Taiwan-China crisis. - Page 3 - Politics Forum.org | PoFo

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Talk about what you've seen in the news today.

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User avatar
By Fasces
#15316729
JohnRawls wrote:You don't, others do. The rhetoric that good leader bad nobles changes fast to shit lord shit nobles. Actually its a common "tactic" of authoritarian states to blame local governments or some minister XXX instead of the "Leader". Putin does it also all the time even more so now.


I'm sure some do, but there isn't a huge swell of public opinion against the CPC in China. I work with many Chinese suppliers, have Chinese family and friends. I work with Chinese students here in Europe, of which the vast, vast majority miss China and return to it when their studies conclude. This anger at the CPC... it just isn't there to the degree that Xi has to pull a Gatlieri, as you're supposing. There's no crisis of legitimacy within China, and I don't think the CPC leadership feels there is.
User avatar
By JohnRawls
#15316731
Negotiator wrote:Why are you unaware that China (a) is Russias best friend and thus doesnt sanction them and (b) produces plenty of computer chips ?!? :?:

Neither is a secret.


What you mean don't sanction. Chinese banks don't work with Russian enteties almost at all anymore while China is not providing any lethal aid. China also said that basically they can help Europe/USA deal with Russia if China gets concessions on Taiwan. So much for being a friend.
User avatar
By JohnRawls
#15316732
Fasces wrote:I'm sure some do, but there isn't a huge swell of public opinion against the CPC in China. I work with many Chinese suppliers, have Chinese family and friends. I work with Chinese students here in Europe, of which the vast, vast majority miss China and return to it when their studies conclude. This anger at the CPC... it just isn't there to the degree that Xi has to pull a Gatlieri, as you're supposing. There's no crisis of legitimacy within China, and I don't think the CPC leadership feels there is.


Its a process. Putin also was believed to be all good and the others were the corrupt ones/incompetent ones. It took somewhere between 5-15 years for that opinion to change about him.
User avatar
By Fasces
#15316746
It's been 10 with Xi so far. :roll:

I'd try talking or engaging with some normal Chinese citizens before trying to speak for them, if I were you. It's been years of listening to this wishful thinking from you, at this point.
User avatar
By JohnRawls
#15316751
Fasces wrote:It's been 10 with Xi so far. :roll:

I'd try talking or engaging with some normal Chinese citizens before trying to speak for them, if I were you. It's been years of listening to this wishful thinking from you, at this point.


As I said, its a process that happens all the time. Usually the change happens very fast at a certain point. There are plenty of examples not just from Russia about this.

It was really unheard off there being protests against the CCP or anti-Xi and nowadays we can see them from time to time since Covid. Although China does try to keep it hush hush. You are trying to pretend like they are not there but here are examples of just some:







User avatar
By Fasces
#15316753
There's hundreds of millions of Chinese. Of course some discontent will exist, but it isn't widespread and it largely isn't directed as the CPC/Xi Jinping.

There are thousands of protests in China annually.

In the videos you sent, there are two examples of anti-Xi statements: one of which was a banner that could be a single person (and wasn't anti-CPC, just anti-Xi) and the other was a Shanghai lockdown protest - where, again, Shanghai had a famously disastrous approach to lockdowns that was widely criticized across the country, but is an outrage of a time and place that that isn't applicable to "all of China in 2024." putting aside that, like with Biden, some Chinese criticism of Xi is from the direction opposite what we consider to be 'good' - Xi got as much bad press on Weibo for not sending tanks into Hong Kong in 2020 as he did for promoting the architect of the Shanghai lockdown to the Standing Committee.

A week ago, you posted this thread genuinely worried that these military drills were a pretext for an invasion of Taiwan. The drills ended four days ago. No war.

Can't reason someone out of a position they didn't reason themselves into, and your fundamental misunderstanding of Chinese society (which, again, you have zero interactions with beyond filtering news for articles that align with preconcieved notions that China = Russia)
By Rugoz
#15316754
Fasces wrote:A week ago, you posted this thread genuinely worried that these military drills were a pretext for an invasion of Taiwan. The drills ended four days ago. No war.


I quote.

On Friday, the PLA’s Eastern Theater Command said it was continuing the drills on both sides of the Taiwan island chain to “test the ability to jointly seize power, launch joint attacks and occupy key areas.”


https://edition.cnn.com/2024/05/23/asia ... index.html

Clearly not a prelude to an invasion. :lol:
User avatar
By Fasces
#15316791
How many American wargames in the last thirty years have modeled a war and occupation of Iran? :lol:

JLASS-SP modeled an invasion of Mauretania a few years back, if I remember correctly. Was a US attack and occupation of Mauretania imminent?
By Rugoz
#15316803
Fasces wrote:How many American wargames in the last thirty years have modeled a war and occupation of Iran? :lol:

JLASS-SP modeled an invasion of Mauretania a few years back, if I remember correctly. Was a US attack and occupation of Mauretania imminent?


:knife:

I play wargames every now and then on my computer. Pretending they are somehow equivalent to a maneuver around an actual island with actual military forces is preposterous.
By Rugoz
#15316811
Fasces wrote:They're not on a computer, Rugoz.

They use live ammo, real ships, and so forth.

You don't know what a wargame is?


It literally says "simulated":

THE U.S. WILL INVADE WEST AFRICA IN 2023 AFTER AN ATTACK IN NEW YORK — ACCORDING TO PENTAGON WAR GAME
In a simulated exercise at U.S. war colleges, military planners envision an invasion of Mauritania after a Lincoln Tunnel bombing.

https://theintercept.com/2017/10/22/the ... -war-game/
User avatar
By JohnRawls
#15316835
Fasces wrote:The US hosts dozens of Live fire exercises and war games per year, and you're hung up on one random one. :roll:



The last time US surrounded any country in a similar way to what China is doing is basically Cuba during the Cuban missile crysis. :)
By Rugoz
#15316839
Fasces wrote:The US hosts dozens of Live fire exercises and war games per year, and you're hung up on one random one. :roll:


A random one? It's literally your example. :lol:
#15316851
JohnRawls wrote:As I said, its a process that happens all the time. Usually the change happens very fast at a certain point. There are plenty of examples not just from Russia about this.

It was really unheard off there being protests against the CCP or anti-Xi and nowadays we can see them from time to time since Covid. Although China does try to keep it hush hush. You are trying to pretend like they are not there but here are examples of just some:




As @Fasces pointed out , foreign ,and especially western news sources are not to be trusted . They will tend to have a biased slant to their agenda . If the way that the so called mainstream media has treated Vietnam is any indication , then the reports should be taken with a grain of salt . The only way to truly find out what all is going on , and why , would be to hear directly from those living there . Such as with this Vietnamese woman , or with China , those such as the before mentioned @Fasces .



By Rugoz
#15316854
Deutschmania wrote:As @Fasces pointed out , foreign ,and especially western news sources are not to be trusted . They will tend to have a biased slant to their agenda .


Last time I checked they're all saying the CCP's and Xi's grip on power is totally secure.

So you're saying a revolution is imminent?
User avatar
By JohnRawls
#15316870
Deutschmania wrote:As @Fasces pointed out , foreign ,and especially western news sources are not to be trusted . They will tend to have a biased slant to their agenda . If the way that the so called mainstream media has treated Vietnam is any indication , then the reports should be taken with a grain of salt . The only way to truly find out what all is going on , and why , would be to hear directly from those living there . Such as with this Vietnamese woman , or with China , those such as the before mentioned @Fasces .





I don't watch the TV at all just to be clear here. I might see them from time to time as articles but this is not something that only "Western Media" shows. Also mistrusting Western Media just for it being Western Media is nonsense, they are usually more principled and unbiased compared to others. Doesn't mean they don't mislead from time to time. And finally, if you are going to imply that Chinese state controlled media is better than I don't know what to say. When have state media ever been better than privately owned media? Even people like Glenn Beck and Alex Jones probably say more truth in a negative way about their own country than any state media about theirs especially in dictatorial countries :knife:
By late
#15316876
Vietnam has been trying to get friendly for a long time, 15 or 20 years. Thank China for that.

We are now getting friendlier with Vietnam, again, because of China. We are trying to put together a Pacific alliance to oppose Chinese expansion.

Sometime, maybe 20 years ago, Vietnam said we could have either of the naval bases back, that we had during our conflict with Vietnam. I bet the offer is still open, strategically, it makes sense.
User avatar
By JohnRawls
#15316880
Well China announced there are going to be 2 more similar "drills" this year. :hmm:

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