[Robert Urbanek]

A segment of a podcast published in the March issue of Harper’s Magazine claims Ron DeSantis, as a JAG lawyer, oversaw the force feeding of prisoners on a hunger strike at Guantanamo Bay in 2006. The discussion was between Mike Prysner, an Iraq War veteran, and Mansoor Adayfi, a former detainee.

Adayfi: Ron DeSantis was there watching us. We were crying, screaming. We were tied to the feeding chair. And he was watching. He was laughing.

Prysner: You told me there was a resistance tactic there, of splashing administrators? Splashing them with your own feces? But you didn’t use this tactic often?

Adayfi: Only the worst of the worst got splashed.

Prysner: DeSantis?

Adayfi: Yes.

According to Harper’s, the office of Ron DeSantis did not respond to requests for comments.

[Tainari88]

DeSantis is not a saint for sure.

But, he believes in authoritarianism. He might be the next president of the USA. And he will probably succeed where the conman from Queens failed.

[Unthinking Majority]

DeSantis is an arse. However, a Gitmo detainee may not be the most reliable witness.

During the Iraq War period I wanted Gitmo closed like most humane people. Obama promised to close it, and/or move it to US soil. Then when he got into office he reneged on the promise. My guess is that those that know how it works told him and showed him evidence that it works, and saves American lives, which is unfortunate but a cold reality.

That said, some of the things they do in there are extremely dark. But I guess many terrorists are no better. War is disgusting.

[late]

Then when he got into office he reneged on the promise.

He managed to reduce the number of people there with Republicans fighting against him over everything.

If you want someone to blame, blame Cheney.

[Unthinking Majority]

He managed to reduce the number of people there with Republicans fighting against him over everything.

If you want someone to blame, blame Cheney.

Why didn't Obama close it? I assume because it works. Otherwise why bother?

[Pants-of-dog]

Why didn't Obama close it? I assume because it works. Otherwise why bother?

Many possible reasons.

Closing it would require some sort of public airing of dirty laundry.

It might work, but not for the reason you think. Instead it might be an effective warehousing site for black ops targets. A black site, as it were.

It could serve as a school to teach CIA agents how to torture people.

That is the whole point behind sites with no oversight like this: the state can do whatever it wants there. Imagination is the only limit.

[late]

I assume

We really shouldn't assume our conclusion. Unless it's fantasy, and then, of course, we must...

[late]

Many possible reasons.

One reason.

Republicans wouldn't let him bring the prisoners here, and other countries didn't want them.

Cheney tried to invent a new court system that would allow torture. You see, he had a genius for making bad situations worse. So we couldn't take them to court (that's complicated, but that's the long and short of it, the courts wouldn't work as an option); we couldn't bring them here, and most countries wouldn't take them on a bet. You can safely guess that Republican intransigence cost us millions getting rid of them.

[Rich]

America is an imperialist empire that cares nothing for the wishes of the people it dominates. The Cuban government has no say in the Guantanamo naval base. Now the Americans say that Cuba's government doesn't represent the Cuban people. If they really thought that they would overthrow the Cuban government, introduce a proper democracy and allow the Cuban people to choose if they wanted an American Naval Base on Cuban soil. Now if the Cuban government attempted to throw the Americans off their land you'd see the Americans overthrow the Cuban government pretty quickly.

The Muslims are an upstanding and moral people. Castrating men and boys is against the Muslim religion. So what the Muslims did was to castrate their slaves outside the formal Ottoman territory. Apparently if they did on Muslim controlled territory that was not Muslim territory that made it OK. Similarly it is against the Liberal religion to enslave, torture and cage people without trial or due process. But again if you do it on territory that's American territory but at the same time is not American territory apparently that makes it OK.

If the people of Bahrain were given a free vote they might well decide they wanted their Naval Base to go to Iran rather than the US. The American people couldn't give a toss about the wishes of the people whose countries they occupy. American Liberals, as I've said before you just couldn't make this up. These American liberal narcissists area absolutely enraged that the Russians won't just immediately hand over Sevastopol to the US Navy, sorry I mean the Ukrainian navy.

[ckaihatsu]

DeSantis is an arse. However, a Gitmo detainee may not be the most reliable witness.

During the Iraq War period I wanted Gitmo closed like most humane people. Obama promised to close it, and/or move it to US soil. Then when he got into office he reneged on the promise. My guess is that those that know how it works told him and showed him evidence that it works, and saves American lives, which is unfortunate but a cold reality.

That said, some of the things they do in there are extremely dark. But I guess many terrorists are no better. War is disgusting.

Poll shows Black Americans view Iraq war as a mistake, divided on Afghanistan

Respondents with at least one family member who served in the wars were more likely to oppose US military engagement overseas

https://www.middleeasteye.net/news/poll ... fghanistan

[ness31]

How were they force fed? Orally or intravenously?

[Robert Urbanek]

How were they force fed? Orally or intravenously?

Orally

Adayfi: they brought piles of Ensure and they started force-feeding us over and over again . . . They poured one can after another. So when he [DeSantis] approached me, I said, "This is the way we are treated?" He said, "You should eat." I threw up in his face. Literally on his face . . . In one week, they broke all the hunger strikers.

[ness31]

Anything else other than force feeding?

[Tainari88]

It is a very international law problem. The USA doesn't follow international law or the Geneva Convention guidelines so they had to reinvent the new category. Once they did that they had big issues with everything. They tried to throw the rule book out and in the end it has been a very difficult problem for them.

[ness31]

Yeah, it was called rendition. Another one of the many reasons why people who can remember Iraq and Afghanistan think Ukraine is questionable; but it obviously goes back much further.

Today I found out Daniel Ellsberg has terminal cancer and probably won’t be with us for much longer.

[Tainari88]

Yeah, it was called rendition. Another one of the many reasons why people who can remember Iraq and Afghanistan think Ukraine is questionable; but it obviously goes back much further.

Today I found out Daniel Ellsberg has terminal cancer and probably won’t be with us for much longer.

Yes, Ness31 the truth is that Mr. Ellsberg led a very exciting, rich, and transformative life. He is 91 years old.
The new challenge for the upcoming generations is going to have to be to have the courage to pressure change. Debates are powerful things. They expose readers and others to the possibility of a change of thought. If you really believe no one is your enemy and you can speak with civility about all subjects with others? You are way past the halfway point to the solution to the conflict, problem, or dilemma.

I worry a lot about the future if most young people feel more comfortable with machines and computers than with each other and no one wants the burdens of being responsible for others beyond themselves.

Staying connected to each other is what transformed Daniel Ellsberg. It made him change due to a debate by a protesting young man who was willing to go to jail to avoid Vietnam and the draft. He was a conscientious objector. A Gandhian thinker.

It led to the Pentagon Papers in the early 1970s. The US government lied then and it lies today about a lot of things. But people now have the dangers out there of massive misinformation campaigns. Stay engaged and debating with real people like in these platforms. Don't do the short and shallow platforms. That is my opinion.

[Robert Urbanek]

Anything else other than force feeding?

Adayfi: We were beaten all day long. Whatever you were doing—they just beat you. Pepper spray, beating, sleep deprivation. That continued for three months. And he [DeSantis] was there. He was one of the people that supervised the torture, the abuses, the beatings.

[ness31]

What are we? A year out from an election and now this surfaces? Why does it take so long for this stuff to leak?

[wat0n]

What are we? A year out from an election and now this surfaces? Why does it take so long for this stuff to leak?

It was never a secret DeSantis worked as a prosecutor in Guantanamo. It was even in his House site when he was a Representative.

What is new is these allegations he was present during torture but, honestly, if he never knew how those confessions were extracted then he did a shitty job.

[ckaihatsu]

Ron DeSantis： Last Week Tonight with John Oliver (HBO)