Alexey Navalny detained on return to Moscow - Page 14 - Politics Forum.org | PoFo

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#15151968
I find it funny western bleeding hearts are deifying Navalny, the same guy that called Georgians and other non-ethnic russians subhumans in 2008. He's an acute nationalist that makes Putin seem liberal.

Lots of useful idiots in the west. Good thing the guys just a meme in Russia.
#15151971
Igor Antunov wrote:I find it funny western bleeding hearts are deifying Navalny, the same guy that called Georgians and other non-ethnic russians subhumans in 2008. He's an acute nationalist that makes Putin seem liberal.

Lots of useful idiots in the west. Good thing the guys just a meme in Russia.


Aping western liberal arguments is cute even for you Igor.

As demonstrated already, during the race-riots where Navalny supported the rioters earning him the badge of 'nationalist', Putin upped the ante and imprisoned the migrants that were being beaten by the rioters making himself into an 'ultra-nationalist' and just because of that.

Putin's imprisonment of any potential candidate and his total failure to increase the standard of living for Russians make him at this point just an abject failure and a lame duck, hence his total paranoia to imprison everybody.
#15151973
That's just like, the western media portrayal of a Russian event man. You need to step off the reservation. Every little thing that goes on in Russia or in China that doesn't serve western interests is bad. That's how you know every little report about every little thing is a lie. no, ultra nationalism for Russia right now while it is in the process of rebuilding its empire is not a good thing. No, Putin is not an ultra nationalist, otherwise he wouldn't be allowing millions of people access to Russia's market from the former soviet union, he wouldn't be expanding the power and influence of the eurasian economic union and signing massive resource deals with foreign powers such as Germany or China.

Centralizing power is not nationalism.

sigh.
Last edited by Igor Antunov on 22 Jan 2021 00:23, edited 1 time in total.
#15151975
Igor Antunov wrote:That's just like, the western media portrayal man. You need to step off the reservation. Every little thing that goes on in Russia or in China that doesn't serve western interests is bad. That's how you know every little report about every little thing is a lie.


The portrayal you used you mean. I have been off the reservation for a very long time now Igor as you well know.

I was speaking for Yugoslavia and still am, when you did not have any courage to.

Putin is a spent failure. Democracy will do good to the Russians. You need to step off your own reservation mate.
#15151977
You mean western neoliberal democracy? Tried and tested, 1992-1998. Utter disagrace to all systems everywhere. Worst period in Russian history outside of outright invasions. This particular brand of Democrazy isn't even working for its chief exporter, the US. Time to abandon this failure of an ideology. It also failed Greece spectacularly. The only Yugoslav country better off now than it was in 1980's is...tiny little Slovenia, which was always better off anyway. Admin edit: Rule 5 Violation

Putin is pure great leadership material that gets things done. I hope he has many years ahead of him.

The harder the west bleats and sanctions Russia, the better Russia is doing for itself and all Russians.
#15151981
Igor Antunov wrote:You mean western neoliberal democracy? Tried and tested, 1992-1998. Utter disagrace to all systems everywhere. Worst period in Russian history outside of outright invasions. This particular brand of Democrazy isn't even working for its chief exporter, the US. Time to abandon this failure of an ideology. It also failed Greece spectacularly. The only Yugoslav country better off now than it was in 1980's is...tiny little Slovenia, which was always better off anyway. Admin edit: Rule 5 Violation

Putin is pure great leadership material that gets things done. I hope he has many years ahead of him.

The harder the west bleats and sanctions Russia, the better Russia is doing for itself and all Russians.


If liberal is what the Russian people democratically decide in Russia that is their internal matter and none of your concern. If they want to change to illiberal democracy then that would also be their right.

Why do you think Russians should not have a democracy?

Greece is happy with its liberal democracy and was quite unhappy with its illiberal socialist one when bureaucrats and cronies considered themselves gods.

Why can't you write proper english? And feel the need to use "muh" nonsense that I never comprehended?
#15152048
Beren wrote:I just googled Shoygu a bit, he's almost as old as Putin (Putin's three years older), so I wonder if how he'd succeed him. I also wonder if he'd cross his way if he meant to transfer his power to Medvedev.


@Beren ;

Putin's successor is likely IMO to be someone who has been in government all their adult life like Putin was before Yeltsin picked him to replace him as President, but also like Putin will probably be a relative unknown at first. I also think that whoever succeeds President Putin will have the benefit of knowing what Putin knows now, and will not make the same mistakes Putin made at first in the early years when he became President.
#15152054
He practically made Medvedev his deputy, which position hadn't even existed before, and raised him above everyone but himself. He even made him president for a while, for god's sake. Now I wonder if he has any picked heir and who that can be, what a mystery! :lol:
#15152100
Beren wrote:So we have a soul because we need it?

No, it's just that some of us trade it in for more material advantages. Hey, it's a seller's market. :)
#15152160
Rancid wrote:I wonder what the market value for my soul is.

That depends, @Rancid. Is it just slightly soiled, or in need of a major overhaul...? :)
#15152172
Potemkin wrote:If Putin is a 'stooge' of the West, then he's a stooge who has cut his own strings....



:)


Yes and no, Putin doesn't work along with Western consensus.

But back in the days people had hope that Putin would reel in the oligarchs who tyrannised society since Yeltsin's rule. Putin decided to coop with the oligarchs, eventually becoming one himself, while legitimising his rule with the image of a more independent Russian policy across the globe.

Putin distrusted Russia's institutional strength to guard their independence and sovereignty, for right reasons based on experience in the 90s, but in a way Putin makes it worse by replacing this system with one that relies on personal strength and authority.

And by becoming the stereotypical autocratic leader that is shunned by the West and playing into the role of an antagonist that hawkish opportunists in the West yearn for, he is in a way indirectly still a stooge.
#15152373
hmmm, i was excited there for a moment when navalnys urban elitist supporters started waving the russian imperial flag at their largest gathering, then i saw some photos from the air
Image

Western media is ratshit, now and forever. Can't trust the manufacturing. Not getting complacent again. Into the bin this sad attempt at color revolution goes.
#15152376
Moscow Times wrote:Russians nationwide are taking to the streets in support of opposition leader Alexei Navalny, who was jailed this week upon his defiant return to Russia.

Image

Navalny, who had been recovering in Germany from what Western scientists determined to be poisoning by the Soviet-era nerve agent Novichok, asked his supporters to protest against his jailing — and against Russia's ruling elite as a whole. Saturday's events are set to test the strength of his support at home after his poisoning sparked Western sanctions and condemnation against Moscow.

Russian authorities sent out strong warnings against attending the protests, which have not received required government authorization. Several of Navalny's allies were jailed or fined ahead of Saturday's events, while Russia's state media watchdog ordered social media posts promoting the rallies to be taken down.

So far, 1,090 people have been detained nationwide.

Here's a live look at the latest news as it happens:

4:54 p.m.: At least four journalists have been hurt during the Moscow protests, the Ekho Moskvy radio station reports.

4:45 p.m.: Small protests in Russia's western exclave of Kaliningrad have started.

4:37 p.m.: A Reuters estimate places the number of protesters in Moscow at 40,000. Confrontations continue to break out between protesters and police.

4:27 p.m.: Police have cleared Moscow's Pushkin Square, reports say. Protesters have spread out into nearby side streets in the city center.

4:21 p.m.: As many as 10,000 people have taken to the streets in Nizhny Novgorod, Novaya Gazeta reports.

4:10 p.m.: The number of detentions nationwide now stands at 1,090, according to OVD-Info.

А вот как силовики зачищали Пушкинскую площадь — в ход пошли дубинки pic.twitter.com/vFBfi3d7wD

— Дождь (@tvrain) January 23, 2021
4:03 p.m.: Scattered clashes between riot police and protesters are breaking out in Moscow, the VTimes news website and other outlets report.

3:55 p.m.: Protesters in St. Petersburg have broken through the police line as they march down Nevsky Prospekt, according to video footage published by local media.

3:31 p.m.: Some 863 people have been detained nationwide so far, independent police monitor OVD-Info says.

3:26 p.m.: Yulia Navalnaya says she has been detained, posting a photo of herself inside a police wagon.

А вот как люди прошли через первое заграждение на канале Грибоедова. Видео: Раньше всех pic.twitter.com/eqbNccXkSq

— «Бумага» (@paperpaper_ru) January 23, 2021
3:10 p.m.: Moscow protesters have begun marching from Pushkin Square to Manezh Square next to the Kremlin, according to The Moscow Times' correspondent at the scene. Protesters chant slogans including "Freedom," "Resign," "Putin is a thief," "Release him" and "One for all and all for one."

3:05 p.m.: Police in in Russia's second city of St. Petersburg have begun detaining protesters at the rally near St. Isaac's Cathedral, the local Fontanka.ru news website reported. Hundreds take to the streets in the city of Nizhny Novgorod some 420 kilometers east of Moscow.

3:00 p.m.: Navalny's wife, Yulia Navalnaya, has arrived at the Moscow protest.

2:55 p.m.: Several thousand protesters have arrived at Pushkin Square in Moscow, AFP reported. Some protesters are carrying toilet brushes — or signs depicting them — in reference to the 62,000 ruble ($823) toilet brush shown in Navalny's video investigation into President Vladimir Putin's alleged palace.

2:24 p.m.: Several thousand people attend the protest in the southern city of Krasnodar.

2:09 p.m.: Protesters continue to arrive at Moscow's Pushkin Square while a loudspeaker orders people to leave the unauthorized demonstration.

2:05 p.m.: Navalny ally Lyubov Sobol has been detained in Moscow.

1:48 p.m.: Blogger llya Varlamov was detained in Moscow, then released.

1:48 p.m.: In Yekaterinburg, clashes have broken out between protesters and police, with officers reportedly targeted with snowballs and smoke grenades.

1:42 p.m.: At least one child is among those detained in Moscow, according to video footage. On the eve of the protests, Russian authorities had cracked down on TikTok content where young people filmed themselves preparing for the rallies, while universities and schools threatened to expel or punish students for taking part in the events.

12:28 p.m.: Riot police in central Moscow have begun breaking up groups and detaining people on Pushkin Square, where the city's protest is scheduled to start at 2 p.m. Hundreds of protesters are already in the square, according to reports. Mobile internet connectivity issues have been reported in the area.

На Пушкинской люди скандируют «Путин вор!»

Видео: Екатерина Гробман pic.twitter.com/yzCsOAiUAQ

— VTimes (@VTimesMedia) January 23, 2021
12:00 p.m.: Protests have started in Russia's fourth-largest city of Yekaterinburg — where the temperature is minus 30 degrees Celsius — as well as in Ufa, Chelyabinsk and other cities across central Russia. Estimates of the Yekaterinburg crowd range between 5,000 and 11,000.

Большое шествие в Екатеринбурге! pic.twitter.com/b4J0px2iXx

— Команда Навального (@teamnavalny) January 23, 2021
11:50 a.m.: Oleg Stepanov, the head of Team Navalny's Moscow headquarters, has been detained from his apartment, Stepanov wrote on his Telegram channel. Protests in Moscow are scheduled to start in around two hours.

11:30 a.m.: At least 15,000 people have attended protests in Russia’s Far East and Siberia so far, MBKh media reported, based on tallies gathered by their regional correspondents, while 174 people have been detained so far in 25 cities, according to police-monitoring website OVD-Info.

11:23 a.m.: Thousands of protesters filled the central square in the Siberian city of Irkutsk, video showed.

11:20 a.m.: Police in Moscow have been preparing for protests in the capital since Friday evening. Pushkin Square — the site of the rally — has been cordoned off. One person was detained there early Saturday morning while staging a one-person picket in support of Navalny. A number of large police vehicles have been spotted parked throughout central Moscow and barricades are being prepared along the central Tverskaya shopping street and other main roads, according to various independent reports. Extra police officers have also been deployed to Red Square, the Avtozak Telegram channel reported.

11:16 a.m.: More than 3,000 people are protesting in Russia’s third largest city Novosibirsk, Meduza reported. In Tomsk — the city where Alexei Navalny was visiting when he was poisoned — more than 2,000 people came out, local TV-2 reported. In Krasnoyarsk, turnout was around 1,500, Novaya Gazeta estimated.

The police seem to have been particularly rough against pro-Navalny protesters in Vladivostok today. A good indication of how they will be treated in Moscow, where arrests have already begun, hours before the rally startshttps://t.co/KosMpqZd1i

— max seddon (@maxseddon) January 23, 2021
11:04 a.m.: Protestors have started to be detained in Novosibirsk, with at least 12 people taken into custody.

11:00 a.m.: Security forces have largely cleared the streets in the Far East city of Vladivostok, where the local time is 18:00, according to the independent Novaya Gazeta news site. It reported “tough detentions,” and “at least one person taken to a police van unconscious.” Videos showed security forces charging towards crowds of protestors to disperse them.

Another video from Irkutsk.

“We will not leave!” they chant.

Will be tough for police to disperse this crowd without very ugly scenes. pic.twitter.com/pbWwuKNAoB

— Matthew Luxmoore (@mjluxmoore) January 23, 2021
10:30 a.m.: Rallies continue across Siberia, with protests reported in Novosibirsk — Russia’s third largest city — as well as Tomsk, Omsk, Ulan-Ude, Kemerovo and others.

10:00 a.m.: At least 48 protestors in 13 cities have been detained so far, according to the independent police-monitoring website OVD-Info.

9:30 a.m.: Some 300 people protested in the Siberian city of Chita. At least four people were detained, including one minor, OVD-Info reported.

9:29 a.m.: A small protest took place in the northern Siberian city of Yakutsk despite temperatures of minus 50 degrees Celsius.

9:10 a.m.: About 500 people have begun protesting in the Siberian city of Irkutsk, MBKh news reported.

8:20 a.m.: In the Far East city of Khabarovsk, about a dozen protesters have been detained and later lined up against a wall and beaten while in police custody, according to independent police-monitoring website OVD-Info.

8:19 a.m.: Up to 2,000 people protest in the Far East capital of Vladivostok, the independent Novaya Gazeta newspaper reports. Police dispersed protesters with force, according to video footage.


Putin's done. He broke the camel's back.

Russians are braving the cold but most importantly they are braving the KGB, the Russian security apparatus and Covid-19.

What does anyone have to say for Putin's legacy?

What does a Russian person calculate when they pause and think 'what has this man done for us'?

Is there a single positive something that they can think of?

How did the Crimea help the Russian condition? How did Syria?

If Europeans stop buying Russian gas, the shambles that is the economy, collapses.
#15152378
Ganeshas Rat wrote:Oh no, thousands of people went to the streets! The regime crumbles! There's a million people manifesting every Sunday for six months in a neighboring country of ten millions and they achieved absolutely nothing, but this time it will be different.


Russia is not like other European/western countries as you very well know.

It does not take as kindly to political dissent.

The fact that so many brave the KGB and Putin's crackdown and security services prove beyond any doubt that this is way out of control already.
#15152385
noemon wrote:Putin's done. He broke the camel's back.

Russians are braving the cold but most importantly they are braving the KGB, the Russian security apparatus and Covid-19.

What does anyone have to say for Putin's legacy?

What does a Russian person calculate when they pause and think 'what has this man done for us'?

Is there a single positive something that they can think of?

How did the Crimea help the Russian condition? How did Syria?

If Europeans stop buying Russian gas, the shambles that is the economy, collapses.

In Crimea, Russian state proved its resistance. Russian state just made its mind. They got what they wanted. It was a milestone. Crimea was Russia's red line. You are trying to do the same in your struggling with Turkey. That is how state should behave.

Syria has become a Russian state. Putin reached out Arab nations. They made lots of agreements on economic relations. It helped Russia to diversity its clients.

Crimea and Syria are both success stories for Russia. After all, Russia has a close friend in NATO now. Erdoğan and Putin trust each other more than they trust to other leaders. Russian companies do business in Turkey. They build nuclear plants in Turkey. Turkish and Mideast markets are Russia's way to economic independence.
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