The Wuhan virus—how are we doing? - Page 69 - Politics Forum.org | PoFo

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Provision of the two UN HDI indicators other than GNP.
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#15139678
I guess Barrett thinks allowing religious services is more important than the fact that this type of behaviour is not only killing people with Civid, but overwhelming resources.

Since these measures primarily kill older white conservatives, we will see demographics helping more intelligent and progressive voices when this is all over.
#15139693
JohnRawls wrote:Okay but there was no pandemic going on at that time. Which means that that strain of Corona was probably harmless or had little to no negative effects on humans. Meaning that although the Covid virus might have existed before, the deadly/harmful version of Covid mutated in China since it was the place of the first outbreak.


There's no reference to another or deadlier strain in the studies reported.
#15139717
I just love Doug64's posts. His level of intelligence concludes that just because someone with whom he politically disagrees does something stupid, he has a good reason to do something murderous or suicidal. Welcome to the Republican intelligentsia.
#15139724
Vietnamese government treats US National Security Advisor's team as infectious, and is proved right:

O’Brien’s trip to Asia came at a delicate moment in the coronavirus pandemic. The U.S. outbreak is again surging, with the country recording more than 140,000 new cases a day the week of his departure.

Vietnam, by comparison, has reported just over 1,300 cases since the pandemic began. Some Trump advisers remarked that there may have been more cases just in the president’s orbit -- including the president himself, and most recently, his oldest son, Donald Trump Jr.

O’Brien’s Vietnamese hosts regarded their guest and his entourage as human petri dishes and restricted the delegation to a single floor of the luxurious Metropole hotel in Hanoi. Room service meals were left outside the U.S. guests’ doors, and Vietnamese officials in head-to-toe protective gear administered virus tests.

The Air Force flight crew on O’Brien’s plane wasn’t allowed to stay in the country; the aircraft was sent to Thailand while the national security adviser conducted his business in Vietnam.

The caution proved astute. Later, on the Philippines leg of the trip, one crew member developed a fever and tested positive for coronavirus. The crewman and two National Security Council aides who had been near them isolated themselves at a hotel in Manila, and O’Brien’s plane left for the U.S. without them. NSC aides were alerted Wednesday morning that two more crew members have Covid-19.

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles ... ion-tumult
#15139743
I read that in Melbourne, the bodies are piled as high as the office towers.

Of course, I can't go there and confirm this.

But I'm scared into compliance nonetheless.
#15140005
An interesting study that the elites don’t want you to see, even though they aren’t contesting that actual data it produced:

Johns Hopkins Study Saying COVID-19 Has 'Relatively No Effect on Deaths' in U.S. Deleted After Publication
Conventional wisdom is that COVID-19 has caused thousands of deaths in the United States and nearly 1.5 million worldwide. This perception has been directly challenged by a study published by Johns Hopkins University on November 22.

Genevieve Briand, assistant program director of the Applied Economics master’s degree program at Johns Hopkins University, critically analyzed the impact that COVID-19 had on U.S. deaths. According to Briand, the impact of COVID-19 on deaths in the United States can be fully understood by comparing it to the number of total deaths in the country.

According to the study, “in contrast to most people’s assumptions, the number of deaths by COVID-19 is not alarming. In fact, it has relatively no effect on deaths in the United States.”

Wait, what? Really?

That’s what it says. And, it should come as no surprise that the study was deleted within days.

Luckily, a back-up copy remains on The Wayback Machine, and we can still read the study. [Check it out for the charts.]

So, how exactly did the study conclude that COVID-19 has had “relatively no effect on deaths”? Here’s how the study made this determination:

    After retrieving data on the CDC website, Briand compiled a graph representing percentages of total deaths per age category from early February to early September, which includes the period from before COVID-19 was detected in the U.S. to after infection rates soared.

    Surprisingly, the deaths of older people stayed the same before and after COVID-19. Since COVID-19 mainly affects the elderly, experts expected an increase in the percentage of deaths in older age groups. However, this increase is not seen from the CDC data. In fact, the percentages of deaths among all age groups remain relatively the same.

According to Briand, “The reason we have a higher number of reported COVID-19 deaths among older individuals than younger individuals is simply because every day in the U.S. older individuals die in higher numbers than younger individuals.”

Briand’s analysis found that the range of deaths amongst the older population has remained within the range of past years.

So, if COVID-19 has actually had no significant impact on U.S. deaths, why does it not appear that way?

    To answer that question, Briand shifted her focus to the deaths per causes ranging from 2014 to 2020. There is a sudden increase in deaths in 2020 due to COVID-19. This is no surprise because COVID-19 emerged in the U.S. in early 2020, and thus COVID-19-related deaths increased drastically afterward.

    Analysis of deaths per cause in 2018 revealed that the pattern of seasonal increase in the total number of deaths is a result of the rise in deaths by all causes, with the top three being heart disease, respiratory diseases, influenza and pneumonia.

“This is true every year,” explained Briand. “Every year in the U.S. when we observe the seasonal ups and downs, we have an increase of deaths due to all causes.”

Here’s where things get interesting.

    When Briand looked at the 2020 data during that seasonal period, COVID-19-related deaths exceeded deaths from heart diseases. This was highly unusual since heart disease has always prevailed as the leading cause of deaths. However, when taking a closer look at the death numbers, she noted something strange. As Briand compared the number of deaths per cause during that period in 2020 to 2018, she noticed that instead of the expected drastic increase across all causes, there was a significant decrease in deaths due to heart disease. Even more surprising, as seen in the graph below, this sudden decline in deaths is observed for all other causes.

The study found that “This trend is completely contrary to the pattern observed in all previous years.” In fact, “the total decrease in deaths by other causes almost exactly equals the increase in deaths by COVID-19.”

Briand concludes that the COVID-19 death toll in the United States is misleading and that deaths from other diseases are being categorized as COVID-19 deaths.

There have been reports of inflated COVID-19 deaths numbers for months. Patients who never tested positive for the disease had COVID-19 as their cause of death on their death certificates. In May, Jared Polis, the Democrat governor of Colorado, disputed official coronavirus death counts, saying even those of the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC) were inflated as the result of including people who tested positive for the coronavirus but died of other causes. In July, a fatal motorcycle accident victim was listed as a COVID-19 death.

On Thursday, Johns Hopkins University explained that they deleted the article on the study because it “was being used to support false and dangerous inaccuracies about the impact of the pandemic.”

They did not, however, challenge the accuracy of the data or its conclusions. In other words, the article was deleted because it didn’t fit the proper narrative.
#15140010
As usual, as @Doug64 trying vainly to justify Trump's murderous lack of action on Covid, has posted an article that is dangerous and has been repudiated. Are any of us surprised?

Here is what Johns Hopkins said about this person's "study".

As assistant director for the Master’s in Applied Economics program at Hopkins, Briand is neither a medical professional nor a disease researcher. At her talk, she herself stated that more research and data are needed to understand the effects of COVID-19 in the U.S.

Briand was quoted in the article as saying, “All of this points to no evidence that COVID-19 created any excess deaths. Total death numbers are not above normal death numbers.” This claim is incorrect and does not take into account the spike in raw death count from all causes compared to previous years. According to the CDC, there have been almost 300,000 excess deaths due to COVID-19. Additionally, Briand presented data of total U.S. deaths in comparison to COVID-19-related deaths as a proportion percentage, which trivializes the repercussions of the pandemic. This evidence does not disprove the severity of COVID-19; an increase in excess deaths is not represented in these proportionalities because they are offered as percentages, not raw numbers.

Briand also claimed in her analysis that deaths due to heart diseases, respiratory diseases, influenza and pneumonia may be incorrectly categorized as COVID-19-related deaths. However, COVID-19 disproportionately affects those with preexisting conditions, so those with those underlying conditions are statistically more likely to be severely affected and die from the virus.

Because of these inaccuracies and our failure to provide additional information about the effects of COVID-19, The News-Letter decided to retract this article. It is our duty as a publication to combat the spread of misinformation and to enhance our fact-checking process. We apologize to our readers.
Tags: science-technology


No doubt Doug saw this and just accidentally forgot to include it in his post. :roll:

As to this comment by Doug:

An interesting study that the elites don’t want you to see, even though they aren’t contesting that actual data it produced:


This is incorrect on two points. First, if by elites he means Johns Hopkins University he would be wrong. The article is still posted in their publication. It has been posted as a PDF and is behind no kind of wall.

Secondly, as you can clearly see in their comments (above) they are most certainly contesting her data.

This is why it is dangerous to believe in someone whose overwhelming confirmation bias drives them to google until they find what they are looking for.

Then there is the smell test which serves pretty well. We have, according to Doug64, a vast conspiracy consisting of patients faking symptoms in hospitals while they die of some hidden cause and the sum of all doctors and nurses either being fooled or willingly participating in a hoax of monumental proportions. They are doing this all over the world because.....? Well. Maybe in his next bullshit post Doug can explain that piece to us.
#15140096
Any assertion that the data Briand's study supplies is invalid is a lie. The study was taken down, but the actual numbers Briand came up with were not repudiated. I can't find the numbers of total deaths to compare to previous years, the closest I could find were 2019's. But given the numbers put out by the CDC for the Wuhan virus infection death rate by age and Briand's proof that the total death rate relative to age has barely twitched over the length of the pandemic, the only conclusion I can draw is that if the death rate for everyone--elderly and non-elderly alike--has increased by the same proportions, and if the total number of deaths has increased significantly, then the lockdowns have been devastating to the non-elderly.

Here's the latest weekly update:

Image

For Red State/Blue State:

US ave. deaths per million (increase, change in rate)
  • Red States 784.4 (31.5, -2.5)
  • Purple States 637.0 (37.1, -1.3)
  • Blue States 894.7 (27.3, +2.0)

If they were included on my weekly chart above, Blue States would rank 17th out of 90 (-1), Red States 27th (+1), and Purple States 41st (-1).
#15140119
Doug64 wrote:elderly

I don't think governments give a shit about old people; old people die every day. They are worried about the proportion of young people who don't die and are likely to become an economic burden for many years to come as they age with significant Covid-19 organ damage.


:)
#15140126
Doug64 wrote:Any assertion that the data Briand's study supplies is invalid is a lie. The study was taken down, but the actual numbers Briand came up with were not repudiated. I can't find the numbers of total deaths to compare to previous years, the closest I could find were 2019's. But given the numbers put out by the CDC for the Wuhan virus infection death rate by age and Briand's proof that the total death rate relative to age has barely twitched over the length of the pandemic, the only conclusion I can draw is that if the death rate for everyone--elderly and non-elderly alike--has increased by the same proportions, and if the total number of deaths has increased significantly, then the lockdowns have been devastating to the non-elderly.

Here's the latest weekly update:

Image

For Red State/Blue State:

US ave. deaths per million (increase, change in rate)
  • Red States 784.4 (31.5, -2.5)
  • Purple States 637.0 (37.1, -1.3)
  • Blue States 894.7 (27.3, +2.0)

If they were included on my weekly chart above, Blue States would rank 17th out of 90 (-1), Red States 27th (+1), and Purple States 41st (-1).

LoL.
#15140137
@Doug64

As usual our friend from the sticks does not understand the science. Does not believe Johns Hopkins when the entire university disagrees with one professor and googles away to find a document he does not understand.

He wants us to believe this is all a hoax. His ideas are dangerous. But hey Doug. Don't wear your mask. Don't wash your hands. Don't social distance. We will still take care of you in the hospital even though to do so puts all of our health in jeopardy.

Meanwhile in the real world. This disease is out of control. We have less than 10% ICU capacity in our local hospitals and by next week we will be sending people home to die. All of this is just made up, of course. These people are faking it and the entire medical community is letting them do it.

Do not believe Doug's numbers. He is fine with killing you for his political beliefs. In some countries this is called domestic terrorism.
#15140158
Doug64 wrote:Any assertion that the data Briand's study supplies is invalid is a lie.


You should stop calling people liars.

The study was taken down, but the actual numbers Briand came up with were not repudiated. I can't find the numbers of total deaths to compare to previous years, the closest I could find were 2019's. But given the numbers put out by the CDC for the Wuhan virus infection death rate by age and Briand's proof that the total death rate relative to age has barely twitched over the length of the pandemic, the only conclusion I can draw is that if the death rate for everyone--elderly and non-elderly alike--has increased by the same proportions, and if the total number of deaths has increased significantly, then the lockdowns have been devastating to the non-elderly.


No, your conclusion makes no sense.

The study says that a lot of people are dying. It just happens to also say that the age ranges of people who died from the Trump virus is very similar to the age ranges of normal deaths.

It was probably taken down because people are misreading it and using it to justify doing nothing and letting people die.

Here's the latest weekly update:

Image


Are you still comparing confirmed Covid deaths to estimated flu deaths?

For Red State/Blue State:

US ave. deaths per million (increase, change in rate)
  • Red States 784.4 (31.5, -2.5)
  • Purple States 637.0 (37.1, -1.3)
  • Blue States 894.7 (27.3, +2.0)

If they were included on my weekly chart above, Blue States would rank 17th out of 90 (-1), Red States 27th (+1), and Purple States 41st (-1).


How does the US compare with the rest of the world?
#15140362
@Doug64

How about this information? Inconvenient to your narrative, anyways, eh? :lol:

Counties with worst virus surges overwhelmingly voted Trump
U.S. voters went to the polls starkly divided on how they see President Donald Trump’s response to the coronavirus pandemic. But in places where the virus is most rampant now, Trump enjoyed enormous support.

An Associated Press analysis reveals that in 376 counties with the highest number of new cases per capita, the overwhelming majority — 93% of those counties — went for Trump, a rate above other less severely hit areas.

Most were rural counties in Montana, the Dakotas, Nebraska, Kansas, Iowa and Wisconsin — the kinds of areas that often have lower rates of adherence to social distancing, mask-wearing and other public health measures, and have been a focal point for much of the latest surge in cases.

Taking note of the contrast, state health officials are pausing for a moment of introspection. Even as they worry about rising numbers of hospitalizations and deaths, they hope to reframe their messages and aim for a reset on public sentiment now that the election is over.

“Public health officials need to step back, listen to and understand the people who aren’t taking the same stance” on mask-wearing and other control measures, said Dr. Marcus Plescia of the Association of State and Territorial Health Officials.

https://apnews.com/article/counties-wor ... da6edb6ebf
#15140581
I'm hearing more about exhausted health care workers leaving their jobs because in some places the work has become overly burdensome added to the strain of worrying they will catch covid and take it home to their families. I read the following about the beginning of this pandemic in North America.


In the first few months of 2020, the outbreak of COVID-19 in China, where 84,000 people have been infected and 4,600 have died, revealed the country’s willingness and readiness to deploy robotic technology as part of a medical emergency. Service robots were used in hospitals and publicly shared spaces to clean, take temperatures and deliver food, to minimize contact between people as part of the fight against the coronavirus.

“I was staying in a hotel under quarantine and had my takeaway food delivered by a white, cylindrical robot on wheels with a screen on top and a digitally lockable hatch for food placed inside,” says Guang-Zhong Yang, founding dean of the Institute of Medical Robotics at Shanghai Jiao Tong University — China’s first academic establishment dedicated to the study of medical robotics, which opened in 2019.

“I ordered the food from the restaurant by phone, it was delivered and the robot brought it
#15140612
@Pants-of-dog Good thing the Trump virus is a hoax, right?

ICUs in Alberta are drowning, say doctors. 'I've never had this happen in all my years of practice.'
Hospitals in Calgary are running out of space and there are also concerns about having enough staff—and enough oxygen—to treat patients

https://www.macleans.ca/society/health/ ... vC4gTFStyo

Study Finds ‘Single Largest Driver’ of Coronavirus Misinformation: Trump
Cornell University researchers analyzing 38 million English-language articles about the pandemic found that President Trump was the largest driver of the “infodemic.”

Of the flood of misinformation, conspiracy theories and falsehoods seeding the internet on the coronavirus, one common thread stands out: President Trump.

That is the conclusion of researchers at Cornell University who analyzed 38 million articles about the pandemic in English-language media around the world. Mentions of Mr. Trump made up nearly 38 percent of the overall “misinformation conversation,” making the president the largest driver of the “infodemic” — falsehoods involving the pandemic.

The study, to be released Thursday, is the first comprehensive examination of coronavirus misinformation in traditional and online media.

“The biggest surprise was that the president of the United States was the single largest driver of misinformation around Covid,” said Sarah Evanega, the director of the Cornell Alliance for Science and the study’s lead author. “That’s concerning in that there are real-world dire health implications.”

The study identified 11 topics of misinformation, including various conspiracy theories, like one that emerged in January suggesting the pandemic was manufactured by Democrats to coincide with Mr. Trump’s impeachment trial, and another that purported to trace the initial outbreak in Wuhan, China, to people who ate bat soup.

But by far the most prevalent topic of misinformation was “miracle cures,” including Mr. Trump’s promotion of anti-malarial drugs and disinfectants as potential treatments for Covid-19, the disease caused by the coronavirus. That accounted for more misinformation than the other 10 topics combined, the researchers reported.

For example, on April 24, a day after Mr. Trump floated — and was ridiculed for — the idea that disinfectants and ultraviolet light might treat Covid-19, there were more than 30,000 articles in the “miracle cures” category, up from fewer than 10,000 only days earlier. Mr. Trump drove those increases, the study found.

To those who have been watching Mr. Trump’s statements, the idea that he is responsible for spreading or amplifying misinformation might not come as a huge shock. The president has also been feeding disinformation campaigns around the presidential election and mail-in voting that Russian actors have amplified — and his own government has tried to stop.

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/09/30/us/p ... 17l01Qx9Vo


Also very interesting:
COVID-19 was silently infecting Americans before first cases emerged in Wuhan: CDC study

Testing has found COVID-19 infections in the U.S. in December 2019, according to a study, providing further evidence indicating the coronavirus was spreading globally weeks before the first cases were reported in China.

The study published Monday identified 106 infections from 7,389 blood samples collected from donors in nine U.S. states between Dec. 13 and Jan. 17. The samples, collected by the American Red Cross, were sent to the U.S. Centers for Disease Control and Prevention for testing to detect if there were antibodies against the virus.

“The findings of this report suggest that SARS-CoV-2 infections may have been present in the U.S. in December 2019, earlier than previously recognized,” the paper said.

Reports of a mysterious pneumonia spreading in Wuhan, China, first emerged in late December 2019. After multiplying rapidly throughout the city in the following weeks, the disease spread across the globe, with the first U.S. case emerging on Jan. 19.

The revelations in the paper by researchers from the CDC reinforce the growing understanding that the coronavirus was silently circulating worldwide earlier than known, and could re-ignite debate over the origins of the pandemic.

It’s not the first evidence showing the virus could have existed or infected people outside China before 2020. A patient in France was found to have contracted the virus after being hospitalized with flu-like symptoms at the end of December, contradicting official statistics showing COVID-19 reached the country from people returning from Wuhan at the end of January.

The CDC study found coronavirus antibodies in 39 samples from California, Oregon, and Washington as early as Dec. 13 to Dec. 16.

Antibodies were also found in early January in 67 samples from Connecticut, Iowa, Massachusetts, Michigan, Rhode Island, and Wisconsin — before the virus was known to have been introduced to those places.

The scientists indicated it’s unlikely that the antibodies developed to curb other coronaviruses, as 84 samples were found to have neutralizing activity specific to SARS-CoV-2.

They also noted it wasn’t possible to determine the magnitude of infections on a state or national level based on the samples, or whether the cases were locally transmitted or travel-related.

The findings were published in the journal Clinical Infectious Diseases.

https://nationalpost.com/news/world/cor ... aajhB6TjlI
#15140665
And another politician displays what she actually thinks of the rules she imposes on everyone else. The people of LA County should take that into account when they consider how much credence to give to the newly imposed restrictions:

LA County Supervisor dines at restaurant hours after voting to ban outdoor dining
Protesters gathered outside the home of LA County Supervisor Sheila Kuehl on Tuesday after a FOX 11 report revealed hours after she voted to ban outdoor dining she dined outdoors herself.

Just hours after Los Angeles County Supervisor Sheila Kuehl voted to ban outdoor dining at L.A. County’s 31,000 restaurants over COVID-19 safety concerns, she visited a restaurant in Santa Monica, where she dined outdoors, FOX 11 learned on Monday.

FOX 11 received multiple tips that shortly after her vote on Tuesday, Kuehl was seen dining outside at Il Forno Trattoria in Santa Monica, an Italian restaurant near her house that she has previously described as one of her 'favorite' restaurants.

LA County Supervisor’s questionable decision to dine out hours after ban
Just hours after Los Angeles County Supervisor Sheila Kuehl voted to ban outdoor dining at L.A. County’s 31,000 restaurants over COVID-19 safety concerns, she visited a restaurant in Santa Monica, where she dined outdoors.

When FOX 11 investigative reporter Bill Melugin stopped by the restaurant to ask about Kuehl’s visit, managers told him they “didn’t want to get involved”, and they have no comment.

A spokesperson for Kuehl provided FOX 11 the following brief statement:

“She did dine al fresco at Il Forno on the very last day it was permissible. She loves Il Forno, has been saddened to see it, like so many restaurants, suffer from a decline in revenue. She ate there, taking appropriate precautions, and sadly will not dine there again until our Public Health Orders permit.”

During Tuesday’s L.A. County Board of Supervisors meeting, Kuehl referred to outside dining as “a most dangerous situation” over what she described as a risk of tables of unmasked patrons potentially exposing their servers to the coronavirus.

“This is a serious health emergency and we must take it seriously,” Kuehl said.

“The servers are not protected from us, and they’re not protected from their other tables that they’re serving at that particular time, plus all the hours in which they’re working.”

Kuehl went on to vote in support of restricting outdoor dining in Los Angeles County, which passed by a 3-2 margin of the Board of Supervisors.

Kuehl’s visit to the restaurant came before the outdoor dining ban took effect Wednesday evening, but her decision is likely to draw criticism from those who have grown frustrated with elected officials taking a hypocritical approach to what they have preached, as Kuehl dined at the restaurant a mere hours after she said doing such a thing was unsafe and could contribute to the surge in COVID-19 cases.

L.A. County Supervisor Janice Hahn who strongly opposed the decision to ban outdoor dining reacted to our reporting tonight on FOX 11’s Special Report with Elex Michaelson.

"We have to remember that we who are in public office are held to a very high standard as we should be and one of the things I’m realizing with some of these new restrictions is if we can’t garner the trust of the public to be with us in this fight against the virus, then we’ve lost a big battle and I’m feeling that now nine months into this is we’re beginning to lose the trust of the public," Hahn said.

Michael Voltaggio is a local restaurant owner who is stunned by Kuehl’s decision.

“That sends a message that we’re getting direction from people that aren’t really believing in messages they’re making," he said.

Voltaggio tells FOX 11, "For me it’s just proof of the continuous hypocrisy and just the lack of leadership and education as to what’s happening right now in this sort of shoot from the hip mentality that’s not doing anybody any good.”

Josiah Citrin also owns multiple restaurants across L.A. County.

Citrin said, "I’m like wait a minute, restaurants are so dangerous, but you’re gonna go eat in a restaurant? I mean it just blows me away."

Kuehl has declined our repeated requests for comment.
#15140666
@Doug64 And another politician displays what she actually thinks of the rules she imposes on everyone else. The people of LA County should take that into account when they consider how much credence to give to the newly imposed restrictions:


What an abjectly stupid post. According to Doug's very dangerous and self destructive logic we should not practice good prevention and not die or kill our elderly relatives because someone somewhere does not practice what they preach. This is the kind of foolishness that has killed 275,000 Americans so far. The problem is not Trump. It is people like Doug who are simply unable, or more likely can't be bothered, to do what is right. Why? Because, you know, liberals. :roll:
#15140669
If Kuehl doesn’t believe what she said about how dangerous outdoor dining is—and she clearly doesn’t or she wouldn’t have done it—I see no reason why those she rules over should believe her, either.
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