[Donna]

I assume he is offended by the fire. But only his being offended by Trump's Bible-holding is major headline news.

And this is the pastor's fault?

Most of the media is out to destroy Trump politically.

So what? He's destroying the country, an anti-Trump bias in the media is probably one of the least important concerns facing the nation. Only MAGA chuds make a big deal about it.

If he shows weakness and "hides" in his bunker, they call him a coward. If he shows strength by clearing out the protestors and walking to the church that was set on fire he's called a thug. If he let's the states take care of the protestors and he does nothing while the country is ramsacked he's criticized for doing nothing and being a weak leader, but if he calls on the governors to control the protests and threatens to bring in the military he's called a strong-arming bully. There's no scenario where he can win.

Again, so what? Why should he be treated as anything other than a racist vulgarian who is tearing the country apart?

[Tainari88]

And this is the pastor's fault?



So what? He's destroying the country, an anti-Trump bias in the media is probably one of the least important concerns facing the nation. Only MAGA chuds make a big deal about it.



Again, so what? Why should he be treated as anything other than a racist vulgarian who is tearing the country apart?

I love that last line Donna. "racist vulgarian'. That was really great. I love that line because that is what that Prez number 45 is. A racist, crude, rude, insecure, little man and racist vulgarian.

I don't know why Unthinking is even trying to defend that man? He claims to be a Sanders supporter yet he finds all kinds of defenses for that racist pig president? I don't get it Donna?

He and Julian are in the flip flopping territory.

[Donna]

I love that last line Donna. "racist vulgarian'. That was really great. I love that line because that is what that Prez number 45 is. A racist, crude, rude, insecure, little man and racist vulgarian.

I don't know why Unthinking is even trying to defend that man? He claims to be a Sanders supporter yet he finds all kinds of defenses for that racist pig president? I don't get it Donna?

He and Julian are in the flip flopping territory.

I guess the Bernie Bro myth was real after all.

[Rugoz]

Most of the media is out to destroy Trump politically. If he shows weakness and "hides" in his bunker, they call him a coward. If he shows strength by clearing out the protestors and walking to the church that was set on fire he's called a thug. If he let's the states take care of the protestors and he does nothing while the country is ramsacked he's criticized for doing nothing and being a weak leader, but if he calls on the governors to control the protests and threatens to bring in the military he's called a strong-arming bully. There's no scenario where he can win.

Is this a joke?

Have you checked Trump's twitter feed recently? The guy's the same vile asshole as always.

Should I feel for a narcissistic sociopath who doesn't know how to behave like a responsible human being, or in fact doesn't even want to?

[jimjam]

Friday night while Washington was in flames, trump was tucked in tight in a bunker in The White House. He appeared only concerned about himself and his family while the streets were full of riots. Today he decides he wants to hold a bible in front of a church. Donald had a street cleared via storm troopers, clubs and tear gas so he could walk down it with a bible in his hand: this crook, traitor, predator, liar- used a bible of all things- talk about hypocrisy! He was egging the crowd on to defy him. He is pining for a domestic race war, desperate for any distraction he can find for his utter failure to govern.

Donald from the WH through tear gassed laden Lafayette Park to the steps of the church of the presidents - holding up that bible—would’ve made P T Barnum proud.

[Unthinking Majority]

I love that last line Donna. "racist vulgarian'. That was really great. I love that line because that is what that Prez number 45 is. A racist, crude, rude, insecure, little man and racist vulgarian.

Trump is all of those things mentioned, and he should be criticized for them.

I don't know why Unthinking is even trying to defend that man? He claims to be a Sanders supporter yet he finds all kinds of defenses for that racist pig president? I don't get it Donna?

He and Julian are in the flip flopping territory.

I'm a moderate populist.

I'm not a MAGA hat-wearing Trump supporter or anything, the guy has many flaws, but I do have a soft spot for populists on the left or the right. Bernie and Trump are that. They don't give 2 fucks about what their parties want them to say or do, they do what they feel is right, and I respect that because it takes a ton of balls and bravery. I also like US politicians like Mike Gravel and Jesse Ventura and Ralph Nader for those same reasons. They have no puppet masters. The Democratic party & GOP can go fuck themselves, they're crooked corrupt paid-off corporate whores. What's worse, having a rude asshole like Trump in the White House or a corporate whore? Because they're the ones destroying the country. It's a tough question because Obama was a really nice & lovable guy for a corporate whore. Hillary was an unlovable corporate whore & most knew it.

I'll criticize Trump when I think he deserves it. He says a lot of stupid shit, and he lies, but people and the media are just unhinged. An example is the "drinking bleach" shit. He never told anyone to drink bleach. He had a stupid suggestion to a doctor that maybe they could research disinfecting inside people. But that didn't stop the propoganda-makers. If you only call out the lies from people you dislike and let the other lies slide you're part of the problem.

[Rugoz]

I do have a soft spot for populists on the left or the right. Bernie and Trump are that.

I wonder what populists on the left would say about that :

[Donna]

Trump is all of those things mentioned, and he should be criticized for them.



I'm a moderate populist.

I'm not a MAGA hat-wearing Trump supporter or anything, the guy has many flaws, but I do have a soft spot for populists on the left or the right. Bernie and Trump are that. They don't give 2 fucks about what their parties want them to say or do, they do what they feel is right, and I respect that because it takes a ton of balls and bravery. I also like US politicians like Mike Gravel and Jesse Ventura and Ralph Nader for those same reasons. They have no puppet masters. The Democratic party & GOP can go fuck themselves, they're crooked corrupt paid-off corporate whores. What's worse, having a rude asshole like Trump in the White House or a corporate whore? Because they're the ones destroying the country. It's a tough question because Obama was a really nice & lovable guy for a corporate whore. Hillary was an unlovable corporate whore & most knew it.

I'll criticize Trump when I think he deserves it. He says a lot of stupid shit, and he lies, but people and the media are just unhinged. An example is the "drinking bleach" shit. He never told anyone to drink bleach. He had a stupid suggestion to a doctor that maybe they could research disinfecting inside people. But that didn't stop the propoganda-makers. If you only call out the lies from people you dislike and let the other lies slide you're part of the problem.

Obviously you're white. And this is really the whole problem with your approach to American politics, you treat it as political entertainment because you can. For marginalized people the consequences of having a fascist in office compared to a crook aren't merely abstract.

[Prosthetic Conscience]

"Episcopal Bishop 'Deeply Offended' By Trump Using Bible As A 'Prop'".

Is he also deeply offended by rioting protestors who set fire to the church???

The damage was minor, mostly to a nursery in the basement. She had said the systemic racism was more important, even before Trump gassed the priest and medics for a photo-op.

[Tainari88]

The damage was minor, mostly to a nursery in the basement. She had said the systemic racism was more important, even before Trump gassed the priest and medics for a photo-op.

Wow, the Trump man is making enemies near and far from Pennsylvania Ave. Lol.

@skinster the Lincoln Project puts out another Donald Trump attack ad on TV. He is going to get crazy tweeting again....

[Beren]

Wait what? People are setting fires and not knowing they're setting fires?

Jesus said, "Father, forgive them, for they do not know what they are doing." And they divided up his clothes by casting lots.

[wat0n]

A lot of this analysis misses the big picture I believe, that Americans recognize today that Donald Trump is simply way too divisive. For swing voters the cost/benefit of having him as president is just a whole lot of drama and not a lot of lasting policy development. This was the mainstream conservative argument against Obama before republicans went insane, that he was too divisive etc. and that is why voters rejected his legacy in 2016, but we'll see now if Americans are honest enough to hold Trump to that same standard. If they aren't and he's is re-elected, the union will be in crisis. Voters have to know on some level that re-electing him will mean four more years of social unrest on American streets.

I hope so, although the counterargument to that would be that this has been largely, if not completely, confined to Democrat localities. If this shit was also happening in rural, Republican America, then I'd be more optimistic about this since his voters would also have to deal with this. But they don't, and they may as well be laughing their asses off at "libs causing mayhem".

[Unthinking Majority]

Obviously you're white. And this is really the whole problem with your approach to American politics, you treat it as political entertainment because you can. For marginalized people the consequences of having a fascist in office compared to a crook aren't merely abstract.

I'm not an American, domestic policy doesn't affect me like it would Americans no matter what race I am, that doesn't mean I don't care what happens to racial minorities in the US.

Ie: When Trump banned foreign people from Muslim countries it was a terrible policy. Enforcing Obama-era law and putting kids alone in cages in crappy conditions was terrible policy. I'm not the heartless racist you think I am. I don't love Trump, I don't hate Trump. He is what he is. Apparently if you don't hate the man and every policy he's ever made with an illogical foam-frothing intensity you're labelled a racist or a fascist by everyone. That's how it is now in America, everything is black-and-white and on the extremes. I'm a moderate, not an extremist, not a fascist nor communist, not a progressive nor a conservative though at times a bit of both.

[Political Interest]

Ie: When Trump banned foreign people from Muslim countries it was a terrible policy. Enforcing Obama-era law and putting kids alone in cages in crappy conditions was terrible policy. I'm not the heartless racist you think I am. I don't love Trump, I don't hate Trump. He is what he is. Apparently if you don't hate the man and every policy he's ever made with an illogical foam-frothing intensity you're labelled a racist or a fascist by everyone. That's how it is now in America, everything is black-and-white and on the extremes. I'm a moderate, not an extremist, not a fascist nor communist, not a progressive nor a conservative though at times a bit of both.

It is bifurcation and the reduction of all questions to binary issues. It betrays the way in which American and most English speaking countries are ruled by social science, utilised by both left and right.

We must resist bifurcation as it is very dangerous.

America exports its narrative, both left and right to the rest of the world. However the rest of the world does not reflect American realities.

[Unthinking Majority]

The damage was minor, mostly to a nursery in the basement. She had said the systemic racism was more important, even before Trump gassed the priest and medics for a photo-op.

I'm not defending the riot police in how they cleared the streets in DC. They're abusive tyrants.

I see the historic church catch fire, and Trump gets rid of the people who lit the fire and prevented any more damage to the church, then makes his way over there and shows support for the church and then the faith itself by displaying a bible. But the priests are angry at him?? Wha???

[Donna]

I'm not an American, domestic policy doesn't affect me like it would Americans no matter what race I am, that doesn't mean I don't care what happens to racial minorities in the US.

lol bullshit. I think it was yesterday while talking to POD that you tried to argue that racism wasn't systemic in US police forces.

[Unthinking Majority]

For marginalized people the consequences of having a fascist in office compared to a crook aren't merely abstract.

Trump's a white nationalist, and an American nationalist, and a racist. He might be a soft-fascist, I don't think he's a hardcore fascist. I think his main driving ideology is American nationalism along with something like Nietzsche. I don't think he's a neo-Nazi. His son in law is Jewish and they seem to get along. But Muslims are the new Jews in racism circles so that's food for thought. The problem is when you combine nationalism with racism and Nietzsche you start entering fascist territory. It doesn't mean he wants to be supreme dictator of the US and use the US military to take over the world, but he needs to be watched closely for those tenancies.

The thing with Gerrman thinkers is that they are the most dangerous of all philosophers. Marx was German, so was Nietzsche and Hitler. They're extremists. Trump is a German and an American, and his thinking is half Nietzsche and half whatever American philosopher you want to name.

[noemon]

I'm not defending the riot police in how they cleared the streets in DC. They're abusive tyrants.

I see the historic church catch fire, and Trump gets rid of the people who lit the fire and prevented any more damage to the church, then makes his way over there and shows support for the church and then the faith itself by displaying a bible. But the priests are angry at him?? Wha???

He tear-gassed nurses sitting by the steps of the church to get his prop-picture. And you see no problem with that? Have you never heard, "do not take the Lord's name in vain". All you Trump supporters are all the same, "yes he did wrong, but", there is always a but that denies everything else you have said which you only tell them because you cannot escape from them and you have to admit to them but still there is always a but intended to wash away all the mistakes you admit of having been done. He's wrong, but the Pastor whose church is being abused in vain is somehow more wrong than him, Trump is wrong to throw fuel into the fire but the media is more wrong and so on and on it goes and that is why none of you are actually convincing anybody any more. Your stick is tired and boring.

[Donna]

Trump's a white nationalist, and an American nationalist, and a racist. He might be a soft-fascist, I don't think he's a hardcore fascist. I think his main driving ideology is American nationalism along with something like Nietzsche. I don't think he's a neo-Nazi. His son in law is Jewish and they seem to get along. But Muslims are the new Jews in racism circles so that's food for thought. The problem is when you combine nationalism with racism and Nietzsche you start entering fascist territory. It doesn't mean he wants to be supreme dictator of the US and use the US military to take over the world, but he needs to be watched closely for those tenancies.

The thing with Gerrman thinkers is that they are the most dangerous of all philosophers. Marx was German, so was Nietzsche and Hitler. They're extremists. Trump is a German and an American, and his thinking is half Nietzsche and half whatever American philosopher you want to name.

Nice hair-splitting pivot. None of that actually addresses the fact that for black Americans, Republicans and Democrats simply aren't two sides of the same coin or [insert white centrist narrative about two-party system].

[Unthinking Majority]

lol bullshit. I think it was yesterday while talking to POD that you tried to argue that racism wasn't systemic in US police forces.

There's lots of racism within police forces, but it's not systemic. It's not built into US laws or institutions regarding police, at least not anymore. What you have are rogue cops and rogue police departments acting outside of the law. They're tyrants, and they need to be stopped. These racist rogues are the enemy of the people, and the enemy of minorities especially.

Maybe i'm wrong and you can find examples of systemic laws or institutional policies regarding police behaviour. I would think systemic racism would be examples like slavery and Jim Crow laws.

The laws and the bill of rights etc are supposed to be there to protect people from the cops. Reads the US Bill of Rights, it's almost all literally about protecting citizens from abusive police. But the cops deny people of all races, black/white/latino etc. of their constitutional rights all the time. They're oath breakers. Here's the common police oath:

"On my honor, I will never betray my badge, my integrity, my character or the public trust. I will always have the courage to hold myself and others accountable for our actions. I will always uphold the constitution, my community, and the agency I serve."

Clearly many cops break their oath & are enemies of the people & the constitution.