Bailouts for corporations who abuse offshore tax havens - Politics Forum.org | PoFo

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Polls on politics, news, current affairs and history.

Bailouts for corporations who abuse offshore tax havens?

Yes
No votes
0%
No
16
94%
Other
1
6%
#15079262
Absolutely not! I don't think any of the companies should get bailouts. Period.

Whatever happened to all those Capitalists saying, "Let the free market decide."? They're quiet when it comes to times like this. It's all fine and dandy til the shit hits the fan.
#15079269
Patrickov wrote:Does this question contains an assumption that all corporations are offshore tax havens abusers?


No, but it does suggest Karma. Why should the government bailout a company who hasn't put in to being with? My only issue is for the workers who lose their jobs. So perhaps if they are bailed out they become national assets like RBS.
#15079272
B0ycey wrote:My only issue is for the workers who lose their jobs.

So perhaps if they are bailed out they become national assets like RBS.


For workers, it probably depends on what they are actually working for. Some work might not worth doing it.

I do agree that anybody who receives a bailout would have to compromise some of their independence.
#15079276
Patrickov wrote:For workers, it probably depends on what they are actually working for. Some work might not worth doing it.


Sure. We could perhaps afford to let Starbucks sink. But this crisis to me has shown how important it is to keep industry in your borders. Under a crisis when you need things built, it is far more efficent to build it yourself then ask a factory in Asia to build it for you. And I would hate to see manufacturing sinking because their CEOs are greedy take all bastards. I would rather the state to control the assets for the next crisis.

I do agree that anybody who receives a bailout would have to compromise some of their independence.


It should be treated as bankruptcy. And the objective is to saves jobs not wallets.
#15079280
Patrickov wrote:Ehhh... I will be careful on that wish. I would rather not have states like Russia or China controlling public assets. Their governments are as bad as those greedy take all bastards if not more.


I was more talking about Western states. China and I suspect Russia already control "Public assets" and are more strict on offshoring that in terms of this poll have to be considered irrelevant.
#15079281
B0ycey wrote:I was more talking about Western states. China and I suspect Russia already control "Public assets" and are more strict on offshoring that in terms of this poll are irrelevant.


IMHO even Great Britain had not got a good experience on that (British Leyland, for example), although whether the change afterwards has been entirely good is also a subject of debate.
#15079282
Patrickov wrote:IMHO even Great Britain had not got a good experience on that (British Leyland, for example), although whether the change afterwards has been entirely good is also a subject of debate.


British Leyland ran just fine. The problem was it was expected to make a significant profit once sold off. State run projects simply need to cater to public need and not worry about profit. If you privatised the NHS for example, that too would go bust.
#15082751
Kerry Packer wrote: I pay whatever tax I am required to pay under the law, not a penny more, not a penny less... if anybody in this country doesn't minimize their tax they want their heads read because as a government I can tell you you're not spending it that well that we should be donating extra.


Famous quote from one of Australia's first Billionaires delieved to politicians in the Senate, equivalent to the House of Lords.

I voted no and I think the question was telling me to vote that way. Depends on what you class as offshore tax haven and as a bailout. In Australia there are calls for the large tech companies to pay more tax and I can tell you Australia is no tax haven. Also Bill Gates and what his face Mark Zuckerburg well they have so much money 9-5 job just trying to give it to worthwhile causes paying their tax due to the government is the least of their worries but yea I guess if a medium to large corporation was about to go belly up wanted the government to buy its remaning shares then i would say 'no' let the company go belly up the good workers will find good jobs and the bad workers will struggle on welfare for a while.
#15082753
Wrong question.

The right question is what's in the interests of the United States.

It's going to make sense to help a lot of companies. But it's crazy to privatise profits and socialise losses. We've turned a lot of businesses into welfare bums.

So let's just look at one thing as an example. We should go through the financial sector like Sherman burning his way through Georgia. Break up the too big too fail guys and sell off the pieces. The most successful country in the world (at dealing with the last financial crisis) did exactly that in the last financial crisis. I think it was Iceland.

I'd help the airlines, just not much. Far too many companies spent their profits doing short sighted actions like stock buybacks. If they want to game the system, that's their privilege. If they want to come crying when they get into trouble... here, have a fiver and good luck.
#15082758
Ter wrote: Virgin Atlantic is also looking for a multi billion bailout. It is privately owned by billionaire Richard Branson. How is this even considered ?
WTF?


This crisis is crippling airlines all over the world. Only tht big players in the industry will survive leaving alot of unemployed workers and an unfair playing field. You mention Virgin Atlantic, in Australia we have 2 major airlines the national carrier and Virgin owned by Virgin Holdings Australia. Now there are smaller regional airlines but they don't come into the picture. Both Qantas and Virgin have taken heavy hits to the bottom line due to the Corona pandemic Qantas has laid of staff and stopped all overseas travel till 15 April but probably longer. Now you could say tough titties thats the free market in action on ya horse Sir Dick, but you gotta remember that this is not due too bad management and certianly not like the bailouts during the GFC 10 years ago when the companies getting bailed out were the ones who contributed to the crisis, also you have a 'barriers to entry' which will restrict other competitors coming into the market thereby creating a monpoly in the airline industry meaning no more cheap holidays. And if I was Sir Dick I be on the phone pointing these very things out to the powers that be. And the less on the dole and in a job even if it's not a paying job is less people who have to look for a job to go back to when the world goes back to normal.
#15082771
Rancid wrote:No, and any non-executive employees should get financial help if they lose their jobs because the company goes under.


Agree also a little off topic but corporations that are profiting handsomely right now from the benefits of being "an essential business" like the Home Depot types , Amazon food delivery and some grocery chains maybe should pay up a little more than normal.
#15085918
https://www.businessinsider.com/coronavirus-companies-tax-havens-banned-denmark-poland-bailout-2020-4?r=US&IR=T&fbclid=IwAR3aKZdLpDX55xDkQleEx1nDTfw036283ClbglQyChoITzHvccw--6bbYj0

It seems the oligarchs will wilter in current times. Bailouts for tax dodgers seems no more. Even Branson wants to collateral his Island for British tax payers money to bailout Virgin Atlantic. He didn't think much of British tax money when he embezzled his wealth and sued the NHS. Time to use some of your £4bn me thinks.
#15093875
B0ycey wrote:https://www.businessinsider.com/coronavirus-companies-tax-havens-banned-denmark-poland-bailout-2020-4?r=US&IR=T&fbclid=IwAR3aKZdLpDX55xDkQleEx1nDTfw036283ClbglQyChoITzHvccw--6bbYj0

It seems the oligarchs will wilter in current times. Bailouts for tax dodgers seems no more. Even Branson wants to collateral his Island for British tax payers money to bailout Virgin Atlantic. He didn't think much of British tax money when he embezzled his wealth and sued the NHS. Time to use some of your £4bn me thinks.


BASED. Tax dodgers BTFO'd.
#15094259
No , instead it should be nationalized .
Any corporation that (like Lufthansa is now doing) threatens the government with going out of business or otherwise laying off employees en-masse during what has become a general financial collapse, should instead be promptly and automatically nationalized — taken over completely, at its then-prevailing stock-value . The only justification for anyone’s owning corporate stock, ever, is that the stockholders agree to take on all of the financial risk that the corporation’s bondholders have not taken on. (Bondholders get paid interest before stockholders get paid dividends.) If, instead, the general public, including all of the taxpayers, are taking on this financial risk, then it is only fair that the public (as represented by the government) will also be appointing, during the economic crisis, all of the corporation’s directors: the corporation will be promptly nationalized . No corporation ever should be bailed-out by the government, on any other terms than to nationalize it.Bailing out the public (workers and consumers) so that they can afford to continue living — and buying, and working — is the right thing to do in an economic crash, but not bailing out investors. What do investors get their incomes from? It’s not from their work, it’s only from the investment risks that they take on, the financial risks that they have agreed to accept. If the government transfers any of those risks onto the public, then the government must nationalize the corporation, because the ONLY value that investors provide in the economy is as a sump for financial risks. That’s it, and that’s all.
https://www.strategic-culture.org/news/2020/05/07/german-government-bails-out-owners-of-german-corporations/ I completely agree with Michael Moore on this issue . https://www.huffpost.com/entry/saving-the-big-3-for-you_b_147970 And it's not like it would be altogether unprecedented either . https://www.cbsnews.com/news/a-history-of-corporate-nationalization/ I feel that this position should unite people across the political spectrum . From Communists , obviously , to even Fascists , such as possibly @Saeko , along the lines that Otto Strasser suggested . https://arplan.org/2019/01/17/strasser-program/#more-686

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