Doug64 wrote:You do understand the difference between droplet- and aerosol-spread disease, right? The difference is why all those plastic shields businesses have put up might be worse than useless--while they protect against droplets just fine, they also interfere with air circulation and so can cause exposure to the aerosol-carried virus to be increased. And guess what is the the primary means of spread for the Wuhan virus is?
QatzelOk wrote:I read your post twice, and I'm still not scared. Even though you tried to scare me (and all readers).
Maybe you can incorporate scary images and end-of-days quotes from the usual suspects next time?
Drlee wrote:Soooo. It is supposed to be a good thing that Swedes do not wear a mask?
Well. No wonder there is no Intertel chapter in Sweden.
boomerintown wrote:That was a little bit of a joke. But my point is more that Sweden is an extreme in one end, while countries like France, Italy, Spain and so on is in the other. But the spread is far worse in the latter countries.
But Norway is probably a better example, since the spread is so extremly small there, even though relativly few people wear masks. Obviously there are a lot of factors which makes it a lot easier for Norway to keep it down compared to France, but the degree that masks effect it? I just dont see it.
Its a reasonable theory if you just look at the risk when comparing two people shaking hands with masks and two people shaking hands without masks all else equal.
But when looking at issues regarding society as a whole isnt a something you can understand through isolated cases such as this. There are tons of factors involved that you dont see and wont take into account if you try to base your understanding through this way.
This is why instead of trying to make some deduction based on a premise you set up you should look at whats actually seems to be going on and from that try to explain it. So, basically the reversed way from "obviously masks protect, thats why people use them in healthcare".
Where can we see the patterns that seem to confirm the theory that masks make a large difference. This is what I still wonder? Perhaps there are similar states within USA you can compare where the degree of maskwearing differs significantly? That would be interesting.
But looking at european countries I cant see any pattern whatsoever that suggests masks is a key solution. You can also ask what happends when somebody eventually takes their masks off in public (perhaps to drink something) or the effect masks have on peoples behaviour (how carefull they are and so on).
boomerintown wrote:That I dont see any pattern on a macro level showing that masks matter in western countries.
Pants-of-dog wrote:Perhaps the reason you do not see any is because you have not looked.
Have you looked?
Pants-of-dog wrote:Why would we see a pattern in that graph?
It does not take into account things like infection rates.
If this is the only place you looked, then no, you did not look for it.
Godstud wrote:@boomerintown SE Asia has been far more successful than Western countries in battling Covid, and that is likely partly due to mask use.
Mask use makes a difference whether you believe it, or not.
Largest study of masks yet details their importance in fighting Covid-19
Scientists conducted a randomized trial across 600 villages and more than 340,000 people in Bangladesh and found that even some adoption of surgical masks made a difference.
https://www.nbcnews.com/science/science ... 9-rcna1858
boomerintown wrote:Well, it is you who are making the claim. "It is important that people wear masks.", so really the burden of evidence is on you. And yes I am trying to find patterns, but I cant find it.
But again, and this might be foreign to you, it is YOU who need to support your claims. Its not up to others to disprove you if you bring nothing to the table.
You made the argument that there is no “pattern on a macro level showing that masks matter in western countries”.
This seems to show that Sweden had high infection rates and low rates of wearing masks. This seems to provide evidence that there is a “pattern on a macro level showing that masks matter in western countries”.
boomerintown wrote:That is not my claim. I said I cant find any patterns, and therefore I am sceptical to how much difference it makes.
If you think this is pattern I dont know what to say. It is one datapoint. You see patterns by looking at several datapoints. You find high spread country, but also several very low spread countries with extremly small level of mask wearing. Meanwhile you find several high wearing mask countries with large spread. If you seriously think you see a pattern on this image suggestion that mask wearing place a role I think this discussion is pointless.
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