Huawei's Meng Wanzhou flies back to China after deal with US - Page 2 - Politics Forum.org | PoFo

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#15192346
The article wrote:China is a friendly country and a country ruled by law."
The article said that, @Rugoz, not I. Your emotions are irrelevant.

I could squawk about the US justice system in the same manner. 2,504 death row Americans are on death row.

5 people were killed this year, by the death penalty in USA. The justice system is pretty much a carbon copy of China.
#15192361
Rugoz wrote:The death penalty in the US is a crime, but China kills thousands a year while the US kills a handful.


The US is not a carbon copy of China on the death penalty. :lol:

23 states have a ban, 3 have a moratorium. More than half of the US does not practice the death penalty. Others will (hopefully) follow to ban/minimize its use.

A more fundamental thing is that in the US, there is a growing and openly vocal population that is against the death penalty. Those states that do practice it, are open about it, it's known and in the open, and the media is invited to report on it (as well as report on how horrible it is). I would venture a guess that people in China cannot protest against the death penalty, or rather, would think twice about it. I'd like to see this kind of protest in front of Tienanmen square :lol: . Where as in the US, I can openly protest right in front of the Texas capital building (this happens very often actually, others protesting the death penalty that is, not me personally), and not fear any repercussion or censorship from the government. The outlook on the death penalty in the US is far more positive than that in China. To not see how plainly obvious this is, is the definition of bias.

When people do these "the US is worst at XXXXX than YYYYYY" kinds of arguments. They often gloss so much, that it's a joke when you peel just one layer back of what they are saying. These "arguments" are very disingenuous most of the time on pofo. That's not to say there aren't plenty of things the US does horribly and wrongly, but fuck, have a little objectivity for once.
#15192694
Fasces wrote:The death penalty is hardly the worst aspect of the US justice system, or even, in the context of routine extrajudicial police violence, even the most homicidal.


Given how many people China kills "legally", I woudn't be surprised if the extrajudicial killings are an order of magnitude higher.

Needless to say the rule of law is important regardless of the death penality practiced in both the US and China.

Chinastud started that stupid distraction.
#15192702
Rugoz wrote:Given how many people China kills "legally", I woudn't be surprised if the extrajudicial killings are an order of magnitude higher.

Needless to say the rule of law is important regardless of the death penality practiced in both the US and China.

Chinastud started that stupid distraction.

Chinese cops don't carry guns. The only time I've seen cops with guns in China was at a big wholesale clothing and textile market, there were pairs of cops around with empty pistols (the partner is responsible for holding the ammo).

I don't mind your anti death penalty stance by any means, but it isn't so much a litness test, either.

The US 'justice' and policing systems are awful, as you had ought to know.
#15192703
Rugoz wrote:Given how many people China kills "legally", I woudn't be surprised if the extrajudicial killings are an order of magnitude higher.
Yes because you increase the magnitude of everything to do with China and decrease it when it comes to America. That's obvious, and your constant propaganda is tiring. Nevermind the facts, right?

Rugoz wrote:Needless to say the rule of law is important regardless of the death penality practiced in both the US and China.
That's one of the only true things you've said so far.

It seems that the people who have actually lived in, or been to China, have a significantly different view of it, than the Western anti-Chinese propaganda devouring shmucks.

The distraction is fools who think they know so much because they've bought all the propaganda. Get my name right, FOOL. Just because I am not anti-China, doesn't mean I support their government. I also didn't bring up the subject, @Rugoz.

Then again, isn't this thread about justice and law? People were already comparing the two justice systems.
#15192710
Godstud wrote:Yes because you increase the magnitude of everything to do with China and decrease it when it comes to America. That's obvious, and your constant propaganda is tiring. Nevermind the facts, right?


:eh:

I was talking about the particular case this thread, namely the prosecution of Meng and the Chinese response.

You came up with "5 people were killed this year, by the death penalty in USA". Totally unrelated.

Then I said the death penalty in China kills thousands:

China remained the world’s leading executioner – but the true extent of the use of the death penalty in China is unknown as this data is classified as a state secret; the global figure of at least 483 excludes the thousands of executions believed to have been carried out in China.


https://www.amnesty.org/en/latest/press ... d-figures/

My only speculation was the number of extrajudicial killings.

Godstud wrote:It seems that the people who have actually lived in, or been to China, have a significantly different view of it, than the Western anti-Chinese propaganda devouring shmucks.


Yeah I'm sure expats in America have a great time too. What is that supposed to prove? :roll:

Godstud wrote:Then again, isn't this thread about justice and law? People were already comparing the two justice systems.


Yeah, isn't it? I was comparing it.
#15192712
How is executing people who have had the chance to defend themselves in court and appeal their sentence more worthy of criticism than killing them extra-judiciously?

The mental gymnastics people perform is incredible.
#15192715
AFAIK wrote:How is executing people who have had the chance to defend themselves in court and appeal their sentence more worthy of criticism than killing them extra-judiciously?

The mental gymnastics people perform is incredible.


Killing people extra-judiciously in the US is more often than not a heat of the moment decision, while executions by the State is cold-blooded murder. There are cases were both can be warranted, in both China and the US, but I'm going to say from the sidelines that both countries have severe problems.

The US should not be throwing stones seeing as how they created the circumstances of police killings and their ridiculous incarceration rates. Poverty/inequality, racism, neglect, poorly trained and undisciplined police that have historically and presently been shielded from accountability. The list goes on.

It is weak sauce propaganda to try and use this against China with this Cold War antics but that's were we are.
#15192748
After 2008 the only bank that was prosecuted was a mom and pop outfit run by Chinese migrants. After Iran was sanctioned the only person prosecuted was the Chinese leader of a Chinese company. China only pursued politically motivated prosecutions in response to the USA. Just like the USA only did regime change in Nicaragua after the USSR did so elsewhere.

Am I right @Rugoz?
#15192869
Rugoz wrote:China sentenced 4 Canadians to death. The US sentenced nobody. That woman was never convicted of anything. Only a court can do that.

That distinction means a ton to me and if it doesn't to you I frankly don't give a shit.

You suggesting nothing punitive or harmful happened to her being detained and stuff?

The Canadians might came out ahead. They could have been busted as non-political pawns in differing circumstances, and not released.
#15192880
Rugoz wrote:Bullshit, it's obviously not a carbon copy. They could hardly be more dissimilar.

The death penalty in the US is a crime, but China kills thousands a year while the US kills a handful.


Like already shown, US kills thousands a year too, but before they even make it into a courtroom. :lol:

Per capita China is a much safer place, both from crime and the long arm of the law.
#15192995
Patrickov wrote:The Chinese are merely being more subservient / easily brainwashed, or simply downright wicked.

To put it simply, a whole bunch of "Little Pink".


This is only the kind of misconception you'd have if you've never been there and spoken to them. Most are far more politics savvy and aware than anglosphere westerners, as hundreds of millions have travelled to the west, whereas the anglo world sticks to its little bubble.

The most propagandized populations are those found in US. I can attest to this firsthand. British are just assholes and willfully arrogant. Americans are simply ignorant of what others think and all too readily swallow their respective two party conditioning. Most Chinese are not this way and demand results not words.
#15192997
Igor Antunov wrote:This is only the kind of misconception you'd have if you've never been there and spoken to them. Most are far more politics savvy and aware than anglosphere westerners, as hundreds of millions have travelled to the west, whereas the anglo world sticks to its little bubble.

The most propagandized populations are those found in US. I can attest to this firsthand. British are just assholes and willfully arrogant. Americans are simply ignorant of what others think.

I don't often necessarily agree nor disagree with Igor. I mean, not to say I frequently disagree with him, but he can got on his reactionary/trolling ticks.

I agree with him a lot in this thread.

Just my opinion, and I am not the all knower of things, and am frequently capable of being wrong, just my opinion.

Most Chinese are probably in a bubble of sorts, and very many Chinese can be distastefully jingoistic.

Americans though, are a bit like Igor has described.

A lot of great people in America though, a lot of great people in China, frankly a lot of great people all over.

That is part of the tragedy of politics and nationalism.

Much of it is really all about dividing people for political reasons, not divide and conquer per se, often it's the fostering of tribalism bullshit.
#15193065
Igor Antunov wrote:This is only the kind of misconception you'd have if you've never been there and spoken to them.


I have spoken to a fucking lot of Chinese (hell, I am myself one), and I have a few Chinese friends.

You are the one standing far away and yet spewing China apologism shit.
Some others in this thread are apparently in similar situation that they fall for your lies.
#15193121
Patrickov wrote:I have spoken to a fucking lot of Chinese (hell, I am myself one), and I have a few Chinese friends.

You are the one standing far away and yet spewing China apologism shit.
Some others in this thread are apparently in similar situation that they fall for your lies.


Your apparent hatred is only fueled by the Anglo - propaganda campaign in full swing. Consent is being manufactured and you're swallowing every last drop. You aren't actually engaging in any kind of independent analysis, this is all conditioning talking. I might as well be responding to a script or algorithm. You aren't self aware when it comes to this topic. It's fun pushing buttons and seeing how you lash out though.
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