Meth and the homeless - Page 2 - Politics Forum.org | PoFo

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#15207771
Crantag wrote:The problem with addiction therapy is that it is sort of a one-size-fits-all approach, which doesn't work for everyone.

For some, it makes things worse.

I think decent housing and employment is the first start.

Neither of which I have.

I'm still working on being a functional addict, though.

You gotta do what you gotta do.

I think getting off drugs comes before employment and housing. Hard to keep a job as an addict. But either way good luck to you.

What i will say is this: homeless people are very strong people, I have worked with them before. They are survivors. They go through hell and live in squalor and many have suffered things like abuse and mental illness and shitty home lives and yet they keep living life and never give up, which is remarkable and to their credit as survivors.

Since you are that strong, you have to ask yourself: "Is this addiction stronger than I am? Does the addiction control me, or can I control the addiction?". Because this is the battle addicts face, a test of strength. I think you're stronger than the addiction and probably anything else the world can throw at you. So prove us all right when you're ready, and then come back and tell us.
#15207773
Unthinking Majority wrote:To be fair, the root cause of meth addiction is trying something extremely addictive like meth. The cure to stop meth addiction is to stop taking meth. I'm all for providing state-funded help for people trying to get off the drugs.

I guess some people don't have great parents to teach them these things, but unfortunately the government nor society can't ensure dad sticks around or mom is never a fool or little johnny isn't foolish, which is exactly why many people end up on the street. I think the anti-drug ad campaigns of the 80's/90's were at least something though, & that they should bring back.


From my personal experience, it seems that the reasons for drug addiction are complex, and are almost certainly more complicated than merely choosing to try it one day.

To illustrate this complexity, let us look at one related problem and how it relates to meth addiction: homelessness.

There was homelessness before there was meth. So, it would be incorrect to say that all homelessness is caused by meth addiction. At the same time, it is almost certainly correct to assume that some homelessness is caused by meth addiction as well as other drug abuse problems. So sometimes meth addiction causes homelessness, and sometimes it does not.

It would also make sense to assume sone non-zero number of homeless people turn to meth to deal with some of the trauma f homelessness, and to also assume that other homeless people do not end up addicted to meth.

And we can do this with things like mental health, childhood trauma, unemployment, and a host of other factors.
#15207777
Unthinking Majority wrote:I think getting off drugs comes before employment and housing. Hard to keep a job as an addict. But either way good luck to you.

What i will say is this: homeless people are very strong people, I have worked with them before. They are survivors. They go through hell and live in squalor and many have suffered things like abuse and mental illness and shitty home lives and yet they keep living life and never give up, which is remarkable and to their credit as survivors.

Since you are that strong, you have to ask yourself: "Is this addiction stronger than I am? Does the addiction control me, or can I control the addiction?". Because this is the battle addicts face, a test of strength. I think you're stronger than the addiction and probably anything else the world can throw at you. So prove us all right when you're ready, and then come back and tell us.


The bills don't pay themselves.

I don't do drugs, except the drugs cigarettes, alcohol, and marijuana, which I basically do as much as I can.

I live in a broke down RV, with a leaky roof, and no facilities, except for a propane burner.

I have a bad drinking habit, and this RV drives me to drinking, but now I'm just bullshitting.

I've been around hard drug use, but I never indulged, and hope I never do.
#15207894
late wrote:But you aroused my curiosity, if you won't allow tents, and we've ruled out jails, where would you put them?


last year I've made interesting homelessness thread elsewhere and think in same manner should be resolved the issue with homeless addicts ie. Rural Communes but with some fast free lrt or bus transport to the cities, in which case tent urban ghettos would be illegal, probably those that will get sober or find job could apply for city housing, eventually this kind of solution could be good reminder for all kids that city dwelling bears responsibility tho in case the same is lost there is still hope, unlike nowadays when the hope rests on ditch survival!

https://[No advertising]/threads/why-spending-billions-on-social-housing.241305/
#15207967
far from dumb, more dumber is giving them flat but no means to survive, while as rural communes they would get chance for socialization and fun with the same amount of funds, still there should be gradation even among communes so would not pop up animosity, maybe choice even on ethnic base altho this looks unhuman segregative unsocial at first hand but addicts are almost stuck on tribal level so its more convenient safe and rewarding for them to have big emphasis on belongingness, actually for all of us but even more for those that are fragile category of citizens, after all this kind of idea as implementation will pass many trial&error phases eg. maybe its more useful for some categories of addicts and homeless to be introduced aggressiveness limit or potential for entrance, those with Kids would need separate reality too etc. etc. for sure there is nothing ideal but alone removing all those fringe societal groups from the concrete jungle should be rewarding for them, tho without secure free and fast transport that will be not case, eventually this kind of reasoning should be offered to many low-income families, but stewalism (as I am designating capitalism) and that will be not allowed even as idea, I refuse to think that the same didnt pop up in California but alone police budget and preparedness will be not on current level if this kind of homelessness management would be introduced aside the lucrative construction deals for some elites through the current social housing skim!
By late
#15207992
Odiseizam wrote:
far from dumb




The South is infamous for it's work gangs. Civilised countries don't allow it.

Think Portugal..
#15208008
my proposition is endless possibility, still portuguese fields of Cannabis Sativa are surely nice thing :) exactly such communes will need to shine as healing herb retreats, tho it could be tried promotion of urban proxy joints where communers will have where to rest while going on city pilgrimage, altho for such wast system of homelessness management there is need for greater diversity of co'op's on different levels like producers retailers or ngo'ers, but just like dwellers of some natural spot or even reserve can reach status of special belongingness which will give them extra meaning in their life not just mere sheltering opportunity, so think many will embrace such offer without hesitance, normally if the same is neatly planned executed and functioning, yet in the end other will choose life less ordinary like city hobos but still when the statistical burden will be easen by mass rural emigration of the city homeless surely there will be greater space professional hobos to be serviced even just in charitable way, hm isnt the american village decimated, so this is opportunity to advertise if not push awareness for farming selfsufficiency of the low-income class to seek refuge in nature agriculturally, hm hm hm I am just not sure whether would ever the american plutocracy allow such mass diversification and dispersion of the poor population outside the concrete jungle, problematic also from security reasons or bureaucratic obstacles - the bipartisan social housing contractors comes to mind, dont tell me there is no corruption in usA :)
By late
#15208009
Odiseizam wrote:
my proposition is endless possibility, still portuguese fields of Cannabis Sativa are surely nice thing :) exactly such communes will need to shine as healing herb retreats, tho it could be tried promotion of urban proxy joints where communers will have where to rest while going on city pilgrimage, altho for such wast system of homelessness management there is need for greater diversity of co'op's on different levels like producers retailers or ngo'ers, but just like dwellers of some natural spot or even reserve can reach status of special belongingness which will give them extra meaning in their life not just mere sheltering opportunity, so think many will embrace such offer without hesitance, normally if the same is neatly planned executed and functioning, yet in the end other will choose life less ordinary like city hobos but still when the statistical burden will be easen by mass rural emigration of the city homeless surely there will be greater space professional hobos to be serviced even just in charitable way, hm isnt the american village decimated, so this is opportunity to advertise if not push awareness for farming selfsufficiency of the low-income class to seek refuge in nature agriculturally, hm hm hm I am just not sure whether would ever the american plutocracy allow such mass diversification and dispersion of the poor population outside the concrete jungle, problematic also from security reasons or bureaucratic obstacles - the bipartisan social housing contractors comes to mind, dont tell me there is no corruption in usA



Have you ever been here?

Most places wouldn't allow your hippy communes, assuming any government would want to do that (which they wouldn't).

But the places that did allow such a thing would be the crappiest places to live, like rural Texas.

Tell me, is this some idle fantasy, a troll, or do you really want to be Mao Ver. 2.0???
#15208033
You can label this kind of reasoning as You like, but that will not change the fact that the current servicing of the homeless in usA is total debacle, tho probably in whole western realm even Portugal ...

    Please be smarter, I dont see how You've found hippie communes in my proposal, normally that there should be hierarchy, even surveillance and social workers when problematic groups are in question, probably You didnt grasp the flow when suggested that such model should be offered even to low income persons and families, which mean more adopting the model to more thoughtful ways [1] I am suggesting instead throwing 100k for social flat (as now is doing eg. California) making for two millions decent eco barracks ~ maybe even strawbale housing depending of the climate region, in which place for sure could housed more than 100 people instead 30 like now, aside the fact that the rural dwellings would be spacier but also tied to some agricultural hype normally backed by communal machinery ring eventually as such at disposal from/at the local county etc. etc.

Your projection that this kind of places will be crappiest thing only go on hand for greater urban ghettoization and deviance of the homeless even more those that are addicts which are more than half of those living on streets, waiting all those to be housed normally is like waiting on squatting to become privilege what will never become issue, tho maybe You'll prefer as suggested earlier "mass murder", are seeing maybe too much horror movies lately :) avoid listening to death metal so would not come to ritual incarceration! Chill Out but life can become bitch if continue wearing selfish glasses, causality in this world is very very strange thing!
#15208054
You should check the Maslow Pyramid [1][1][1] on which first level are still lost the homeless in usA altho at spot is the richest country in the world, the current system is useful only to few of the addict hobos and mostly as charitable moment tho many dont even get to sober stage and get help as consequence, meth or fentanyl addictions are among the worst one so offering secure shelter (to those chewed up by them) with more than basic necessities but in communal way is more lasting solution if not else, and if pushed with constant wide public debate thus like that constantly tweaked think can loosen extra the current urban zombie burden, tho I accept that at first this could look like kind of class gentrification, stil who will refuse chance for normal life if its offered in exchange for street unsecurity, yet eligible should be those willing to make rehab promise ...

... but as I can see as always usA was seeing how easier to dismiss those that are unfit for normal citizens, pushing them more and more to the margins in different ways, almost waiting to commit suicide with their way of life, the problem is that this kind of reasoning is not useful anymore cpz the tsunami of homeless addicts, hm just imagine how that number will double if stagflation and as consequence deeper crisis emerge, having this kind of idea at lest on paper would not hurt noone, maybe your exceptional thread ego :)

I was really lucky when I've went down the drain (with heroin, and methadone day after) first coz in 90s opioids were dirt cheap but also coz I had have comfortable home and above all will to shift again back to sport as abstinence preoccupation, tho what made huge difference was that have always new sober band to hang around, if one of these things was out of place probably I would been recovering for long time instead wasting only three years as addict, tho my addiction and recovery was happy one i.e. not going on state program where many were postponing recovery coz all the accompanied psychiatric drugs that go along methadone! now, the same luck will not have all those in communes but at least many will escape the cycle of violence molesting and above all disrespect aside the hunger and lost cause for living like normal people ... but I really cant tell what is the best way for selecting compatible groups for particular type of rural commune ...
#15208677
Potemkin wrote:“That’s libertarians for you - anarchists who want police protection from their slaves.” - Kim Stanley Robinson


And the slaves in this instance would be larcenous meth heads?
By late
#15208683
Odiseizam wrote:
You can label this kind of reasoning as You like, but that will not change the fact that the current servicing of the homeless in usA is total debacle, tho probably in whole western realm even Portugal ...

    Please be smarter, I dont see how You've found hippie communes in my proposal, normally that there should be hierarchy, even surveillance and social workers when problematic groups are in question, probably You didnt grasp the flow when suggested that such model should be offered even to low income persons and families, which mean more adopting the model to more thoughtful ways [1] I am suggesting instead throwing 100k for social flat (as now is doing eg. California) making for two millions decent eco barracks ~ maybe even strawbale housing depending of the climate region, in which place for sure could housed more than 100 people instead 30 like now, aside the fact that the rural dwellings would be spacier but also tied to some agricultural hype normally backed by communal machinery ring eventually as such at disposal from/at the local county etc. etc.

Your projection that this kind of places will be crappiest thing only go on hand for greater urban ghettoization and deviance of the homeless even more those that are addicts which are more than half of those living on streets, waiting all those to be housed normally is like waiting on squatting to become privilege what will never become issue, tho maybe You'll prefer as suggested earlier "mass murder", are seeing maybe too much horror movies lately :) avoid listening to death metal so would not come to ritual incarceration! Chill Out but life can become bitch if continue wearing selfish glasses, causality in this world is very very strange thing!



Was that for me? You didn't specify who you were talking to, so no way to tell.

You also need to work on your writing, sorry, but it's a mess.

Third, you didn't answer my questions.

Fourth, we are not going to repeat Mao's mistake. That is not only crazy, but a lot of illegal drugs are made in rural areas. Illegal drub labs would pop up around your communes in a matter of weeks, and if they can sneak drugs into prisons, getting them past the guards keeping the druggies in your prison/commune won't be hard.

Finally, I get the feeling you've never been here, have no idea at all how things work, and have a knack for picking solutions that would quickly turn into a massive clusterf*ck.
#15209222
1. through You to all usA :)

2. poetry in motion ...

3. yes astral ... I am not suggesting HC approach ... crappy can be something left on its own to selfregulate as homeless commune so security should be somehow managed ...

4. mao 2.o communes in usA will be possible only if the current plutocracy turn to commie technocracy till then we can speak only for standardization of "mid'free" instead libertarian or totalitarian communes, by mid free implying regulated by the states homeless communes with accent on agrarianism which in case of addict one will be on level of recovery program while the regular one will have opportunity for co'op's in kibbutz style ...

5. your opinion is relevant till we will see expert 24/7 debate on institutional eforums hopefully in near future otherwise the plutocratic skims will push for eugenic solutions like silent ostracism in rural trenches, I am on contrary suggesting an rural refuge as public choice for all that are homeless ~ having there guaranteed at least socio'cultural space with basic necessities, take example from every prosperous rural african village that has own water and solar'electricity potentially food production planning probably home schooling too etc. etc. ... be creative work around this concept as Agrarianism appealing even to many situated ...
User avatar
By Crantag
#15209808
late wrote:Was that for me? You didn't specify who you were talking to, so no way to tell.

You also need to work on your writing, sorry, but it's a mess.

Third, you didn't answer my questions.

Fourth, we are not going to repeat Mao's mistake. That is not only crazy, but a lot of illegal drugs are made in rural areas. Illegal drub labs would pop up around your communes in a matter of weeks, and if they can sneak drugs into prisons, getting them past the guards keeping the druggies in your prison/commune won't be hard.

Finally, I get the feeling you've never been here, have no idea at all how things work, and have a knack for picking solutions that would quickly turn into a massive clusterf*ck.

I'm rural, poor, and have more bills than money. Maybe I should convert my RV into a meth lab.
By late
#15209822
Crantag wrote:
I'm rural, poor, and have more bills than money. Maybe I should convert my RV into a meth lab.



Watch Breaking Bad first.
By late
#15209838
Crantag wrote:
Hey you got the reference. 5 points.



I watched a couple episodes, but that was it. I also have never watched mafia movies like the Godfather.

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