Edward Snowden gets permanent residency in Russia - Page 3 - Politics Forum.org | PoFo

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#15130464
@Godstud

I doubt that's true. There was a whistle blower who blew the whistle on Trump. It got Trump impeached though he lost his job at the White House afterwards. He didn't face any criminal charges and members of Congress were now aware of what was being said in those telephone conversations. I am sure those conversations between two heads of state were classified. That particular whistle blower didn't compromise national security in the process of being a whistle blower and is still regarded as honorable in military circles. He'll retire with his full benefits and an outstanding record. The man I am referring to comes from a family who immigrated from Ukraine and he later joined the military as an officer. He was the one who blew the whistle on Trump. He's been in the news when the whole Ukrainian scandal involving Trump was being reported.
#15130468
@Godstud

I see your article which you highlighted in yellow and read the highlighted portion. I see your point. However, do you think it's OK for Snowden to just run off to an adversarial country with American secrets and just give them away to these countries who mean the U.S. harm? And that somehow doesn't make him a traitor? That the fact he was entrusted with a security clearance should mean nothing?
Last edited by Politics_Observer on 27 Oct 2020 01:17, edited 2 times in total.
#15130473
PO clearly isn't familiar with the Snowden saga. I stopped reading his posts when he claimed Snowden intentionally moved to Russia. Everyone knows he was stranded there after his gov't rescinded his passport as he transited Moscow.

There's also absolutely no reason to believe the authorities in Russia demanded any documents from him since his presence there is a massive PR coup for them and they win every time he does an interview.
#15130475
@AFAIK


You stopped reading my posts because you wanted to stay in your own echo chamber and didn't want to hear an opposing point of view and debate the issue. Just because I am not famaliar with every small detail regarding Snowden leaving the U.S. doesn't mean my point of view doesn't have any validity. My point view has some validity to it whether you are willing to recognize that or not.
#15130477
@Godstud

Snowden is staying in Russia because he is useful to Putin and a weapon he can use against the U.S. Putin does this for several reasons.


  • Snowden brought with him valuable intelligence on the U.S. that Putin can use against the U.S. such as how the NSA operates
  • Snowden can be used for propaganda purposes against the U.S.
  • Payback on the U.S. for the U.S. jailing Russian hackers who were hacking the U.S. Not sure why Putin would want payback for Russian criminals hacking the U.S. unless, they were actually working for the Russian state. If an American citizen goes to Russia and commits crimes in Russia, I am not so sure I would have much sympathy for them.

These are some of the obvious reasons Putin is allowing Snowden to stay in Russia. And I have no doubt, Russia probably at least just as bad at surveillance or probably worse than the NSA is/was. Which is ironic. Snowden ended up living in a country that conducts just as much if not more surveillance on it's own citizens.
#15130478
Snowden gave all his information to American journalists.

Snowden downloaded up to 1.5 million files, according to national intelligence officials, before jetting from Hawaii to Hong Kong to meet with journalists Glenn Greenwald and Laura Poitras. After he handed off his treasure trove of documents, he flew from Hong Kong and later became stranded in Moscow. His future was far from certain, as the journalists he trusted started revealing his secrets.
https://www.businessinsider.com/snowden ... ine-2016-9
Last edited by Godstud on 27 Oct 2020 01:38, edited 1 time in total.
#15130479
@Godstud

Yes, and they also ended up in Russian hands. Besides, that was classified information that shouldn't have even been in journalist hands in the first place.
Last edited by Politics_Observer on 27 Oct 2020 01:39, edited 1 time in total.
#15130481
@Godstud

I am pretty sure it did. The Russians would be foolish to not take advantage of such an opportunity. The NSA has probably changed the way they operated and had to warn and/or protect some of their sources or possible informants after Snowden fled with that classified information.
Last edited by Politics_Observer on 27 Oct 2020 01:43, edited 1 time in total.
#15130482
PO is the type of person who believes Saddam Hussein was behind 9-11 and continues to believe that after others explain to him that Hussein had nothing to do with it.
#15130503
Politics_Observer wrote:@MistyTiger



Snowden was granted a security clearance and he was entrusted with the country's secrets. You don't just run off to an adversarial country with those secrets where their intelligence services can get a hold of them and use them to endanger the lives of our troops and the lives of informants that we are using for national security purposes. It's not OK to do that when you are an American citizen, especially an American citizen who was trusted with a security clearance. If he had a conscience, he should have thought about the lives he would have and did endanger with his actions. Every government has secrets and secrets are needed to be kept for national security purposes. That's just a fact of life that will never go away.


He fled because he felt that his life was in danger. The government was probably not offering him protection at the time. He was definitely not America's sweetheart.

He blew the whistle because he realized he had all this intel on an illegal program. He wanted to end it. He needed to tell someone. And honestly, you cannot trust everyone. The government has corruption and had he stayed where he was, some agent could have eliminated him.

Here's a hypothetical situation. Suppose you were in the CIA. You were involved with a project that was eliminating people and claiming their assets to pay off the national debt. If one of the targets was one of your relatives, would you stay silent or would you leak? Then would you stay in the US and expect a congressman or politician to help you? Why should they help? Snowden realized this so he fended for himself and he looked outside the US for help.

I call the US home. But I do not approve of everything that goes on in this country. If something feels wrong, I cannot deny how I feel.
#15130509
Politics_Observer wrote:And I have no doubt, Russia probably at least just as bad at surveillance or probably worse than the NSA is/was. Which is ironic. Snowden ended up living in a country that conducts just as much if not more surveillance on it's own citizens.

I seriously doubt that. Like I seriously doubt the Russian people are more manipulated or even brainwashed than Americans are, by their mass media especially, for example. They should wake the fuck up and realise that class war's being waged on them every single moment they switch on their computer/television set/smartphone/etc., they don't even have to actively use them. They may be spying on us even while being switched off, for god's sake. (However, they're means of class warfare in many other ways as well, of course.) Snowden's on the right side of history, that's for sure.

Also,
Wikipedia wrote:In 2013, Snowden was hired by an NSA contractor, Booz Allen Hamilton, after previous employment with Dell and the CIA. Snowden says he gradually became disillusioned with the programs with which he was involved and that he tried to raise his ethical concerns through internal channels but was ignored. On May 20, 2013, Snowden flew to Hong Kong after leaving his job at an NSA facility in Hawaii, and in early June he revealed thousands of classified NSA documents to journalists Glenn Greenwald, Laura Poitras, Barton Gellman, and Ewen MacAskill. Snowden came to international attention after stories based on the material appeared in The Guardian and The Washington Post. Further disclosures were made by other publications including Der Spiegel and The New York Times.

Even elite Western mainstream media had to pick the story because it's ~1000x bigger than Watergate, which brought down a president, was.
#15130514
@Beren

Beren wrote:I seriously doubt that. Like I seriously doubt the Russian people are more manipulated or even brainwashed than Americans are, by their mass media especially, for example.


:lol: I guarantee you the Russian government heavily survails their citizens and manipulates them through state controlled TV.
#15130518
@MistyTiger

What about the lives of our country's informants or the lives of our troops? Don't their lives mean anything to you or do you think they are expendable? Are you OK with a hostile foreign power using the intelligence they get from Snowden against our country and endangering the lives of our troops, informants and the national security of the country of it's citizens? Surely, their was a better way to handle any misgivings.
#15130522
Politics_Observer wrote: :lol: I guarantee you the Russian government heavily survails their citizens and manipulates them through state controlled TV.

I guarantee you that their state controlled TV isn't nearly as effectively manipulative as privately owned US media is. I also wonder if they'd even have the resources necessary to reach American levels of surveillance.
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