annatar1914 wrote:Hardly
Rather, it was the constant attempt by heretics to ingratiate themselves with the Roman Emperors and make their sect the official religion and persecute Orthodoxy that has always been the case, every single time. Whether Arianism, Monophysitism, Nestorianism, Iconoclasm, or Papism, the Temporal power has been all-too-ready to make a deal with Sects in error, in exchange for being given spiritual free reign here on Earth.
But anyway, no necessity to feel the urge to have your usual last word here, just setting the historical record straight.
And yet it is the Roman Catholic Church that became partners with the temporal power and was given spiritual free rein. Though I like your accidental use of “reign”, since the Church used its ability to ingratiate itself with Rome to amass political power.
——————————
Verv wrote:There's also nothing in the Nicene creed about being an alcoholic, a murderer, a prostitute, a glutton, a whoremonger, etc.
The Nicene Creed was designed to shortly and succinctly state necessary doctrinal truths.
Can someone be a Christian and a homosexual? Of course. Someone can also be a murderer and a Christian, a glutton and a Christian, etc.
I agree, and the history of Christianity shows that gluttons and murderers have been accepted as Christian many times.
The thing is, though, that if one does not recognize that they are sinning and rejects the clear teachings of the Church, you have fallen into heterodox or heretical beliefs.
Here's a classic quotation on that issue:
20 Woe to those who call evil good
and good evil,
who put darkness for light
and light for darkness,
who put bitter for sweet
and sweet for bitter!
21 Woe to those who are wise in their own eyes,
and shrewd in their own sight!
Isaiah 5:20
Yes, I am familiar with the book of Isaiah. It was one the books I used to test @Hindsite to see if he was actually Christian. He failed, by the way.
I would think that this admonishment should be targeted at those Christians who condemn others and use religion to support their bigotry.
This same judgment, that Christians who do not recognise their sins are heretodox or heretical, could be and should be applied to people who do not follow Jesus’ teachings of caring for the poor and healing the sick. Like modern conservatives.
Verv wrote:J. B. Bury, a famous historian of late Rome who took a very materialist perspective that was critical of Church history in spite of being Irish and undoubtedly familiar with the Church narrative, actually advanced the idea that the Empire itself realized that it was incapable of defeating Christianity after a period and herself was inclined to ingratiate itself to the Christians.
Christianity was the religion whose time had come, and had the blessings of God, and thus went on to become the official state religion.
You should check out his series on Byzantium -- very, very cheap on Amazon and they are good reads.
Yes, Rome also had its own reasons for ingratiating itself with the early Christians. Thank you for pointing out more political reasons why current orthodox Christianity is based at least partly on the political context of the time.
And so you agree that Interpretation can be influenced by current political thought and needs.