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Crime and prevention thereof. Loopholes, grey areas and the letter of the law.
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By Puffer Fish
#15194215
A group of seven people escaped from prison and then went on to commit two robberies after they realized they were fugitives and the only way they could obtain money to live on was to steal it. During the second robbery, a police officer who was responding to the scene was killed.

All seven of the escaped prisoners were blamed for the death, and they were all sentenced to the death penalty.

Texas was traditionally very punitive against criminals.

The question that will be posed here is, is this really fair? Is this really justice?

You could argue the authorities could not really know which of the robbers had committed the murder, so they should all be punished. But is the death penalty excessive, not knowing which one of them exactly it was who committed the killing?

And this is just a hypothetical, but suppose it turned out that one of the prisoners may likely have been innocent in the first place. Should we feel sympathetic towards that prisoner, knowing that taking part in a robbery was the only way for them to survive? Should that prisoner still get the death penalty?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Texas_Seven
https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/crime/ju ... d=msedgntp
By Patrickov
#15194625
Unless the place has capital punishment abolished I don't see any problem here.

1. From what's said in Wikipedia they probably collectively decided to kill Hawkins to save their own asses. Are you actually expecting this to be a "one live for one live" case?

2. As for "robbery to survive"... well, why did they break out in the first place? (Don't get me wrong, I also see little need to obey bad laws, but I acknowledge the necessity to consider the consequences nevertheless)
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By Potemkin
#15194629
Puffer Fish wrote:A group of seven people escaped from prison and then went on to commit two robberies after they realized they were fugitives and the only way they could obtain money to live on was to steal it. During the second robbery, a police officer who was responding to the scene was killed.

All seven of the escaped prisoners were blamed for the death, and they were all sentenced to the death penalty.

Texas was traditionally very punitive against criminals.

The question that will be posed here is, is this really fair? Is this really justice?

Is it fair? Who knows? Define what you mean by the word 'fair'.

Is this really justice? Yes, in the sense that it is in accord with the letter and the customs of the Texan justice system. Is it 'just' in some transcendental, abstract sense? Who knows? Define what you mean by the word 'just'.

You could argue the authorities could not really know which of the robbers had committed the murder, so they should all be punished. But is the death penalty excessive, not knowing which one of them exactly it was who committed the killing?

It was a joint enterprise, so they were all legally guilty of the murder.

And this is just a hypothetical, but suppose it turned out that one of the prisoners may likely have been innocent in the first place. Should we feel sympathetic towards that prisoner, knowing that taking part in a robbery was the only way for them to survive? Should that prisoner still get the death penalty?

That would be for the legal system to decide. According to the letter of the law, then yes, he should still get the death penalty. Being innocent of the offence for which he was in prison does not give him carte blanche to commit further crimes. Being innocent is not a 'get out of jail free' card if you later commit real crimes.
By late
#15194630
Puffer Fish wrote:

The question that will be posed here is, is this really fair? Is this really justice?




Good question.

I am opposed to the death penalty, as is my state. So you could add a bit of fairness by taking death off the table. Justice is not supposed to be revenge, and the death penalty is obviously motivated by revenge.

The next issue is the assignment of guilt, I think most states will attach guilt to a party to a crime even when they weren't the ones doing the killing. I don't have a problem with that.
When you knowingly enter a criminal conspiracy, you should be held responsible for the results.

That does it for me.

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