Gunman kills 19 children in Texas school shooting - Page 5 - Politics Forum.org | PoFo

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#15229659
Godstud wrote:Yes, you can. Their schools are far more open air and modular, with you walking outside to go to different classes. I am sure if you wandered around someone might come and ask if you needed help, with anything.

They also don't have school shootings.


Maybe they don't, at least in Chile I've never seen or heard of an open school and there are also no school shootings. I'd even say parents would complain immediately if the school allowed strangers in.

Also, being air open is not the same as being open to the public. I find it surprising to be honest.
#15229661
Teachers are normally teaching classes, and not wandering around. I am sure if they saw someone, they would approach them and talk to them, which is essentially what you are saying. The school gates are not locked during school hours, nor are they even closed.
#15229663
Godstud wrote:Teachers are normally teaching classes, and not wandering around. I am sure if they saw someone, they would approach them and talk to them, which is essentially what you are saying. The school gates are not locked during school hours, nor are they even closed.


Schools can have a security guard who manages the entrances. I don't get why do you think teachers would be doing this :?:
#15229664
@wat0n If it's not necessary, why have someone doing it? :eh:

You are proposing a solution for a problem that doesn't exist.

You're talking about American schools, where it's necessary because of all the social problems and school shootings.
#15229665
@wat0n distorting all that I say because he can't accept that the USA has defective shit in its history and its government policies. It is not the dream that his conservative visions tell him it is. No, Wat0n why don't you deal with the issues brought up about inequality and lack of democracy in action that the Neo-colony and AOC thread brought up? You said you would read it? You won't because YOU are the one that doesn't want to accept the USA government is about seeking power and shitting on democracy. It is about unjust access to a decent education regardless of income. Why do you refuse to accept this? It is easy. Tainari88 your right it is a shitty deal for many. I had no idea about it before reading up on it. Why is this such a hidden subject?

You won't because you are a hack for anything USA....who knows why? You want to make money and be here for that. I find that very predictable and a lack of backbone and independent thought. You are angry because I do criticize the government. Get used to that. Everyone has a right in an international politics forum to criticize governments. Especially nations that are making some terrible choices regarding human rights violations, inequality, and love of constant warfare.

That is the way it is @wat0n . You did not comment on the Finnish Spanish background teacher woman. She said it in Spanish, "LA IGUALDAD." If I were the same as the distortion KING you are? I would say "Why do you believe in kissing the USA government's ass? Is it because you are a sellout?" Really dude. Clean up your act! :D
Last edited by Tainari88 on 26 May 2022 00:59, edited 1 time in total.
#15229666
Godstud wrote:@wat0n If it's not necessary, why have someone doing it? :eh:

You are proposing a solution for a problem that doesn't exist.

You're talking about American schools, where it's necessary because of all the social problems and school shootings.


But the US government and American schools don't have shooting problems. Just active shooter drills because of a few random cases here and there. Not every single day. No, that would mean? OH SHIT GODSTUD? The country has an issue with guns. I did not know that. Because, as long as I am not affected by it? I don't care. I came to the USA to kiss ass and make a lot of money, and in Chile, I can't. So I kiss ass in the USA because? That is who I am.

I don't care which country it is. If someone brings up evidence and a valid point that is verifiable about what is going on in that government of that country? I won't be kissing the ass of some nation I think I need to defend in order to justify that the lies I believed are right about the nation. I never went for living in denial. That never worked for me in life. Living in denial doesn't work.
#15229668
Godstud wrote:@wat0n If it's not necessary, why have someone doing it? :eh:

You are proposing a solution for a problem that doesn't exist.

You're talking about American schools, where it's necessary because of all the social problems and school shootings.


So no parents lacking custody show up in a school to take their kid, ever, in Thailand?

This isn't just about shootings either.

Tainari88 wrote:@wat0n distorting all that I say because he can't accept that the USA has defective shit in its history and its government policies. It is not the dream that his conservative visions tell him it is. No, Wat0n why don't you deal with the issues brought up about inequality and lack of democracy in action that the Neo-colony and AOC thread brought up? You said you would read it? You won't because YOU are the one that doesn't want to accept the USA government is about seeking power and shitting on democracy. It is about unjust access to a decent education regardless of income. Why do you refuse to accept this? It is easy. Tainari88 your right it is a shitty deal for many. I had no idea about it before reading up on it. Why is this such a hidden subject?

You won't because you are a hack for anything USA....who knows why? You want to make money and be here for that. I find that very predictable and a lack of backbone and independent thought. You are angry because I do criticize the government. Get used to that. Everyone has a right in an international politics forum to criticize governments. Especially nations that are making some terrible choices regarding human rights violations, inequality, and love of constant warfare.

That is the way it is @wa0n. You did not comment on the Finnish Spanish background teacher woman. She said it in Spanish, "LA IGUALDAD." If I were the same as the distortion KING you are? I would say "Why do you believe in kissing USA government's ass? Is it because you are a sellout?" Really dude. Clean up your act! :D


I never said the US is perfect, just that it's good. And it is indeed, despite all its problems it's a far better place to live than any Latin American country. And no, I haven't read the stuff in the other thread because I haven't had time to.

Not that this has anything to do with school shootings, but again, you bring this up because you have your own axe to grind, and now with insults included - hence you need to hold the US to an absurdly high standard you would never subject your newfound home Merida, or Puerto Rico itself, to.

That doesn't mean one can't criticize the US. Indeed, my very first post ITT criticized how schools are being run when it comes to their security. But I'm calling a spade a spade here.

Tainari88 wrote:But the US government and American schools don't have shooting problems. Just active shooter drills because of a few random cases here and there. Not every single day. No, that would mean? OH SHIT GODSTUD? The country has an issue with guns. I did not know that. Because, as long as I am not affected by it? I don't care. I came to the USA to kiss ass and make a lot of money, and in Chile, I can't. So I kiss ass in the USA because? That is who I am.


And now with the personal attacks to boot. Are you mad about the fact that most Puerto Ricans would rather remain in the US than become independent despite all the USA's problems and despite your ramblings, @Tainari88?
#15229671
wat0n wrote:So no parents lacking custody show up in a school to take their kid, ever, in Thailand?
Different cultures have different social problems. That's not one of them.

wat0n wrote:This isn't just about shootings either.
It mostly is, as this is the topic of this thread.

wat0n wrote:And it is indeed, despite all its problems it's a far better place to live than any Latin American country.
That's your opinion, and I am sure many others won't agree with it.

wat0n wrote:Indeed, my very first post ITT criticized how schools are being run when it comes to their security.
You assume the same problems that the USA has exist in other places, and that is a false assumption.
#15229673
Godstud wrote:Different cultures have different social problems. That's not one of them.


Maybe. I'll admit I don't know much about Thai culture.

Godstud wrote:It mostly is, as this is the topic of this thread.


Mostly, but not only. Again, a school open to the public exposes students to all sorts of things that don't involve guns.

Godstud wrote:That's your opinion, and I am sure many others won't agree with it.


And many others will, including those of us who can compare.

Godstud wrote: You assume the same problems that the USA has exist in other places, and that is a false assumption.


No, I don't assume that in my criticism. It's valid not just for the USA and, indeed, many places don't allow strangers enter school premises.
#15229674
@wat0n, I am sure that if a person was just wandering around and if a teacher approached them and the stranger said that they were just wandering around, that they'd ask them to leave. Use your head. :roll:

@Tainari88 lives in Mexico and thinks it is better than USA. Last I checked, Mexico is a Latin American country.
#15229675
No @wat0n I don't have the vision you have about the USA. I am a separate person from you. I got a totally different perspective than you do. I don't expect people to agree with me. I never have. I expect in a debate forum to be presented with strong arguments. Not on beliefs about which nation is better than other nations. That kind of shit is not in any way intelligent. Power and the nations in or out of power over time and history vary. They play musical chairs. I don't see the way you see it at all. Why? Because I see human beings and who is in power. And who is not. Why do people who live in countries with class systems have to play by the rules and accept that some of the people wield power as a class over them and others don't? That is the way I think.

I don't think about Puerto Ricans all prefer. No. I think about why people leave their native countries. Like why did you leave yours? I never believed lies about Latin Americans are into power grabs and caudillos because it is part of the culture. That stuff was your statement. It is not about culture dude. It is about human beings with defects and need for power grabs and how did I prove it? Bringing you evidence of a plot for some generals to take over Washington DC because they disagreed with the policies of the government. It happened with the ANGLOS. Not with us. It happens with Africans and Asians and Europeans. So what does that mean @wat0n? It means that you accepted a theory that demeans your background and makes assertions that Latin Americans are naturally attracted to power grabs and dictatorship. You don't do any historical analysis or politically valid ones either. It is about knee jerk reactions about the lies someone fed you dude. It lets me know....you are defending a point of view that is not about human behavior in all groups. It is about wanting to believe in some fairy tale of what humanity is. It is a complex thing.

People in islands that have a specific history of colonization are not going to behave like Imperially minded people with enormous power and military might. Each human group acts according to their experiences, positions and history allows them to act. But in the end? All are human.

And all have the potential for greatness and enormous achievement, and disgrace and enormous shame and failure to be worthy of being called dignified and just people seeking equality in all of the human race.

I don't like many people who equate poverty and lack of money with inferior intellects or not having to respect that group. Because? It is false. Poor people are HUMAN. With all the potential all human beings have. If you start saying Latin America or Africa or parts of Europe, Asia and so on should be ignored and disrespected because they are not the most powerful and the most wealthy of them all? You make a grave mistake.

After all wasn't the USA supposed to be founded on the fact that people from poor and humble backgrounds can reach great achievements. If that is true? Then why even think that the other nations who are not rich or wealthy or spend billions on arms and bombs? Have nothing to offer the world?

I use real logic based on human behavior. Not on nationalistic shit or my socioeconomic status is the way it is because it is SUPERIOR it is JUSTICE. That is foolish shit @wat0n.

A lot of people leave Mississippi dude. Alabama too. Lately California. To other states. Does it mean those people don't love their native states? No. It means something is pushing them out of a place they invested a lot of time and energy in.

The issue you have is you want these flaws that we are criticizing to not damage whatever false ideas you got about the US government. I don't care about the image. I care about the facts. The fact is that the USA did not have constant school shootings. Now it does. WHY?

Something is happening. In the society. Teachers are not supposed to be security guards with guns. They get paid to teach. Not to do law enforcement. But the people with power to put some resources into prevention and policy changes to protect the public are not being successful. That kid in Texas still shot a bunch of children.

No one here is shooting children. Why? No one thinks teachers jobs here are to be armed and ready to take down shooters. That is crazy. No one talks about the 2nd amendment and why that might be outdated for the USA and the crazy thought that automatic weapons for military might not be a good idea to sell to many people who are not exactly sane or healthy in thought.

You piss me off with your lack of respecting what people actually say. You distort a lot @wat0n and you put words in the mouth of people who you are debating with. I don't live in denial dude. If you make a valid point I will acknowledge it. If you don't? And you lie on me again? I don't care. I will call you out on the denial shit!
#15229678
Tainari88 wrote:Something is happening. In the society. Teachers are not supposed to be security guards with guns. They get paid to teach. Not to do law enforcement. But the people with power to put some resources into prevention and policy changes to protect the public are not being successful.
QFT. This x1000.

Tainari88 wrote:No one here is shooting children. Why? No one thinks teachers jobs here are to be armed and ready to take down shooters. That is crazy. No one talks about the 2nd amendment and why that might be outdated for the USA and the crazy thought that automatic weapons for military might not be a good idea to sell to many people who are not exactly sane or healthy in thought.
Again, right on the money. It's a societal problem.
#15229680
Godstud wrote:@wat0n, I am sure that if a person was just wandering around and if a teacher approached them and the stranger said that they were just wandering around, that they'd ask them to leave. Use your head. :roll:

@Tainari88 lives in Mexico and thinks it is better than USA. Last I checked, Mexico is a Latin American country.


Godstud, most new immigrants applying for US citizenship again are from four countries. Two Asian nations and two Latin American ones. Why are they from that part of the world and not from the countries of the past with a lot of immigration like Germany, England and Scotland and Ireland and Italy? Simple. Those nations have stabilized. Most people leave their native countries because a catastrophe has befallen them. Like the Irish Potato Famine of 1848. Not because the Irish want to make so much money and become millionaires and that is why the vast majority of the Irish never did become millionaires in the USA and wound up being cops, factory workers, farmers and manual laborers, clerks and storekeepers.

I never have believed in some vision of perfect humanity. It is not possible. Humans are complicated. Complex mixtures of virtues and flaws. They live mostly not in black and white worlds but in gray ones. That Wat0n keeps on with thinking that I don't agree with him is because I am what? An anti-American? What is being an American to many of these fools who think being American is about some stereotypical shit of apple pie, baseball and driving Chevys and eating hot dogs. They eat hot dogs in Mexico, drink Coca-Cola, sell apple pies and play baseball. Does that make them not Mexicans? Ha ha ha. It does not.

What we are talking about here is about something simple. School shootings. They are not happening at the scale that it is happening in the USA. Why?

My theory? Alienation. Disconnection. Lack of community strength and activity. Prevalence and easy availability of automatic weapons in many states. No background checks that are thorough. Raising the age limit for firearms. Questioning people about why they want firearms.

As for Mexico? The only gun shop allowed to sell guns in Mexico is in Mexico City and it is strictly for hunting as a sport. You need to fill out a lot of paperwork and do a lot of background checking.

A crazy American woman that was paranoid about he liberals taking her guns away in Arizona wrote in an expat forum in Mexico Living or something....if she could buy some property in Mexico to stash guns in case the liberals came to take her guns away. Other USA citizens living in Mexico wrote back. "This is not the USA. No 2nd amendment right to bear arms stuff in the Mexican constitution. You bring guns and don't declare it to customs in the border or at the airport? You are going to jail. Don't do it." They think the entire world has the same laws they do and the same rules. No, they don't. The attitude about guns is not the same all over the world. Japan has separate laws and so does the United Kingdom.

Many nations do. Why? Because automatic weapons are designed to kill a lot of people in extreme duress war like or war circumstances. They were not meant for home security purposes.

The shooting problems by teens especially are lonely teens with nothing to define an empty sense of self. They don't belong to anything beyond themselves. They are allowed to wallow in passive ideations about how do I get attention, love, or acceptance? How do I find meaning in a life filled with loneliness, self-doubt, and lack of acceptance and direction? But no one talks about mental health or realizes that these kids and racist youth with conspiracy theories have problems related to how the societal values are communicating what is expected from them.

It is an empty existence and an empty life. You let that go on long enough they lose all connection with reality, with the empathy necessary to see other people, not like objects---but like fellow human beings and fellow companions deserving of respect. And life. You are talking about an inability to connect to anyone. That is a trend. Do something about it.
#15229683
Rancid wrote:It depends on the school district. Most urban school districts will not allow anyone in. At my kids school (recall, I'm in Texas), all doors/gates are locked. There is a push button to call the office from the front door (there is also a camera so they can see you). Actually, there are cameras on all entrances. They then buzz you in, and you have to sign in with the office. If you volunteer at school events, then you also need to go through a background check.

Texas has like 1000+ school districts all with their own rules. They call them independent school districts. I'm sure the more rural districts are more open door because they expect these issues to only occur in cities.

This is a side comment, but it is a highly wasteful system due to redundant roles across all the districts. For example, Florida only has like 100 school districts because they do it based on counties. The conservatives here like it this way because it makes defunding schools easier. The argument is, more districts gives more control to local communities, but we're also talking about the same group of people that don't want to allow local communities to decide on mask mandates.... "Local control" when it benefits me, and not when it doesn't is the conservative mantra here.

Just a note that at a rural New Mexico school i teach on the border with Texas, they do the same thing. All doors locked and need a lil chip thing, only enter through front after being buzzed in and all the same stuff.
#15229688
@Wellsy

Kids and teachers might have to start wearing a full suit of kevlar body armor and kevlar helmet to class in this day and age. They will have to sit, learn, and teach in class with all this body armor on all day long to assure the safety of students and teachers. Teachers and students will have to be like this Texas professor who started wearing body armor and kevlar to class because he felt unsafe. You're going to have to start teaching your classes dressed like this professor below.

Image
Last edited by Politics_Observer on 26 May 2022 03:01, edited 2 times in total.
#15229690
Tainari88 wrote:If you add another dumb rule for teachers to follow? No one is going to become a public school teacher. They get paid a lot less than other professionals and they have more responsibilities than they should have. If they got to carry guns and go to gun training? Just dissolve public education. Let the gun lovers educate their kids at home and let the people who hate guns teach their own kids at home as well. Virtual school and no contact with the wider society. They become isolated computer drones who find their niche in some computer forum and are only friends with people they never sit physically with, eat meals with, or talk to face-to-face. More alienation and stupidity with absent social upbringing, and bad value systems. Grow another crop of alienated, depressed, racist, :roll: or violent kids. See how well that goes?


Why did you assume that any teacher, administrator or principal would be FORCED to be a first responder?

First responders would be designated after careful consideration, and no one who does not want to participate would be forced to be a first responder. You don't need every adult in the school to be a first responder, for chrissake. You CERTAINLY don't need people who are against such a concept to be designated as one. DUH. There are those who would volunteer and train for such duty. WTF were you thinking when you wrote the rest of that barf up there?

You would stand idly by and wait to be slaughtered. It's your nature. Whatever, baby.
#15229691
BlutoSays wrote:You would stand idly by and wait to be slaughtered.
That there even has to be this option only shows how fucked up things are in the USA. That you think this is OK, is even more fucked up.

BlutoSays wrote:It's your nature. Whatever, baby.
Thankfully, she's in a country where teachers and students don't need to live in fear of people, like you, with guns.
#15229692
pugsville wrote:The Idea t hat 18 year olds are mature enough to have assault guns as inborn right without the need to show any evidence of responsibility and maturity is incredibly silly. That every single 18 year the right to armed to teh teeth as matter of of course without any sort of reasonable checks *IS* going to result in a lot of tings just like this.

Personal responsibility. So called "Conservatives." Why don't they have any?


That's an ATF 4473 FEDERAL form right there to purchase a firearm. They perform local, state and federal checks. FFLs controlling sales are dead serious about having them filled out and submitted for checks. The penalties and liabilities for not doing them are stiff.

Read it. Understand it. Shut your piehole until you do. I'm sick of your shitty "reasonable check" diatribes. You don't know WTF you're talking about.

https://www.documentcloud.org/documents ... f-F-4473-1
#15229700
Tainari88 wrote:No @wat0n I don't have the vision you have about the USA. I am a separate person from you. I got a totally different perspective than you do. I don't expect people to agree with me. I never have. I expect in a debate forum to be presented with strong arguments. Not on beliefs about which nation is better than other nations. That kind of shit is not in any way intelligent. Power and the nations in or out of power over time and history vary. They play musical chairs. I don't see the way you see it at all. Why? Because I see human beings and who is in power. And who is not. Why do people who live in countries with class systems have to play by the rules and accept that some of the people wield power as a class over them and others don't? That is the way I think.


You're describing pretty much any country, not just the USA. Seriously, what countries don't have a class system? Which countries have no elites that wield their power over everyone else? In what countries can you just refuse to play by the rules?

Cuba? North Korea? China? All of those do have their own elites and their own class system. And dissent (let alone rebellion) is treated harshly.

Finland, Sweden, Denmark? They also have their own class system, they also have their own elites and everything, even if they are very well governed overall. And ironically their system is far more like the one the US has, than the one Cuba or China have.

Do you know what one of the problems with the US is? That many are have dug into their trenches, and they'd rather die in them than be pragmatic. Not just the elites, but plenty of those below too. Worst part is that the US isn't the only place where this is happening.

Tainari88 wrote:I don't think about Puerto Ricans all prefer.


So no democratic sovereignty? Why shouldn't they decide what happens to their future?

Tainari88 wrote: No. I think about why people leave their native countries. Like why did you leave yours?


Honestly? To look for better opportunities, to study (for the sake of it, not solely to earn more) and have the experience of living elsewhere. And I had initially planned to go back home, but as time has gone by I prefer it here despite all the problems the US has to deal with and the fact my family and most of my friends live in Chile.

Tainari88 wrote: I never believed lies about Latin Americans are into power grabs and caudillos because it is part of the culture. That stuff was your statement. It is not about culture dude.


Oh it is about culture, or at least the elites' culture, among other things. It's true it isn't just about culture, the institutional design also allows to make it easy to concentrate power and our history is also not something we can just brush aside.

Caudillos have been part of the elites since our very independence. How else would you describe people like Bolívar or O'Higgins? And it's not just a Latin American thing. France also has that, indeed, the uber caudillo was French (Napoleon), and our own are inspired by this guy in one way or another. Let's also not forget the fascists throughout Europe in the 1930s, those were caudillos on steroids.

Tainari88 wrote: It is about human beings with defects and need for power grabs and how did I prove it? Bringing you evidence of a plot for some generals to take over Washington DC because they disagreed with the policies of the government. It happened with the ANGLOS. Not with us. It happens with Africans and Asians and Europeans. So what does that mean @wat0n? It means that you accepted a theory that demeans your background and makes assertions that Latin Americans are naturally attracted to power grabs and dictatorship. You don't do any historical analysis or politically valid ones either. It is about knee jerk reactions about the lies someone fed you dude. It lets me know....you are defending a point of view that is not about human behavior in all groups. It is about wanting to believe in some fairy tale of what humanity is. It is a complex thing.


Anglos also have their own tendency of liking caudillos from time to time (like Trump, Huey Long, Andrew Jackson to name a few) but you know what's the difference? Their political systems have better checks against them because England itself had to deal with one (Cromwell) and the experience was traumatic enough to influence political culture and intellectuals to prefer designing their institutions to make it hard for anyone to become a caudillo. Hence why many are constitutional monarchies or, in the case of the US, they are republics with very strong checks against centralized power. Have you read The Federalist 51? That text illustrates this idea perfectly.

This is about history, above all. Not because anglos are so good and perfect, they have their own flaws too (like their obsession with race), but their history pushed them to think like they do when it comes to government. And I think they were right, all in all, even if their way - like all human constructs - is flawed too.

Tainari88 wrote:People in islands that have a specific history of colonization are not going to behave like Imperially minded people with enormous power and military might. Each human group acts according to their experiences, positions and history allows them to act. But in the end? All are human.


Indeed, but why not let the people in these islands make their choices? Why would it be wrong for them to prefer to remain part of an empire if they wish to?

Tainari88 wrote:And all have the potential for greatness and enormous achievement, and disgrace and enormous shame and failure to be worthy of being called dignified and just people seeking equality in all of the human race.


Indeed, and we want everyone to realize their potential.

Tainari88 wrote:I don't like many people who equate poverty and lack of money with inferior intellects or not having to respect that group. Because? It is false. Poor people are HUMAN. With all the potential all human beings have. If you start saying Latin America or Africa or parts of Europe, Asia and so on should be ignored and disrespected because they are not the most powerful and the most wealthy of them all? You make a grave mistake.

After all wasn't the USA supposed to be founded on the fact that people from poor and humble backgrounds can reach great achievements. If that is true? Then why even think that the other nations who are not rich or wealthy or spend billions on arms and bombs? Have nothing to offer the world?

I use real logic based on human behavior. Not on nationalistic shit or my socioeconomic status is the way it is because it is SUPERIOR it is JUSTICE. That is foolish shit @wat0n.


What makes you believe I think Americans and Europeans somehow inherently superior to, say, Latin Americans or Africans? No, the thing is, the US and Europe are better places to live in than those countries and I can actually compare. This doesn't mean Americans and Europeans are somehow superior, just that their economies are more productive and their governments work better.

Not that development is something that can be taken for granted, countries that are developed today can perfectly become shitholes sometime in the future. Hell, it would even make sense. FWIW parts of Latin America were among the richest in the world, richer than Europe let alone today's US and Canada, before the French Revolution. Likewise, the poor countries in Africa and Latin America may actually be the economic powerhouses, with their population enjoying high living standards, at some point in the future. But right now, that's just not the case and it doesn't seem to be happening anytime soon.

Tainari88 wrote:A lot of people leave Mississippi dude. Alabama too. Lately California. To other states. Does it mean those people don't love their native states? No. It means something is pushing them out of a place they invested a lot of time and energy in.


Right, although if they're leaving they are also implicitly criticizing how things work at home. I think we can agree most people don't move elsewhere because they are too happy where they are.

Tainari88 wrote:The issue you have is you want these flaws that we are criticizing to not damage whatever false ideas you got about the US government. I don't care about the image. I care about the facts. The fact is that the USA did not have constant school shootings. Now it does. WHY?

Something is happening. In the society. Teachers are not supposed to be security guards with guns. They get paid to teach. Not to do law enforcement. But the people with power to put some resources into prevention and policy changes to protect the public are not being successful. That kid in Texas still shot a bunch of children.

No one here is shooting children. Why? No one thinks teachers jobs here are to be armed and ready to take down shooters. That is crazy. No one talks about the 2nd amendment and why that might be outdated for the USA and the crazy thought that automatic weapons for military might not be a good idea to sell to many people who are not exactly sane or healthy in thought.


Not shootings of children in Mexico? Oh come on @Tainari88, Mexico has its own serious gun and cartel problem. Far more serious than the US. Let's not get into the femicide problem, which is even worse, but insecurity is widespread enough that I was able to see the Mexican military guarding their Cry of Dolores celebration when I was there 3 years ago (in Guadalajara). The Mexican military itself is deployed from time to time when things get too dangerous in some places.

But going back to the US, I also don't know for certain why is it that we see so many shootings, not just in schools and not just of children, and I don't think anyone does. At least for Mexico we know why, in places like south side Chicago we can also tell why (gangs, similar to Mexico actually), but for school shooters and others like them we don't.

What I do know, though, is that if you don't let strangers into schools these things are made a lot harder. So how about we start with relatively easy things to do first, and we take it from there?

Probably going back to something like the AR ban of the Reagan era would help too. Who knows, at least we know that would be constitutional and I don't see why wouldn't Americans at least try. Nowhere in the 2nd amendment reads firearm sales and use cannot be regulated, in fact, it actually says quite the opposite. But since many prefer to dig in their positions, how about we start with what I said about not making it so easy for a stranger to go into schools? No federal intervention is needed, even the states don't need to act - this is something districts can do.

Tainari88 wrote:You piss me off with your lack of respecting what people actually say. You distort a lot @wat0n and you put words in the mouth of people who you are debating with. I don't live in denial dude. If you make a valid point I will acknowledge it. If you don't? And you lie on me again? I don't care. I will call you out on the denial shit!


I'm not distorting anything :roll:

And I'd say you are the one who lives in denial. Socialism already failed. The USSR doesn't exist. China barely pays lip service to socialist ideals. The few other "socialist" countries are, at best, dictatorships that try to remain socialist yet fail at that and impoverish their population in the process. The Nordics are not socialist, certainly not for a Marxist, regardless of whatever dumbass American conservatives claim.

The US may have its own problems but it's neither the worst place to live in the world (quite the contrary) nor it has the worst educational system in the world either (it's not even the worst one in the OECD) nor it's the most dangerous country to live in either.

@Godstud what makes you believe a stranger with bad intentions will just "leave"? What happens if he pulls a knife? What happens if he comes into school during break and leaves with a child? Am I to believe these things never happen in Thailand?

And more importantly, why should teachers have to deal with any of that? We don't need them to carry guns, and we also don't need them to police strangers entering schools.

@BlutoSays you can't deny something is not working as it should if cops need to be present in schools. Yes, it happens, but it's not a good thing. And if a permanent police presence in a school is necessary, then quite obviously making it physically impossible for strangers to enter school premises uncontested also is.

Also the shooter in this case was given the AR by his father as a birthday present I think. I don't know if you can buy a gun for someone else in TX, at least where I live it's a felony IIRC.
Last edited by wat0n on 26 May 2022 03:44, edited 1 time in total.
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