Putin’s oriental imperialism turns European neighbors into enemies - Page 5 - Politics Forum.org | PoFo

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#15171489
litwin wrote:Turkey is a NATO country , and it always possible to strike a deal with Turks, and they will hold it , meanwhile Moscow ulus never follow the agreements. I expect the huge economic problem in Turkey due to AKP soft Islamist politic , so they will return to its pro - westren kemalist pattern


Turkey is attacking another NATO & EU member, if you are going to support Turkish aggression why should anybody care about Russian aggression against you?

It is not possible for Europe and the EU even more especially to ignore one aggression over another; Greece and Cyprus are members of the EU and NATO, the Ukraine is neither, which means that sanctions against Russia for Ukraine are not possible to come before sanctions against Turkey for Cyprus and Greece. This is both logical and the actual reality on the ground as the EU wrangles with these issues.
#15171508
noemon wrote:Turkey is attacking another NATO & EU member, if you are going to support Turkish aggression why should anybody care about Russian aggression against you?

It is not possible for Europe and the EU even more especially to ignore one aggression over another; Greece and Cyprus are members of the EU and NATO, the Ukraine is neither, which means that sanctions against Russia for Ukraine are not possible to come before sanctions against Turkey for Cyprus and Greece. This is both logical and the actual reality on the ground as the EU wrangles with these issues.



i don't support Turkish aggression against EU/NATO members , i say that its possible to talk with AKP , make deal with Amkara . but the fact is Turkey part of NATO , was for many years western ally and historical enemy of Moscow
#15171512
noemon wrote:The reason that they are going towards right-wing governments is because Europeans have been appeasing Putin and Erdogan, especially Erdogan with the refugees and migrants. The only way to survive in the political landscape is to stop appeasing these people and take more affirmative action.





I have to agree with you that appeasement is a problem, and can cause long term problems. The handling of the refugee crisis by EU has been less than satisfactory. It does point to certain systemic failures in the EU structure. At the moment the EU comes across as a Confederation with a very weak government at the Federal level.
#15171625
litwin wrote:i don't support Turkish aggression against EU/NATO members , i say that its possible to talk with AKP , make deal with Amkara . but the fact is Turkey part of NATO , was for many years western ally and historical enemy of Moscow


It is a question of overall behavior in such situations. Noemon is correct at stating that if we don't keep Turkey in check and make them accountable for their aggression then it will be much harder in case of Russia who is not part of NATO.

To a large degree what Erdogan does and what Putin does is not that different. They have relatively the same economic, foreign and cultural policies that just are adapted for their own peoples cultural preferences.

Erdogan likes big infrastructure projects and crony nepotism, Putin is the same. Erdogan likes foreign wars to boost his popularity, Putin is the same. Erdogan has his religious "fever" while Putin uses cultural ideas like Gagarin and the victory in 2nd world war in the same way.

Before Putin and Erdogan it was much less so.
#15171630
JohnRawls wrote:It is a question of overall behavior in such situations. Noemon is correct at stating that if we don't keep Turkey in check and make them accountable for their aggression then it will be much harder in case of Russia who is not part of NATO.

To a large degree what Erdogan does and what Putin does is not that different. They have relatively the same economic, foreign and cultural policies that just are adapted for their own peoples cultural preferences.

Erdogan likes big infrastructure projects and crony nepotism, Putin is the same. Erdogan likes foreign wars to boost his popularity, Putin is the same. Erdogan has his religious "fever" while Putin uses cultural ideas like Gagarin and the victory in 2nd world war in the same way.

Before Putin and Erdogan it was much less so.

start the thread about Erdogan so we dont need to switch our subject which is Moscow horde´s colonial wars , and of cos Erdogan (known in MENA under the name : "watermelon seller" ) is not even close with Putin´s level. thats by Turkey is part of NATO meanwhile Moscow is our N1 enemy

"Joe Biden says Moscow , not China, is greatest threat to 2020 election"
https://eu.usatoday.com/story/news/poli ... 718496002/

"Canada and the West are at war with Moscow whether they want it or not: military experts"
https://globalnews.ca/news/6629804/russ ... da-allies/
#15171632
litwin wrote:start the thread about Erdogan so we dont need to switch our subject which is Moscow horde´s colonial wars , and of cos Erdogan (known in MENA under the name : "watermelon seller" ) is not even close with Putin´s level. thats by Turkey is part of NATO meanwhile Moscow is our N1 enemy


No that is not right, Erdogan is more of an enemy for the EU & NATO than Putin because Erdogan is attacking EU and NATO members, while Putin is not. If sanctions are not activated for EU & NATO members, then no sanctions will be activated for non-EU and non-NATO members.

The one follows the other and that is how the EU is approaching the matter as well.
RIP John McAfee....

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