Vast protest in Hong Kong against extradition law - Page 53 - Politics Forum.org | PoFo

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Talk about what you've seen in the news today.

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#15050090
noemon wrote:Indulging in things that bother the Chinese dictatorship.


Yeah, sorry that the parents of the woman who was killed by a guy and fled and lives freely caused them to demand the HK authorities have him extradited for his vicious crime. Poor murderers and rapists, oh how they suffer from China's dictatorship while still walking freely today. :roll:

What I am trying to say is that you are wrong, we both know you are wrong and that is why in your previous message you are trying to accuse me of defending "right-wing thugs" without of course me doing anything of the sort.


But you are supporting them; you're on their side.

Also, spare me your gaslighting; what you think you might know about me isn't my reality.

You are incredibly wrong, you are aware of it and because you are aware of it instead of conversation you are trying to fling mud at all directions even at people that are historically positive towards you.


No, I'm not wrong. Stop fling mud at all directions even at people that historically positive towards you.

The CIA nonsense you repeat like a broken record as if they have any effect on anyone other than yourself have not been ignored in the other thread, they have been addressed. But I guess since you have no actual argument, you will be repeating the catchphrase like there is no tomorrow.


No it hasn't been addressed. It might be denied, but that's not my problem because I have a tendency to go with what reality dictates. The U.S. is very much involved in these protests in Hong Kong, particularly via the NED.

I mean some of the protesters running around with American flags isn't happening, them getting directions from Westerners with American accents isn't a thing, even though we see it on film and everything. :lol:

Behind a made-for-TV Hong Kong protest narrative, Washington is backing nativism and mob violence

You have chosen your side which is anything that can be anti-western and that blinds you to the actual reality of the very real and very basic facts:


I really don't care about your opinion about me, but I'm amused that you think it's me who is blind here.

You sound like an Israeli apologist claiming that once Israel officially annexes the West Bank and Gaza things will be better for the people of these territories. When in fact what you should be saying is: "Let the people of .......... decide what they want to be".


Uh-huh. :lol:
#15050095
skinster wrote:But you are supporting them; you're on their side.


I am supporting the right of all people(in this case the people of Hong Kong) to protest against regimes trying to reduce their human rights. This does not make me an "apologist of right-wing thugs" as you accused me.

Also, spare me your gaslighting; what you think you might know about me isn't my reality.


I can tell when you are being honest and when you are not. You are not being honest with me(or the rest of us in here) here and I can tell. It's funny that after ad-homing me you are now trying to accuse me of "gaslighting". :lol:

No, I'm not wrong. Stop fling mud at all directions even at people that historically positive towards you.


You are incredibly wrong and I have not flung any mud at you.

No it hasn't been addressed. It might be denied, but that's not my problem because I have a tendency to go with what reality dictates. The U.S. is very much involved in these protests in Hong Kong, particularly via the NED.
I mean some of the protesters running around with American flags isn't happening, them getting directions from Westerners with American accents isn't a thing, even though we see it on film and everything. :lol:
Behind a made-for-TV Hong Kong protest narrative, Washington is backing nativism and mob violence
I really don't care about your opinion about me, but I'm amused that you think it's me who is blind here.
Uh-huh. :lol:


It has never been denied, it is not even denied in the previous post, it has been addressed repeatedly both in the previous post:

noemon wrote:If your argument is that the CIA has bought off over a million Hong Kong protesters who have average salaries higher than the average salaries of CIA employees and that all these rich people from Hong Kong wake up every day and follow instructions of their CIA handlers who happen to be poorer than them, then you should explain why this kind of magical CIA organisation has not managed to convince a similar number of very poor Palestinians to do its bidding. That is not to say that the CIA has no involvement as I have previously said she most likely does but the CIA has been involved in every major incident in the planet since at least World War 2. Your placard is a truism akin to the fact that the sky is blue. The presence of the CIA(if any) and the US's very minimal token support does not delegitimise the protesters or their cause. Just because the US has decided to offer very minimal token support to the people of Hong Kong it does not mean that their cause is tainted by the American "evil" nor does it mean that wherever the Americans decide to interfere which is everywhere that automatically places the side that receives American support as the "bad guys". You have the capability to understand that this logic does not actually stand. Just like the American logic that whoever the Russians support is evil by default also does not stand. Some of us call them all(US, China, Russia) as we see fit according to the occasion instead of playing stooges for the superpower of choice. Surely you can appreciate the importance of this.


But also in the HK thread:

This whole page and the next is me addressing your CIA/US arguments.
#15050100
skinster wrote:https://twitter.com/AndreVltchek/status/1197567153265872902?s=20







Just imagine HK being Gaza or the West Bank while China is Israel? Does it make it simpler for you to understand the situation? The problem also stems from the fact that HK is not throwing rockets at China while China is actively suppressing their rights and freedoms. Come on.
#15050101
skinster wrote:There was a discussion between me and noeman in TLTE where now the topic is locked and I'm not allowed to respond to him. And apparently I ad-hom'd him but re-reading my post he's responding to, no such thing happened. Interesting.

If you are going to silence those who disagree with you, you're no better than those you're complaining about.


Lol at you thinking that you don't ad hom people and that you are being silenced :lol:
#15050102
JohnRawls wrote:Just imagine HK being Gaza or the West Bank while China is Israel? Does it make it simpler for you to understand the situation? The problem also stems from the fact that HK is not throwing rockets at China while China is actively suppressing their rights and freedoms. Come on.


HK isn't Gaza or the West Bank. This is a very silly analogy.

It is the protesters that are throwing molotov cocktails, bricking people to death, setting fire on people and on civilian infrastructure to the point of alienating other residents of HK who are actively involved in opposing the "protesters".

JohnRawls wrote:Lol at you thinking that you don't ad hom people and that you are being silenced :lol:


Please quote me where I ad-hom'd him. Admin Edit: Rule 16
#15050136
skinster wrote:This report details U.S. involvement in HK.


Many of these so-called analytic videos are outright propaganda and are basically lies. As a matter of fact I never watch propagandic publications, be it pro-government or anti-government, because they screw up my mind. This person, on the other hand, repeatedly allows his stance to cloud his judgement.

I believe the moderator he had argued a while ago had presented the problem of this person quite clearly and I essentially do not have to add anything.
#15050141
skinster wrote:
HK isn't Gaza or the West Bank. This is a very silly analogy.

It is the protesters that are throwing molotov cocktails, bricking people to death, setting fire on people and on civilian infrastructure to the point of alienating other residents of HK who are actively involved in opposing the "protesters".

Please quote me where I ad-hom'd him.
Molotov cocktails are in response to tear gas abuse. Most Hongkongers think that tear gas abuse from police is the bigger harm here.

The bricking incident was in the midst of the violence started by pro-Chinese mobs, not protesters. There are even rumours that the dead was one of those mobs, although I think he is little more than an unfortunate bystander.

I have shared the fire incident well before this person, and both the tweet I shared and the video itself had clearly showed that it is not a generally accepted action. Mentioning it as if we all approve of it is essentially slander.

Seriously, this kind of one-sided argument with serious bias is not real discussion.
#15050143
skinster wrote:Feel free to call out the lies, dude who threatens death on people who disagree with him. :D
This very statement is what made those so-called threats exist in the first place. It is natural that these so-called arguments give perceptions that the person spewing them knowingly side with tyrants (Chinese Communists and Iran Islamists) and want whoever protesting them dying horribly, just because the West is supporting them.

Why is it wrong to be hostile to someone eagerly wanting my fellow people to suffer or even die, seriously?
Last edited by Patrickov on 22 Nov 2019 00:06, edited 2 times in total.
#15050214
HK isn't Gaza or the West Bank. This is a very silly analogy.

It is the protesters that are throwing molotov cocktails, bricking people to death, setting fire on people and on civilian infrastructure to the point of alienating other residents of HK who are actively involved in opposing the "protesters".



the Gaza riots are not peaceful protests thats why they are getting shot they throw molotovs rocks and sometimes try to breach the fence

you are a very hypocrite and dishonest person skinster
#15050256
Zionist Nationalist wrote:the Gaza riots are not peaceful protests thats why they are getting shot they throw molotovs rocks and sometimes try to breach the fence

you are a very hypocrite and dishonest person skinster



While I am less than a local in Israel compared with this Honourable Gentleman, I have to disagree his (or his opponent's) belief that the two being different.

In my opinion, either both are oppressed people fighting for their survival, or both are illegitimate foreign efforts to undermine a certain power. Holding different standard between these two is rather inconsistent. In some sense, this Honourable Gentleman simply had an opposite double-standard to the person he accuses.
#15050264
Patrickov wrote:While I am less than a local in Israel compared with this Honourable Gentleman, I have to disagree his (or his opponent's) belief that the two being different.

In my opinion, either both are oppressed people fighting for their survival, or both are illegitimate foreign efforts to undermine a certain power. Holding different standard between these two is rather inconsistent. In some sense, this Honourable Gentleman simply had an opposite double-standard to the person he accuses.

Well, HK doesn't launch missiles at China nor does it try to actively destroy China. The similarity is that you both try to fight for your land and the right to rule/administer it.
#15050309
skinster wrote:Please quote me where I ad-hom'd him.


Here:

skinster wrote:FTP all day every day, but fuck these savage rightwing assholes you're apologising for too.


You are accusing me of "apologising for rightwing assholes".
#15050383
JohnRawls wrote:Well, HK doesn't launch missiles at China nor does it try to actively destroy China.


We don't simply because we can't.

Israel is a much smaller country than China, and the Palestinians, in turn, have more military support from the surrounding countries.

Some of my contemporaries believe that we only get our ground because China actually fears U.S. sanctions. They need the trade and money to alleviate the righteous dissidence from the oppressed people.
#15050449
A few days ago, there was a suspicious death very near my home.

Instead, I would like to share the following in order to provide some amusement.

RTHK wrote:Trump 'HK obliterated in 14 minutes without me'

US President Donald Trump claimed on Friday that were it not for him, Hong Kong "would have been obliterated in 14 minutes" by Chinese troops.

In an interview with Fox News, Trump said President Xi Jinping refrained from sending in the military against pro-democracy demonstrators in the special administrative region only because he asked him to. "If it weren't for me, Hong Kong would have been obliterated in 14 minutes," Trump said.

Xi "has a million soldiers standing outside of Hong Kong, are not going only because I asked him. 'Please don't do that. You will be making a big mistake. It will have a tremendous negative impact on the trade deal.'"

Trump also said Washington and Beijing could be on the cusp of sealing a partial trade deal but reiterated he was in no hurry to sign.

Hours earlier, Xi had told a gathering of dignitaries in Beijing that China wanted a deal but was "not afraid" to fight back if needed. "We have a deal, potentially very close," Trump said. "He wants to make a deal much more than I want to make it. I'm not anxious to make it." Trump added that revenues from tariffs on Chinese imports were a windfall for the United States, something economists say is in fact weighing on the economy.

RTHK News from AFP


The difference between Trump lies and pro-China lies is that, the former is relatively harmless and thus more funny.

But seriously, an obliteration of a 1,000 sq. km area in 14 minutes could not be done by any size of human troops. Only an ICBM is capable of that.
#15050489
JohnRawls wrote:It seems HK pro-CCP people have a conscience.




You beat me to post that.

So now Australian intelligence agencies have nice list of names and insight into operations. More defections are anticipated in the years ahead as Xi implements further authoritarianism.

Suffice to say, it is the CCP that is infiltrating the democracy movement, not the CIA as suggested by Sinster. Propaganda and conspiracy theories get exposed sooner or later. Sooner in this case. :)
#15050518
Today is the voting day of the district councils. While the post themselves do not wield much power, this is seen as a referendum on the movement.

For the first time in 16 years (as a certified voter), I casted a vote against my will.

Unlike other constituencies where the incumbent is staunchly pro-Beijing, the incumbent in my constituency is an independent, who's been challenged by pro-Beijing candidates for no less than 3 terms (councillors have 4-year terms).

Had a certain prominent pro-democracy fighter not come in as an "alternative", I would be happy to vote for the incumbent again (he's seeking for a whooping 8th term). However, with someone else in the race to dilute the vote share, I am somewhat forced to vote the democracy fighter, despite it is crystal clear that the fighter is little more than using this seat for higher offices.

On the other hand, my constituency is a small one, with each election having a turnout of no more than 5000 (mind you, polling stations are open for 15 hours in Hong Kong). This morning, though, voters already swarmed the area around the polling station in the first hour since the opening of the polling station.

Image

The photo is taken about 300 metres from the station (a school) entrance, while there were hundreds in the yard of the station waiting for casting their vote. I have never seen a queue near my local polling station at all, not to mention a queue of this size.

It seems obvious what the people's wills are. The question is, what would China do if my speculation is true.

Update 10.30 UTC+8: There are reports that long queues occur at almost every polling station. I personally visited three and found long queues at all of them. The one at my local station is still going strong.
Last edited by Patrickov on 24 Nov 2019 06:12, edited 1 time in total.
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