A mob has broken into the capitol building - Page 44 - Politics Forum.org | PoFo

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Talk about what you've seen in the news today.

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#15149911
late wrote:This is awkward, and my fault, so let me do the apologies right off the bat. I am late, not Late. There's a reason for that, which is not really relevant. But it makes things awkward for anyone talking to me since it could easily lead to confusion. Sorry about that, Chief.

Your implication is that it's bigotry, which it is not.

It's a conclusion, not an assumption. Women's issues are especially relevant in this crisis, and with her background, she'll be ideal to help with issues relating to discrimination. She is going to be an outstanding VP.

Many of you love using the R word while posting. Obviously, I do not think you are a racist. But, assuming that gender or skin color somehow makes a person more capable is a form of bigotry.

Kamala is quite intelligent and she has climbed very high due to her talents . However, Kamala is a pragmatist and she will change her tune according to how the wind is blowing. I believe she is faking it every time she gives a speech. She has that HRC vibe and she is simply playing the game. Nevertheless, as somewhat said above, she changes her tune every so often and that can be a good thing. And she can be way better than Trump.
#15149913
Drlee wrote:Well, sort of. There are segments of our society that have special issues that are not easily understood in an emotional way. (Or even intellectualized for that matter.) I would not trivialize empathy. It can be a somewhat rare yet very useful trait.

I would go a step farther (and set Julian's hair on fire) by saying that there is value in our society, for our citizens, when looking at their government seeing people like themselves representing them in the seat of power. It creates "buy-in". It is not correct to say that a white person cannot well represent people of color or vice versa. It is correct to say that people who have lived an experience, are often better able to understand that experience and act based on that understanding. Sort of like a doctor who is a veteran treating patients who are veterans. It is an edge.


Right, that I can understand. I do wonder though if her experience is actually representative of what you're saying. After all, Kamala Harris may be Black-Indian but both her parents fall into the high-income, highly educated part of the US population (her father, an immigrant from Jamaica, used to be tenured at Stanford's Department of Economics; her mother is a JD from Stanford).

In that sense, Kamala Harris not just successful (being a Senator is success in my book) herself but grew up in a household where success is the norm (getting doctoral degrees from Stanford are also examples of success in my book), and that is more successful than most Americans are. Not that there is anything wrong with that, I think, as long as she has her feet on Earth (and it seems she does).
#15149916
Julian658 wrote:
Many of you love using the R word while posting. Obviously, I do not think you are a racist. But, assuming that gender or skin color somehow makes a person more capable is a form of bigotry.



You aren't paying attention.

Her experiences will inform her decisions, and they are markedly different from those of most male politicians in DC.

Give it a rest.
#15149917
It is certainly helpful to young minorities to see people that look like them doing great things. I grew up thinking the most I could ever amount to is a nice trade job. Mechanic, electrician, etc. This is because that was the highest level of success I saw growing up. My dad was a mechanic for example, and he would get praise for "making it". Not that those are bad jobs, and frankly, given where/how my dad grew up, he certainly did "make it." However, what is sad is that as a child, that is what I saw as the pinnacle of success. That is where my bar was set because I didn't know better. Yea, you'd hear on TV/radio/whatever people saying "you can be anything if you set your mind too it." However, it carries more wait when you see/hear it from someone that looks like you that's actually doing it. Anyway, it wasn't until I was fortunate to have a few teachers in high school (recall I went to a shit high school where most teachers are just going through the motions) figuratively slapped me in the face and said "you fucking idiot, you're better than this, you can do more, we know it". My parents would do that too, but who listens to their parents anyway? If it wasn't for there teachers, I simply would have gone to trade school and become an electrician. Even after that, I had some serious imposter syndrome through my initial college experience. I didn't feel like I belong there, this isn't the kind of place for people like me. It sucks that kids can have their psyche limited in this way. it's why I'm a big big fan of minority engineers, doctors, whatever, going down to elementary, middle, and high schools to talk/inspire kids.


My point is, it is important for kids to see engineers, doctors, lawyers, elected officials, business owners, etc. etc. that look like them. it sends the message "you really can do this too." Doesn't even matter if those people's experiences are the same or different than the children that see them. It becomes more real when it's a latino scientist telling a latino kid he can become a scientist than a white scientist saying the same. I just carries more weight in the psyche of kids.
#15149944
late wrote:That's a weird thing to say after Trump, you know, worst president ever.


Get down on your knees and thank God for Covid-19! :lol: :lol: Otherwise, you would be in hell.
#15149963
Rancid wrote:It is certainly helpful to young minorities to see people that look like them doing great things.


We are all sympathetic to members of our own tribe.


I grew up thinking the most I could ever amount to is a nice trade job. Mechanic, electrician

Many mechanics and electricians make more money than liberal arts majors. Just sayin'

However, what is sad is that as a child, that is what I saw as the pinnacle of success. That is where my bar was set because I didn't know better.


My dad was a judge and before that a chemist. My mom was an algebra teacher and also taught English. They were my inspiration and I agree with you. Young people need a point of inspiration. I was lucky, having professional parents was a gigantic help. However, my grandparents were blue collar types.


My point is, it is important for kids to see engineers, doctors, lawyers, elected officials, business owners, etc. etc. that look like them. it sends the message "you really can do this too." Doesn't even matter if those people's experiences are the same or different than the children that see them. It becomes more real when it's a latino scientist telling a latino kid he can become a scientist than a white scientist saying the same. I just carries more weight in the psyche of kids.


I agree with you, but sometimes the concept of showing minorities in high level positions makes me feel quite awkward. My wife and I are watching a series called "The Affair" on Amazon. It is about mid to upper class people in New York and Long Island having affairs. Every time they need to see a lawyer, a judge, a psychologists, a school principal, a doctor, ect they show a minority character in that position of authority. That is fine, however, it is so obviously contrived that is creepy. I can tell the show is written by woke types because they use the F word in every other dialogue lines even though most characters are mid to upper class educated. Or who knows? Maybe this is how people speak these days!
#15149965
Hard not to think of the attacks on the Capitol when I saw this quote from President U.S. Grant;

“If we are to have another contest in the near future of our national existence, I predict that the dividing line will not be Mason and Dixon's but between patriotism and intelligence on the one side, and superstition, ambition and ignorance on the other.” -- Ulysses S. Grant


And so, the dividing line doesn't appear to be ''Left'' or ''Right'' exactly either.
#15149999
colliric wrote:I don't support this protest and you already know that.


The problem is even the Republican Party is indefensible. I just keep my mouth shut now because all has been lost.

The majority welcome Biden administration because it's more reasonable and less destructive. I don't trust it for the exactly same reason -- there are places where destruction is inevitable and even necessary because we cannot make the difference ourselves.

The only difference is that I don't buy local Hongkongers' Trumpist shit, which unfortunately even my closest family members seem to agree. Although I blame this on the CCP which made most of us desperate, rather than Trump, who actually rose after China started to attempt this shit back in 2014 (with the 8-31 edict forbidding democratic progress).
#15150039
annatar1914 wrote:Hard not to think of the attacks on the Capitol when I saw this quote from President U.S. Grant;



And so, the dividing line doesn't appear to be ''Left'' or ''Right'' exactly either.


Yeah, it was pretty much bored boujie middle class Trump supporters who were bored with their lives and decided to LARP as if they were fighting a pedo cabal. They thought Trump's visits to Mar-A-Lago were cover for him driving around in the presidential Batmobile so he could go around punching pedophiles who drink the blood of children. Or, alternately, they consumed nothing but rightwing media bullshit of a slightly less insane variety.

The people who showed up to the protest had the means to get there during a time when unemployment is high.
#15150041
SpecialOlympian wrote:Yeah, it was pretty much bored boujie middle class Trump supporters who were bored with their lives and decided to LARP as if they were fighting a pedo cabal. They thought Trump's visits to Mar-A-Lago were cover for him driving around in the presidential Batmobile so he could go around punching pedophiles who drink the blood of children. Or, alternately, they consumed nothing but rightwing media bullshit of a slightly less insane variety.

The people who showed up to the protest had the means to get there during a time when unemployment is high.

...which is pretty much what @annatar1914 said. Lol.

No, even Grant could see, way back when, that America has limitless reserves of superstition, ignorance, ambition and sheer stupidity. QAnon is exactly the sort of thing that Grant meant by "superstition". Long after the oil has gone, America will still be running on stupid.... :)
#15150065
I was agreeing with him. I did a lazy Google search and Grant's presidency would have started with the Anti-Masonic party being an actual thing that died out by the time his first term ended.

Americans are comfy and stupid I don't know what else you expect me to say. Like, only in America could middle class housewives or strong and independent ski-doo dealershp owners stand tall and proud to topple the pedo cabal by implicating themselves in multiple felonies by livestreaming their crimes.
#15150109
Violent insurrectionist and real estate agent Jenny Ryan; "I don’t feel a sense of shame or guilty from my heart. I feel like I was basically following my president."

Ahhh, the old following orders defence. Yes, go on...

The FBI had executed a search warrant at Ryan’s home in Carrollton a short time earlier.

Ryan, who took a private plane to Washington D.C. on the day of the riot, faces charges of knowingly entering or remaining in a restricted building or grounds without lawful authority and disorderly conduct on Capitol grounds.

“I just want people to know I’m a normal person. That I listen to my president who told me to go to the Capitol. That I was displaying my patriotism while I was there and I was just protesting and I wasn’t trying to do anything violent and I didn’t realize there was actually violence,” Ryan said. “I’d just like to apologize for all of the families that are affected by any of the negative environment and I’d just like to say I really love people and I am not a villain that a lot of people would make me out to be, or people think I am, because I was a Trump supporter at the Capitol.”

Ryan told CBS 11 she would like President Trump to pardon her.


You should be praying for pardons of the next president at this point. The one you've got.... Honey, you can do better!

“I think we all deserve a pardon. I’m facing a prison sentence. I think I do not deserve that and from what I understand, every person is going to be arrested that was there, so I think everyone deserves a pardon, so I would ask the President of the United States to give me a pardon.”

Ryan posted a picture of her posing outside of the building in front of a broken window with a caption that read, “”Window at the capital (sic). And if the news doesn’t stop lying about us we’re going to come after their studios next.”


Yes, go on. Did Trump order you to write this? Have you been hacked by swamp-creatures? Are there Democrats living in your closet?

“I don’t feel a sense of shame or guilty from my heart. I feel like I was basically following my president. I was following what we were called to do. He asked us to fly there. He asked us to be there. So I was doing what he asked us to do,” Ryan said. “I do feel a little wronged in this situation because I’m a real estate agent and this has taken my company. This has taken my business. I am being slandered all over the internet, all over the world and all over the news and I’m just like a normal person.”


All right then. You are normal, you are innocent, you don't understand what is going on.

Shit, I'm beginning to hope Biden does pardon some of them. This is pathetic.
#15150133
SpecialOlympian wrote:Yeah, it was pretty much bored boujie middle class Trump supporters who were bored with their lives and decided to LARP as if they were fighting a pedo cabal. They thought Trump's visits to Mar-A-Lago were cover for him driving around in the presidential Batmobile so he could go around punching pedophiles who drink the blood of children. Or, alternately, they consumed nothing but rightwing media bullshit of a slightly less insane variety.

The people who showed up to the protest had the means to get there during a time when unemployment is high.


@SpecialOlympian ;

All the same while you are quite correct, the sinister brilliance of the ''QAnon Conspiracy'' is that it has a high degree of inner logical consistency that is actually very rare with most conspiracy theories. Once the basic premises are swallowed it would only be natural (for any decent person who believed in it anyway) to think and act in a certain manner.

One of the interesting facets of this consistency is the incorporation of real people and events into the QAnon narrative frame like Jefferey Epstein and Ghislaine Maxwell and all their goings-on, excluding among other things the fact that Trump was actually friends with these very people for a rather long time himself (the QAnon conspiracy theory explains that away too).

Overall, in a few short years the QAnon Conspiracy was successfully more corrosive of trust in our leaders and in our institutions than almost 100 years of Anti-Capitalist propaganda could ever have been. I find that significant as well, because the very people you describe are ordinarily in more normal times the very bulwark of any societies trust in it's leaders and institutions.
#15150163
annatar1914 wrote:@SpecialOlympian ;

All the same while you are quite correct, the sinister brilliance of the ''QAnon Conspiracy'' is that it has a high degree of inner logical consistency that is actually very rare with most conspiracy theories. Once the basic premises are swallowed it would only be natural (for any decent person who believed in it anyway) to think and act in a certain manner.


On this part you're wrong. QAnon is basically a conspiracy theory buffet. What it offers to people is a huge amount of media, like subscribing to Conspiracy Netflix, and a community. That's where the "Where We Go One we Go All" shit comes in. The only real underpinning of it is that Trump is Q+ and there's a global cabal of pedophiles working behind the scenes.

Like the Q community is straight up divided over whether this man, who goes to Q events to sell merch and support Trump, is actually JFK Jr. after he faked his death and had facial reconstruction surgery so he could fight the cabal.

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