left Radicals. I was born a subject, it was only after we joined the EU that the British Establishment felt embarrassed into pretending that we were citizens. American Republicans are hypocrites in that they make no attempt to support and finance a British Republican movement, although they're quite happy to send their troops out to die defending the Saudi and Bahrain Monarchies.

The American founders had no interest in defined citizenship, the constitution refers to the people and the States. The stipulation that the President must be born in the United States came from the fear of ending up with a foreign King as so many new polities did, not from modern notions of the rights of ethnic national citizens. It was the French Revolution not the American that was founded on citizenship. It was Liberals and Radicals that wanted to define citizenship in the US, in-order to overthrow the Southern States social order, though Black emancipation. It was only the mass immigration of the late nineteenth century that really cemented the division of identities between natural born citizens and alien foreign immigrants.
#15041016
A conservative, as you claim to be, would never defend allowing non-citizens to vote.


I don't defend it. And if my state decided to allow it I would fight it with my time and treasure. Please do try to understand what you are reading and why I defend a state's right to do it.


You're no conservative. You're so liberal you make Michael Moore look like Pat Buchanan...


Nonsense. I am not a neo-con. I am not a big spending deficit building political hack like the republicans in the Senate. I am not for sale to the highest bidder. I do not fall down and worship Trump. I do not believe the federal government should be running our schools, bedrooms and state governments.

You need to actually learn what a conservative is. Pro-hint: You will not find a single one on Fox News.

The author of "The Conscience of a Conservative" and Republican candidate for President in 1964, Goldwater wrote:

Mark my word, if and when these preachers get control of the [Republican] party, and they're sure trying to do so, it's going to be a terrible damn problem. Frankly, these people frighten me. Politics and governing demand compromise. But these Christians believe they are acting in the name of God, so they can't and won't compromise. I know, I've tried to deal with them.


I am a conservative Republican, but I believe in democracy and the separation of church and state. The conservative movement is founded on the simple tenet that people have the right to live life as they please as long as they don't hurt anyone else in the process.
Barry Goldwater


Small men, seeking great wealth or power, have too often and too long turned even the highest levels of public service into mere personal opportunity.
Barry Goldwater


The conservative movement, to which I subscribe, has as one of its basic tenets the belief that government should stay out of people’s private lives. Government governs best when it governs least – and stays out of the impossible task of legislating morality. But legislating someone’s version of morality is exactly what we do by perpetuating discrimination against gays.
Barry Goldwater


A woman has a right to an abortion. That's a decision that's up to the pregnant woman, not up to the pope or some do-gooders or the Religious Right.
Barry Goldwater


While I am a great believer in the free enterprise system and all that it entails, I am an even stronger believer in the right of our people to live in a clean and pollution-free environment.
Barry Goldwater

You don't have to be straight to be in the military; you just have to be able to shoot straight.
Barry Goldwater


The constitution is an instrument, above all, for LIMITING the functions of government.
Barry Goldwater


I have little interest in streamlining government or in making it more efficient, for I mean to reduce its size. I do not undertake to promote welfare, for I propose to extend freedom. My aim is not to pass laws, but to repeal them. It is not to inaugurate new programs, but to cancel old ones that do violence to the Constitution, or that have failed in their purpose, or that impose on the people an unwarranted financial burden. I will not attempt to discover whether legislation is "needed" before I have first determined whether it is constitutionally permissible.
Barry Goldwater


The time has come to recognize the United Nations for the anti-American, anti-freedom organization that it has become. The time has come for us to cut off all financial help, withdraw as a member, and ask the United Nations to find headquarters location outside the United States that is
Barry Goldwater


Can any of us refute the wisdom of Madison and the other framers? Can anyone look at the carnage in Iran, the bloodshed in Northern Ireland or the bombs bursting in Lebanon and yet question the dangers of injecting religious issues into the affairs of state?
Barry Goldwater


Once upon a time our traditional goal in war and can anyone doubt that we are at war? - was victory. Once upon a time we were proud of our strength, our military power. Now we seem ashamed of it. Once upon a time the rest of the world looked to us for leadership. Now they look to us for a quick handout and a fence-straddling international posture.
Barry Goldwater


Unlimited campaign spending eats at the heart of the democratic process.
Barry Goldwater


Where is the politician who has not promised to fight to the death for lower taxes- and who has not proceeded to vote for the very spending projects that make tax cuts impossible?
Barry Goldwater


Today neither of our two parties maintains a meaningful commitment to the principle of States' Rights. The 10th Amendment is not a 'general assumption' but a rule of law. States rights mean that states have a right to act or not to act, as they see fit, in areas reserved to them.
Barry Goldwater


And here we encounter the seeds of government disaster and collapse - the kind that wrecked ancient Rome and every other civilization that allowed a sociopolitical monster called the welfare state to exist.
Barry Goldwater


Enough. Internalize these and you will be getting started to understanding what a conservative is.

Buckley said: "Conservatives stand athwart history and shout STOP."
#15041048
Presvias wrote:^ Wtf are you banging on about, your own post read thus:

"You take this way too serious. Lighten up. It's funny how you do as you preached should not have been done. Please continue your losing argument.

Note: This is personal because I just got back from a friends house who her husband was killed by an imigrant, a Drunk Driving immigrant. I'm not sure the details but Ill klook for the article.""

You wrote 'this is personal'. I made up nothing...


I explained the meaning and typical of your ilk you twisted it. I just had found out and my initial post was reactionary I will admit that, but for you to try to spin my comments on this thread to that I'm some bigot is just a low rent argument. I live in South Florida so maybe you can talk to my Cuban girlfriend about my feelings for Latin people. Then again in your identity politics world and labeling people world you probably think all Latin people like each other and vote Democrat yet that is not the truth .



Drlee wrote:You support Trum, the biggest spending president in history. We are all free to draw our inferences from that..


So I was correct Drlee thinks you have to vote and support a candidate that you agree with 100%. Drlee probably still believes in the Easter Bunny but what Drlee cannot do is find a comment of mine where I support the "big spending" I think that story has been drowned out by fake investigations.

Drlee wrote: I did not smear you. I just said you are not a conservative. You take that as an insult? :lol:
You shouldn't until you study American conservatism. Then you will know that you are not.


I'm an independent so once again your assumptions have failed you. Drlee, you cannot possibly insult me, because I have no idea who you are, and your screen persona doesn't insult me be cause I simply do not care, this is not a serious place . It is pretty easy to assume by the totality of your posts who you really are though. Try some CDB for that TDS it should help.


Drlee how many immigrants do you think the USA should allow to come here every year ? Give us a number please.
#15041061
Finfinder wrote:I explained the meaning and typical of your ilk you twisted it. I just had found out and my initial post was reactionary I will admit that, but for you to try to spin my comments on this thread to that I'm some bigot is just a low rent argument. I live in South Florida so maybe you can talk to my Cuban girlfriend about my feelings for Latin people. Then again in your identity politics world and labeling people world you probably think all Latin people like each other and vote Democrat yet that is not the truth .


Hmm, yet you wrote

Finfinder wrote:
You take this way too serious. Lighten up. It's funny how you do as you preached should not have been done. Please continue your losing argument.

Note: This is personal because I just got back from a friends house who her husband was killed by an imigrant, a Drunk Driving immigrant. I'm not sure the details but Ill klook for the article.


(shrugs)

What other implication ought I draw from your post?

No it's not unreasonable for me to draw that implication.

And no I don't support the Dems at all, but please keep em coming with your stupendously splendid arguments el capitan. Anyway I'm not a tribalist and no, you having a latina girlfriend proves feck all, as you well know, it's like saying "I have a black friend" and pleading that that proves you're not racist.

It demeans your so called discussion points even more...

Idk what you hope to achieve with your discussion points so far anyway.

What exactly IS your position on immigration? Make a proper point instead of cursing at others or teying to knock everyone else's points down..

So I was correct Drlee thinks you have to vote and support a candidate that you agree with 100%. Drlee probably still believes in the Easter Bunny but what Drlee cannot do is find a comment of mine where I support the "big spending" I think that story has been drowned out by fake investigations.

I'm an independent so once again your assumptions have failed you. Drlee, you cannot possibly insult me, because I have no idea who you are, and your screen persona doesn't insult me be cause I simply do not care, this is not a serious place . It is pretty easy to assume by the totality of your posts who you really are though. Try some CDB for that TDS it should help.


Drlee how many immigrants do you think the USA should allow to come here every year ? Give us a number please.


Well seeing as you made loads of assumptions about him earlier, you obviously do care. And why don't you answer the Q you posit to him yourself?

What IS your argument against immigration? Don't be coy, speak your mind..
#15041078
@Finfinder Walks like a duck.....etc.

You first. How many do you think we ought to accept?

I can't wait for your number.

The rest of your disclaimers are uninteresting to me.
#15041103
Texas sheriff says migrant DWI offenders will 'run over your children' if released

A Texas sheriff is gaining attention online for remarks he made about undocumented immigrants in his county’s local prison population during a press briefing at the White House on Thursday.

During the briefing, Tarrant County Sheriff Bill E. Waybourn, while pushing back against a ruling that blocked a Trump administration immigration policy, said that if some of the 4,200 inmates in his custody are repeat offenders who, if they are released, will come back to "run over your children.".

“Of those people that we have in custody, we know for a fact that 72 percent of them are repeat offenders, so if we have to turn them loose, or they get released, they’re coming back to your neighborhood and my neighborhood. These drunks will run over your children, and they will run over my children,” Waybourn said.

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“And if that happens, I know that you would want, and certainly I would want for you, the full force of the law. And immigration is part of that full force,” he added.

The remarks prompted backlash some local Democrats in Tarrant County shortly after.

State Rep. Chris Turner (D) on Twitter called the sheriff’s comments “the kind of ignorant, irresponsible fear-mongering rhetoric that creates hate & division.”

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“Has Sheriff Waybourn learned nothing in the aftermath of El Paso tragedy? No elected official should say things like this, especially in a county as diverse as Tarrant,” he continued.

“This is coming from one of the top law enforcement officials in Tarrant County; someone who is supposed to be impartial while carrying out their elected duties,” tweeted State Rep. Nicole Collier (D).

Waybourn said that about 7 percent of those people in his custody are in the country illegally.

“And they were being held for such offenses as murder, sexual assault of children — there was about 70 of them. And there were robbers in there and kidnappers and people who committed arson and people who were DWI,” Waybourn said.

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“And out of that, you know, you think about that, if we return them with this radical ruling out of California where you have a federal judge making law for the nation, or attempting to, it will put our communities in jeopardy,” he said.

Domingo Garcia, the national president of the League of United Latin American Citizens, told the Fort Worth-Star Telegram that he found it “appalling that a man with a badge and gun like Sheriff Waybourn would make such ignorant and twisted racist statements influenced by his far right-wing ideology.”

“We know that in Texas, the data shows that native-born residents are much more likely to be convicted of a crime than immigrants,” he said, adding: “This sheriff needs to resign and apologize for his bigoted comments immediately. The domestic terrorist attacks in El Paso and Gilroy have shown that this rhetoric can have deadly consequences.”


https://thehill.com/blogs/blog-briefing ... -over-your

Kind of..destroys the right wing anti immigrant rubbish, really, I think. Oh well, you've got an immigrant girlfriend so you're not xenophobic or bigoted..
#15041108
Presvias wrote:Hmm, yet you wrote



(shrugs)

What other implication ought I draw from your post?

No it's not unreasonable for me to draw that implication.

And no I don't support the Dems at all, but please keep em coming with your stupendously splendid arguments el capitan. Anyway I'm not a tribalist and no, you having a latina girlfriend proves feck all, as you well know, it's like saying "I have a black friend" and pleading that that proves you're not racist.

It demeans your so called discussion points even more...

Idk what you hope to achieve with your discussion points so far anyway.

What exactly IS your position on immigration? Make a proper point instead of cursing at others or teying to knock everyone else's points down..



Well seeing as you made loads of assumptions about him earlier, you obviously do care. And why don't you answer the Q you posit to him yourself?

What IS your argument against immigration? Don't be coy, speak your mind..


I'm against illegal immigration.
#15041165
Cop out much?

Answer your own question.

You asked: Drlee how many immigrants do you think the USA should allow to come here every year ? Give us a number please.


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