Why Are So Many Young People Becoming Socialists? - Page 28 - Politics Forum.org | PoFo

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#15166588
Unthinking Majority wrote:The root cause of much homelessness isn't capitalism, it's mental illness and child abuse, which lead to drug addiction.

There are reasons why people can't afford rent or can't get or maintain employment. I don't think anyone should get free or subsidized housing or welfare without participating in social programs that will help break this dependency and improve their lives so they can, if possible, function as independent adults instead of wards of the state.


I disagree. It is very simple Unthinking. The scenarios for a possible homeless state are incredibly varied. I happen to think private property and wealth extraction from banks and mortgage industries is about profit from payers for decades. They pay off the mortgage and are in their what? Sixties. They get ill and the Social Security check is low. Inadequate for keeping up with inflation. They do a reverse mortgage to survive and wind up losing the property when they die and it is not inherited wealth. The poor relatives are left with no property that is paid off. The banks win all the time. Banks are about capitalism.

If you think that is not capitalism you are foolish in your thoughts Unthinking.

I have hundreds of examples. You will lose them all. It is about capitalism. Period. The concept of the property is the priority over people in need of security after a lifetime of working and being productive. You can continue with lies all day and night. I don't care. You are wrong. Period.

Property should not be the priority. Human lives should be. But people need to be in a community that helps older people, children, and vulnerable populations be able to do routine maintenance on a property.

Your heartless ways I really dislike. It is unattractive in the extreme Unthinking.
#15166603
Unthinking Majority wrote:The root cause of much homelessness isn't capitalism, it's mental illness and child abuse, which lead to drug addiction.


Source please or does America have a huge problem of mental illness?

Apart from this main issue being lack of housing, the "NUMBER ONE" reason for homelessness is relationship breakdown. Then other common factors are abuse, debt, being made redundant, things like that. Becoming crazy pigeon lady is never the reason anyone become homeless. Mental illness is a symptom not a cause for homelessness. I think you have been reading Julians posts and thinking they are a viable source. He doesn't know what he is talking about so if you too claim mental illness is the number one cause for homelessness I want to read the source why you think that is.
#15166616
Godstud wrote:@Julian658 Socialism isn't about redistribution of wealth, and people have already pointed out that Capitalism is also a redistribution of wealth.

Socialism says that the means of production, distribution, and exchange should be owned or regulated by the community as a whole. This is not a redistribution of wealth, per se.

You seem to be confusing Communism with Socialism.

The main difference is that under Communism, most property and economic resources are owned and controlled by the state (rather than individual citizens); under Socialism, all citizens share equally in economic resources as allocated by a democratically-elected government.

Under communism, the people are compensated or provided for based on their needs. In a pure communist society, the government provides most or all food, clothing, housing and other necessities based on what it considers to be the needs of the people. Socialism is based on the premise the people will be compensated based on their level of individual contribution to the economy. Effort and innovation are thus rewarded under socialism.

https://www.thoughtco.com/difference-be ... government.

Time to stop believing the propaganda and start doing some critical thinking.

OMG, you do not understand nuance.
Thanks for googling the basic definitions we all learned in high school. :knife: :knife:
It all sounds beautiful but in practice it does not work. To implement what you want would be a billion times harder than herding cats. That is why socialism needs an authoritarian government.
#15166617
B0ycey wrote:Source please or does America have a huge problem of mental illness?

Apart from this main issue being lack of housing, the "NUMBER ONE" reason for homelessness is relationship breakdown. Then other common factors are abuse, debt, being made redundant, things like that. Becoming crazy pigeon lady is never the reason anyone become homeless. Mental illness is a symptom not a cause for homelessness. I think you have been reading Julians posts and thinking they are a viable source. He doesn't know what he is talking about so if you too claim mental illness is the number one cause for homelessness I want to read the source why you think that is.

Mental illness and drugs are BIG in the homeless community.
The Never-Ending Loop: Homelessness, Psychiatric Disorder, and Mortality
https://www.psychiatrictimes.com/view/n ... -mortality
#15166618
@Julian658 You didn't learn shit in high school if you still can't understand the basics. Nice try, anyways.

You saying it doesn't work is simply false. The best countries in the world are the ones with mixed economies that tend more towards Socialism than Capitalism, in terms of quality of life and even basic freedoms.

Socialism doesn't need an authoritarian government, and in fact works quite well in a democracy, which is something you simply won't admit to because it dissembles your entirely stupid narrative.
#15166621
Julian658 wrote:Mental illness and drugs are BIG in the homeless community.
The Never-Ending Loop: Homelessness, Psychiatric Disorder, and Mortality
https://www.psychiatrictimes.com/view/n ... -mortality


Like you read psychiatric times and haven't just googled it. :lol:

Besides if you read it you will understand that mental disorder is found in homelessness because they are homeless and it is not a cause of homelessness. That isn't surprising given that it is a challenging environment to be in. What next? Stress found in caged animals? :roll:

#thestrawstherightclutch
#15166635
B0ycey wrote:Like you read psychiatric times and haven't just googled it. :lol:

Besides if you read it you will understand that mental disorder is found in homelessness because they are homeless and it is not a cause of homelessness. That isn't surprising given that it is a challenging environment to be in. What next? Stress found in caged animals? :roll:

#thestrawstherightclutch

No need to google what is easily observable. However, I thought you wanted references.

I am now going to state the Earth is in orbit around the sun. Do you want a reference for that? :roll: :roll:
#15166636
Julian658 wrote:No need to google what is easily observable. However, I thought you wanted references.


I wanted references that mental illness was the main cause of homelessness not that homelessness caused mental illness - which is a totally different point being made. Clearly you went onto Google and found the only thing you could find to back up your false statement and didn't read what you posted beforehand to know it didn't back it up at all. That is a sign of desperation on your part but isn't surprising to me considering you don't know what you are fucking talking about 99% of the time. In away it would be great if you could have the same misfortune one day as those you call mentally challenged and then learn the hard way that your mental ability wasn't the reason for being homeless but what would be your misfortune.
#15166641
B0ycey wrote:I wanted references that mental illness was the main cause of homelessness not that homelessness caused mental illness - which is a totally different point being made. Clearly you went onto Google and found the only thing you could find to back up your false statement and didn't read what you posted beforehand to know it didn't back it up at all. That is a sign of desperation on your part but isn't surprising to me considering you don't know what you are fucking talking about 99% of the time. In away it would be great if you could have the same misfortune one day as those you call mentally challenged and then learn the hard way that your mental ability wasn't the reason for being homeless but what would be your misfortune.


About a quarter to a third of the homeless have a serious mental illness — usually schizophrenia, bipolar disorder, or severe depression — and the proportion is growing. A study published in 2004 showed a 20-year rise in the rate of psychiatric illness among the homeless in St. Louis. In the year 2000, 30% had a combination of mental health and drug or alcohol problems (dual diagnosis) and another 15% had mental health problems alone.

https://www.health.harvard.edu/newslett ... ntally_ill
#15166642
B0ycey wrote:I wanted references that mental illness was the main cause of homelessness not that homelessness caused mental illness - which is a totally different point being made. Clearly you went onto Google and found the only thing you could find to back up your false statement and didn't read what you posted beforehand to know it didn't back it up at all. That is a sign of desperation on your part but isn't surprising to me considering you don't know what you are fucking talking about 99% of the time. In away it would be great if you could have the same misfortune one day as those you call mentally challenged and then learn the hard way that your mental ability wasn't the reason for being homeless but what would be your misfortune.


About a quarter to a third of the homeless have a serious mental illness — usually schizophrenia, bipolar disorder, or severe depression — and the proportion is growing. A study published in 2004 showed a 20-year rise in the rate of psychiatric illness among the homeless in St. Louis. In the year 2000, 30% had a combination of mental health and drug or alcohol problems (dual diagnosis) and another 15% had mental health problems alone.

https://www.health.harvard.edu/newslett ... ntally_ill
#15166644
Julian658 wrote:About a quarter to a third of the homeless have a serious mental illness — usually schizophrenia, bipolar disorder, or severe depression — and the proportion is growing. A study published in 2004 showed a 20-year rise in the rate of psychiatric illness among the homeless in St. Louis. In the year 2000, 30% had a combination of mental health and drug or alcohol problems (dual diagnosis) and another 15% had mental health problems alone.

https://www.health.harvard.edu/newslett ... ntally_ill


AGAIN NO CAUSE!

Not that I could read all of it being it was behind a subscription wall. Saying you will find mental health issues in homeless people who are put under mental stress due to being homeless is like saying you find sunburn on people who sunbath without sun screen.

I already know the number one cause of homeless is family breakdown, I don't need some avatar chasing his tail cyphering through Google hoping for find something to back up their false claim to know that. The mere fact you have struggled to find two sources that don't back up your claim at all and one of which you couldn't even read unless you subscribed is all the evidence I need to know you are chatting shit.
#15166648
Julian658 wrote:No need to google what is easily observable.
:roll: Said every conspiracy theorist ever.

You know that this isn't an argument, right? It just tells us what YOU believe.


People with poor mental health are more susceptible to the three main factors that can lead to homelessness: poverty, disaffiliation, and personal vulnerability. Because they often lack the capacity to sustain employment, they have little income.

Homelessness, in turn, amplifies poor mental health. The stress of experiencing homelessness may exacerbate previous mental illness and encourage anxiety, fear, depression, sleeplessness and substance use.

https://www.homelesshub.ca/about-homele ... ance%20use.
#15166654
There is also the simple fact that we can end homelessness now.

We have the resources. We have the technology.

The main reason we have not done so is the same reason we gave not fed the hungry it provided necessary medical care to everyone: there is no way for the people with the money to make more money off it.
#15166656
B0ycey wrote:AGAIN NO CAUSE!

Not that I could read all of it being it was behind a subscription wall. Saying you will find mental health issues in homeless people who are put under mental stress due to being homeless is like saying you find sunburn on people who sunbath without sun screen.

I already know the number one cause of homeless is family breakdown, I don't need some avatar chasing his tail cyphering through Google hoping for find something to back up their false claim to know that. The mere fact you have struggled to find two sources that don't back up your claim at all and one of which you couldn't even read unless you subscribed is all the evidence I need to know you are chatting shit.


OK, POD you win. It is not an issue for me if you believe losing one'e home causes mental illness. The problem remains the same.
#15166661
B0ycey wrote:Perhaps, although it does mean it is preventable.


Well, not having a home sure is a deep problem. For getting social services, for applying for steady paycheck jobs, or scheduling and appointments, for storing food in a fridge and being able to cook at home and not spend in restaurants and fast food joints, and for every single problem having to do with stability.

It sure as hell doesn't promote feeling safe and protected.
#15166662
Tainari88 wrote:Well, not having a home sure is a deep problem. For getting social services, for applying for steady paycheck jobs, or scheduling and appointments, for storing food in a fridge and being able to cook at home and not spend in restaurants and fast food joints, and for every single problem having to do with stability.

It sure as hell doesn't promote feeling safe and protected.


Well that is indeed the issue isn't it? Yet people would rather blame the misfortune of others solely on them rather than actually look into why things are what they are. That is why I asked for evidence to back their claims up. It was a notion backed by feelings rather than evidence and the tail chasing was frankly embarrassing and I knew they wouldn't be able to come back with anything because I already knew the number one cause for homelessness was family breakdown.
#15166663
B0ycey wrote:Source please or does America have a huge problem of mental illness?

Apart from this main issue being lack of housing, the "NUMBER ONE" reason for homelessness is relationship breakdown. Then other common factors are abuse, debt, being made redundant, things like that. Becoming crazy pigeon lady is never the reason anyone become homeless. Mental illness is a symptom not a cause for homelessness. I think you have been reading Julians posts and thinking they are a viable source. He doesn't know what he is talking about so if you too claim mental illness is the number one cause for homelessness I want to read the source why you think that is.

I used to work with the homeless population. The #1 cause was child abuse/neglect. Because when that happens, teens run away and live on the streets, or as children are taken from their homes and put in foster homes or group homes they don't like and run away. So these people have zero home support or financial support from parents like most of us did growing up. And to deal with their emotional problems they very often turn to drugs and become addicts, and don't finish high school, and their family is on the street.

Mental illness is a major factor too. Those in these situations with mental illness,, especially schizophrenia, are unable to maintain employment or relationships, and will have a very hard time getting off the streets, and will use drugs to self-medicate. You can't force someone to take proper medications, so they're trapped.

In southern California there are unique problems because of the high influx of Hispanic asylum seekers who don't have legal status or skills so obviously some will end up homeless.
#15166664
B0ycey wrote:Perhaps, although it does mean it is preventable.

Sure, homelessness worsens the mental issues, no doubt. That is not my issue.

Humans exist in a hierarchy of competence and some people align themselves at the bottom and end up in the gutter. It is our moral duty to help. The question is how?

I suggest building homes in the country side and give the homeless people the job of maintaining the homes and the cafeteria as well as the gym, the swimming pool, and the golf course. In other words they would receive a salary to maintain the compound. I have no problems with that.

However, don't put them in tents in the major cities. Don't provide syringes and drugs. If they do crime put them in jail; do not release them next day. I don't want to walk sidewalks full of human feces.

If i was king I would command my subjects to promote the concept of family values. People with good families never go homeless.
#15166665
Unthinking Majority wrote:I used to work with the homeless population. The #1 cause was child abuse/neglect.


So not mental health which was the claim you made that I brought up? :?:

Child abuse is perhaps the reason minors are on the street. It was when I spoken to them in any case. Although they aren't as common in the UK as adult males on the street because when they are found they are instantly taken into Foster care due to their age. The number one cause of people on the street is family breakdown.
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