benpenguin wrote:Oh don't under-estimate the MSM. They define the narrative, your internet sources simply add details and imaginations on top of these narratives. For example, they tell us the biggest thing right now is Xinjiang Concentration Camp, the example you should look to is Ukraine, and they show you Winter on fire - Stand news and the rest will automatically go there.
Just because you don't read MSM and ignores the information source of internet networks, doesn't mean it comes from "the people"... what is "the people" anyway? Do "the people" have dedicated full time, professional journalists that hunt, vet, package, present and distribute information in the correct channels, and produce digestable information full time? Don't be naive.
Once the narrative is set, your community and your internet news sources will of cause fill in their content. Original for sure, but simply pawns to the greater chessboard.
I am afraid My Honourable Friend is under the same magnitude of "set narrative" if not worse.
I think I have stated quite clearly before that I do not read the MSM. To go further I actually resist the internet outlets I mentioned as well, no less because the other side's effort in diluting opposition voices -- it's better to shut both off than to listen to either of them. But obviously I cannot control my contemporaries
not to spew whatever they find correct.
Outright stating that one side are brainwashed trolls or immersed in "set narrative" only displays the speaker's heavy bias. People may be foolish but not really
that foolish. Most just want to live normal lives without messing from outside forces, in this case including the governments.
For Hong Kong's case, the Chinese, because of their historic, geographical and geopolitical burden, simply cannot grant what the British was able to in their final decades. But many HongKongers have had a taste of "so-called" freedom, rights and rule of law, so they find it extremely difficult to accept the "old" Chinese ways. The Chinese do not know what to do except to impose whatever they are doing, so conflicts arise.
Objectively, it is that simple. Anything about nationalism, manipulation, communism and etc. is, frankly, bull-shit.
No matter what the others do, it's up to the receiver to choose what to believe. My Honourable Friend said I am underestimating MSM. I take this as an expression of the assumption that most people are fools. Frankly this mindset is at least arrogant if not outright wrong, and it only magnifies whatever sentiment against whatever this person believes.
Indeed it is naive to believe that "taking a side means they are brainwashed to no end". I suggest whoever thinking otherwise look at the mirror first.
On a side note, Jeremy Corbyn more or less is under a similar situation to the Chinese -- many find his policies popular or practical, but at the end more British electorates don't. Feel free to bash those voters as brainwashed / foolish or naive (as I see in some of the blogs or forums I read), but at least Corbyn has the dignity to take up responsibility of defeat himself and announced stepping down in due time. Do we see the same in Carrie Lam or any of the Hawks even My Honourable Friend thinks should be removed?
(Edit) On another side note, I think a certain anti-Trump member's
repeated posts in the "North America" forum, most of which emphasise how criminal Trump has been, are closer to what My Honourable Friend means by "set narrative", than whatever I have seen myself. If anything, repeating the same thing for purposes other than responding questions or criticisms against them is counter-productive at best.
benpenguin wrote:Also China did win 40% blue votes, in case you forgot that.
I am afraid it is China as well as My Honourable Friend who is ignoring the majority and trying to use the (however significant that is) minority to trump us here. Given the immense power of Chinese rulers, having 60% of the people against them and still staying in power
without a chance of change (unlike Trump, who can be removed by impeachment or election) is in itself grave unfairness. After all, this FPTP system is probably the only one we can actually counter the imbalance of power. China knows that too, otherwise they will not impose Proportional Representation alongside grouped voting in the Legislative Council.