What type of countries are the USA and Canada? - Page 18 - Politics Forum.org | PoFo

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Political issues and parties in the USA and Canada.

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#15053096
Political Interest wrote:Why do you single out Anglophone countries?

Because this thread is about Canada and the USA, which are together about 95% anglophone, and were created by the British Empire.

If you want to talk about the atrocities of the French, there's another thread for that.
If you want to talk about the atrocities that the Russian, Japanese, Mongol, or Roman empires caused, you can start a thread about that as well.

But try to stick to the subject of this thread, as unpleasant as it is to LOOK IN THE MIRROR.

(By the way, asking people to "look at France" in a thread about the USA and Canada, is like asking your Physics teacher to "Talk more about Biology and Chemistry, rather than putting so much emphasis Physics (THE SUBJECT MATTER))
#15053098
QatzelOk wrote:But try to stick to the subject of this thread, as unpleasant as it is to LOOK IN THE MIRROR.


I am not a perfect Anglo-Saxon :lol: my friend. But France should not pretend to be morally superior, neither should the Germans.

No, I hear you. But all I'm saying is France does not need a school for colonialism. French policy has been less than helpful. France has been a massive accessory to all of the insane projects of the Anglo-American leadership. As have the Germans after 1945.

My point is, all of this santimonious finger pointing that goes on among Europeans is annoying and hypocritical. All of the European countries are in a terrible state and being very badly run. There is no moral superiority, all are beholden to the stupidity of their neo-imperialist leadership.

The point is, none of this is British, none of this is Anglophone, none of this is French and nor is it German. None of the leaders of any European country today lead in the interest of their citizenry. France and Germany are as much in a state as the UK and US.
#15053856
QatzelOk wrote:How revealing that two posters can't come up with counter-arguments, so have resorted to the very snowflake "Hater!". Why didn't you try some counter-argument like: "Why Qatz, the European settlers totally respected the local cultures' sovereignty."

Or you could try: "The White settlers did everything they could to reach out to their hosts, but.." and then come up with some inadequacy on the part of the First Nations to explain their own victimhood.

Or even: :"The European White Settlers respected all their treaties, and were fair and consistent in their relationships with others."

You didn't because... you can't. Just like our current crop of N.A. leaders can't understand why Bolivia had a non-white, non-euro leader. And why N.A. don't seem to understand the link between their SUVs, and all those oil-producing states that WE HAVE DESTROYED.

In 100 years, it will all be forgotten, right guys?



This Honourable Member effectively had discarded my counterargument and claimed that I had not made any.

Quite the contrary, I stated very clearly in the previous post that, while I do not deny anything this Honourable Member had said, I have also seen another side of Western Imperialism, and found it superior than many of the nationalistic ways nowadays. This is my counterargument.

If anything, I see this response as an insult to my effort on my previous post.
#15054099
Political Interest wrote:... all of this santimonious finger pointing that goes on among Europeans is annoying and hypocritical. All of the European countries are in a terrible state and being very badly run. There is no moral superiority, all are beholden to the stupidity of their neo-imperialist leadership....


Patrickov wrote:...Western Imperialism, and found it superior than many of the nationalistic ways ...


European societies have been both sanctimonious and superior - in their dealings with people's who couldn't defend themselves - for a long time. And this is who created Canada and the USA. These are "cut from cloth" creations of the Europeans that many posters would like to compare them to.

They are comparable, of course. But importantly, the countries that are the subject of this thread are CREATIONS of foreign invaders - just as much as Chile's Fascist dictatorship and its neo-liberalism were creations of foreign (economic predator) invaders. This makes them "projects" more than actual nation states.

The question should be "What kind of countries would Europeans create?"

And notice that my giant sanctimonious finger is pointed INWARD and not outward. This is extremely important because pointing styrofoam fingers outward is a denial strategy for ignoring internal problems that require maintenance.
Last edited by QatzelOk on 15 Dec 2019 00:00, edited 1 time in total.
#15054111
Patrickov wrote:... I have also seen another side of Western Imperialism, and found it superior than many of the nationalistic ways nowadays. This is my counterargument.


Can you provide an example of the benefits of western imperialism or colonialism in Canada or the USA?

Specifically, I am asking for benefits to the indigenous communities of North America. I am already very clear on how western imperialism and colonialism have helped westerners.
#15054279
Pants-of-dog wrote:Can you provide an example of the benefits of western imperialism or colonialism in Canada or the USA?

Specifically, I am asking for benefits to the indigenous communities of North America. I am already very clear on how western imperialism and colonialism have helped westerners.


I think most Honourable Members in this chamber, including this Honourable Gentleman, knows that I am not a Westerner, so an apparent accusation of me of only showing "how western imperialism and colonialism have helped westerners" is a moot point.

IMHO colonialism helped us to understand:
1. There are ways other than believing our own country is the indisputable "centre of the world", and
2. How corrupt, power hungry and barbaric our so-called rulers are. At the very least, the West knows how to appease the people.
3. Sovereignty is bull-shit if it has to be maintained by deceit, tyranny and fear against themselves (not just ordinary people but the ruling elite).
#15054369
Pants-of-dog wrote:Can you provide examples of how indigenous government before colonialism was more corrupt than the colonial government?


China. Period.

And do not get me started with all those tribal regimes in the Middle East and Africa. Not to mention the Ottomans, who became very incompetent by the 19th century.
#15054466
Pants-of-dog wrote:@Patrickov

Again, I am specifically discussing North America.

Do yiu have any examples that are about the topic, i.e. Canada and the U.S.A?



I was in response to another accusation, and when I made that statement I assume that the argument was not that specific.

I am afraid I was not going for the same goal as this Honourable Member has put down.

Therefore, no, I have no such specific arguments, but it doesn't make my point (which was not specific to the Americas) invalid, because I was not replying this Honourable Member.
#15054472
Pants-of-dog wrote:@Patrickov

So even if colonialism may have been less than awful for people outside of NA, it has been a bad experience for indigenous communities in North America.


I do not have sufficient information to make my opinion. This statement apparently looks like an attempt of idea imposition, and I am not sure if this is a good move.

Edit: I have deleted the latter two sentences because I have misread My Honourable Friend's latter statement.
#15054577
Asked for examples of other places (besides N.A.) where imposed colonial rule would be a good thing, Patrickov wrote:...China. Period.

And do not get me started with all those tribal regimes in the Middle East and Africa....

A lot of North Americans have the same PIONEER spirit as Patrickov is emanating in this thread.

North America's official history is about the heroic risks and amazing resilience of its white European PIONEERS.

Because the entire planet is now over-populated, and polluted, today's PIONEERS find their greatest hope in novelty - in new technolgies that haven't been proven to fail yet. Every single one is heralded as the new messiah.

To this day, many residents of North America find their greatest pride in the way that two corporate-created states continue to PIONEER new technologies and behaviorism, and to impose them all over the globe through military violence and economic extortion.

And of course, this leads to a lot of people in North America finding inspiration in being a PIONEER themselves.


CBC wrote:Image
Harvey Weinstein says he is a pioneer
in advancing the careers of women in the film industry.


'I made more movies directed by women and about women than any filmmaker... I did it first! I pioneered it,' Harvey Weinstein declared in an interview in which he decried being 'forgotten' since being accused of sexual misconduct by scores of women. (Mark Lennihan/The Associated Press)


Harvey Weinstein should understand that North American PIONEER spirit more than most of us. He's in the Cowboy-and-Injun industry, after all.
#15055328
I started to come of age politically in my late teens while the world was under the Reagan regime of the 1980s. How have North America's great white nations changed since then? How has politics and the society it creates evolved since 1980 in USA/Canada?

Larry Romanoff wrote:When Reagan came to power in 1980, there were 200 food banks in the US; today there are more than 40,000, all overwhelmed with demand and forced to ration their dispersals. Before 1980, one out of every 50 Americans was dependent on food stamps. Today, it is one out of four. Before Reagan, there were 10 million hungry Americans; today there are more than 50 million and increasing.


All of this has happened as both nations have gone deeper into debt, running deficits in good times and bad times. The environment has been further degraded as well, and social institutions have gotten weaker and weaker.

My opinion is that the fatal technoligies were commercial media and suburban car universality. But there were many other culturally degrading changes to blame as well. Plus, there's the whole "founded on genocide and slavery" thing. :lol:
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