Half (or maybe all) of new jobs have gone to illegal immigrants - Page 2 - Politics Forum.org | PoFo

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#15317286
Tainari88 wrote:What does the invisible hand wind up doing I wonder? Invisibly making sure no one makes enough money in an invisible elitist way?

The invisible hand allocates resources and labour power in the most efficient way possible, even if the most efficient way is by immiserating the working class. Dickens wrote about the effects of this in 19th century Britain. Ironically, the ‘freest’ way of running the economy actually results in the most brutal oppression imaginable.
#15317287
Potemkin wrote:The invisible hand allocates resources and labour power in the most efficient way possible, even if the most efficient way is by immiserating the working class. Dickens wrote about the effects of this in 19th century Britain. Ironically, the ‘freest’ way of running the economy actually results in the most brutal oppression imaginable.

Dude...the immigrants are working. They are the new working class. If this is the most brutal oppression possible, then maybe they should have stayed home.
#15317289
FiveofSwords wrote:They don't want to solve immigration because it is helping to genocide white people. That is their primary goal.


How do you explain that all over the world population is dropping? Is there a japanese, korean, or chinese genocide all in the works? All over the world population drops after countries industrialize and have greater educational achievement by women. Here is a video that explains the above:



How does your theory explain this phenomenon in non-white countries?
#15317290
Bill_Nye wrote:How do you explain that all over the world population is dropping? Is there a japanese, korean, or chinese genocide all in the works? All over the world population drops after countries industrialize and have greater educational achievement by women. Here is a video that explains the above:



How does your theory explain this phenomenon in non-white countries?

This is si.ply factually untrue. The population is not dropping everywhere. Check the fertility in Nigeria or bandladesh.

Anyway, a country like Japan can have a period of population decline and as long as they do not mass import some other race, thr Japanese will survive. The basic carrying capacity of Japan is not going to change so much. In fact you could easily argue that the island is simply overpopulated right now. With a shrinking population, wages will increase and housing cost will decrease...thus improving the situation for the regular Japanese person and I guess that happy Japanese people would want to have happy families.

None of that would happen, however, if they import 100 million Nigerians, however. That suicidal 'strategy' is reserved for white countries. All white countries, and only white countries.
#15317291
FiveofSwords wrote:This is si.ply factually untrue. The population is not dropping everywhere. Check the fertility in Nigeria or bandladesh.


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_c ... ility_rate

it is dropping everywhere that has been changed by capitalism.

Image

None of that would happen, however, if they import 100 million Nigerians, however. That suicidal 'strategy' is reserved for white countries. All white countries, and only white countries.


You're wrong though. China for example is "importing" foreign brides and this is beginning to trend in other Asian countries:

https://www.hrw.org/news/2019/10/31/chi ... ng-problem

Please site sources for your diatribes, or perhaps I should just assume you don't have any factual evidence?
#15317297
Fasces wrote:Wow, maybe "all" jobs have gone to illegal immigrants?!


The furriners are taking over and if you let them? What happens? Your race is extinguished. because only your own race is important. The rest are taking up space without any real validity. Lol. That is Five Man's totally invalid logic. :lol:

Small irrelevant details like contraceptives available and sex education, legal abortions, and higher educational achievement, capitalism and most women wanting careers outside the home setting, and lack of traditional lifestyles has affected women's and men's choices about having children is not valid as reasons for population decline. No. Women get higher educations and they delay getting married and having kids. Having kids is not that easy or simple. You can get a C section and or wind up dead if you get pre clampsyia or another pregnancy with complications. Women get sterilized if they are at high risk of death if they get pregnant again. Those kind of details is just not that relevant for the reasons why population decline happens. He is a very illogical thinker in general. Again, complexity escapes FiveofSwords. He has to be in order to think that the only solution to the problems of the world is being a racist Nazi. That is the problem with him. Some racist Nazis are much clearer about the real reasons and they know how they choose to be racist and exclusionary. But him? He has reading comprehension problems mainly. :lol: :D

9% is not enough. The white race needs to be 91%. What is the solution? It is either, war, taking over land that is not theirs and or killing off or stealing the resources from other races. The others are inferior dummies. No resistance will you get from the dummies while the genius white people like Don Black plot to overthrow the island nation of Dominica and find out there is a big capitalist government that has nation states as the new paradigm. How to overcome the new modern model and just go back to the past of colonial takeovers without dealing with modern capitalism and liberal democracies without a racist apartheid system that is punished internationally and so on? He has no answer really but KILLING. But then you might lose the precious lives of a few of the remaining pure white people...war is so risky....oh dear what do I do? :D

The Africans might take over and then you are in trouble. Because they are naturally dumb due to their blood. And the Whites are naturally geniuses due to theirs. This is the tripe he thinks. Lol. :lol:
#15317304
Bill_Nye wrote:https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_total_fertility_rate

it is dropping everywhere that has been changed by capitalism.

Image



You're wrong though. China for example is "importing" foreign brides and this is beginning to trend in other Asian countries:

https://www.hrw.org/news/2019/10/31/chi ... ng-problem

Please site sources for your diatribes, or perhaps I should just assume you don't have any factual evidence?

So you post a picture confirming what I said..
And then instead of an apology you just mumble some nonsense about capitalism...as if there is no capitalism in Nigeria...

Lol...I can assune you are not a serious person
#15317347
Bill_Nye wrote:You didn't watch the video I posted earlier which explains how more than 3 billion people were pulled out of deep poverty creating a new global middle class while the remaining poor 2 billion are set to do so by 2050. :roll:


He does not watch videos. He just wants to not read, watch videos or do any effort and be right in his own mind.

History and culture is in your blood. Not socially learned is what he believes at this point. He is not making sense because the truth is the vast majority of anything one does in this world of human society is socially learned. One can learn to speak, read and write more than one human language. One can learn and practice more than one human culture. Culture is learned. Not acquired at birth but done through a learning process in a social setting. That is not the same as being allergic to peanuts or strawberries. But Sword man thinks the sacredness of DNA is immutable and brings with it English culture innately in the blood.

Yes, blood, sperm, eggs and human instructions. Mixed all together and voila...new life. Thus, confirming that we are all one species. But....the special type of human that can't be mixed up with other groups because...because...purity. That is why horny men do not believe in purity. But....they have to because the white race.

This is the kind of merry go round of shit he keeps dealing with. :lol:
#15317348
Bill_Nye wrote:You didn't watch the video I posted earlier which explains how more than 3 billion people were pulled out of deep poverty creating a new global middle class while the remaining poor 2 billion are set to do so by 2050. :roll:

Dude, YouTube is your source? You are not a serious person. I will never care about any YouTube citation nor will I ever watch such trash.
#15317354
FiveofSwords wrote:Dude, YouTube is your source? You are not a serious person. I will never care about any YouTube citation nor will I ever watch such trash.


No dummy, my source is Hans Rosling.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hans_Rosling

Hans Rosling (Swedish pronunciation: [ˈhɑːns ˈrûːslɪŋ]; 27 July 1948 – 7 February 2017) was a Swedish physician, academic and public speaker. He was a professor of international health at Karolinska Institute[4] and was the co-founder and chairman of the Gapminder Foundation, which developed the Trendalyzer software system. He held presentations around the world, including several TED Talks[5] in which he promoted the use of data (and data visualization) to explore development issues.[6] His posthumously published book Factfulness, coauthored with his daughter-in-law Anna Rosling Rönnlund and son Ola Rosling, became an international bestseller.[7]
#15317401
Bill_Nye wrote:No dummy, my source is Hans Rosling.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hans_Rosling

You probably think Bill nye is an actual scientist also lol.

Dude, I dont care about this person. I don't believe he knows anything about ehat is going to happen in Nigeria in 2050 lol. I consider such things about as valid as a preacher predicting the end of the world. Also, youtube is si ply not a platform for serious academic research.

But most importantly, you were clearly just wrong when you tried to inform me that birth rates are low everywhere...and when I corrected you and spoke about the issue with mass immigration, you just ignored it. You tried some weird combination between moving the goalposts and a red herring..and you want to talk about capitalism now instead...under the 'authority' of this system functionary for state ideology.

This is not a discussion. This is a clown show.
#15317465
FiveofSwords wrote:You probably think Bill nye is an actual scientist also lol.

Dude, I dont care about this person. I don't believe he knows anything about ehat is going to happen in Nigeria in 2050 lol. I consider such things about as valid as a preacher predicting the end of the world. Also, youtube is si ply not a platform for serious academic research.

But most importantly, you were clearly just wrong when you tried to inform me that birth rates are low everywhere...and when I corrected you and spoke about the issue with mass immigration, you just ignored it. You tried some weird combination between moving the goalposts and a red herring..and you want to talk about capitalism now instead...under the 'authority' of this system functionary for state ideology.

This is not a discussion. This is a clown show.


I'm not sure it is worth debating with you, but you are wrong on several points. First of all you fail to explain how "white genocide" is being conducted in the west, but NOT in the east which is seeing the largest demographic change in the world. Secondly, you fail to see that both the United States and Mexico's population growth rate is below 2.2 percent which is what is needed to replace the population in each generation. You think of Mexicans as having a large birthrate when it is actually closer to 1.8 children per woman. Lastly, the TED talk I listed is a global platform that allows professionals to speak about interesting topics who can share their expertise on dozens of topics. They just publish to Youtube in order to make the information more accessible to the public.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/TED_(conference)

I'm not sure why I'm saying this, because you clearly don't care what experts have to say on the topics that you rant about. So you keep your mind free of the cognitive dissonance that you understandably do experience and would experience more of if you bothered to expose yourself to data that contradicts your "gut instincts" about such phenomena.

P.P.S Here is what the fertility rate looked like in 1950. You can compare it to the fertility rate image I posted above circa 2023 to see how much the birth rates have fallen almost globally. Even in Africa births shrank from the high of 8 per woman in the 50s to between 4 and 6 today.

Image
#15317512
Bill_Nye wrote:I'm not sure it is worth debating with you, but you are wrong on several points. First of all you fail to explain how "white genocide" is being conducted in the west, but NOT in the east which is seeing the largest demographic change in the world. Secondly, you fail to see that both the United States and Mexico's population growth rate is below 2.2 percent which is what is needed to replace the population in each generation. You think of Mexicans as having a large birthrate when it is actually closer to 1.8 children per woman. Lastly, the TED talk I listed is a global platform that allows professionals to speak about interesting topics who can share their expertise on dozens of topics. They just publish to Youtube in order to make the information more accessible to the public.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/TED_(conference)

I'm not sure why I'm saying this, because you clearly don't care what experts have to say on the topics that you rant about. So you keep your mind free of the cognitive dissonance that you understandably do experience and would experience more of if you bothered to expose yourself to data that contradicts your "gut instincts" about such phenomena.

P.P.S Here is what the fertility rate looked like in 1950. You can compare it to the fertility rate image I posted above circa 2023 to see how much the birth rates have fallen almost globally. Even in Africa births shrank from the high of 8 per woman in the 50s to between 4 and 6 today.

Image

Sorry but nobody with a Ted talk is an expert on anything.

I explained quite clearly the difference between the east and the west. But you apparently think that .07 = 60.

So what is this new map you are showing? What fertility looked like before capitalism existed?

That was a rhetorical question, fyi.
#15318566
If you assume this claim is entirely true. There is something deeper that is missed by the kind of people that this headline is designed to manipulate.

This claim (assuming true), means that all new jobs created are of so low quality and skill, that even an immigrant with no education and little ability to speak the language can take "your job". What does that say about the person complaining that "their job" is being taken? What does that say about the ability of the capitalist invisible hand to take care of us if we just work hard? The system that many people put their full faith into?

Folks like @Puffer Fish are like soooo close sometimes, but just can't find it to take that last logical step that would really help them understand how broken everything is, and how illegal immigration is basically just a symptom of a much bigger, deeper, and fundamental issue.
#15318571
Rancid wrote:If you assume this claim is entirely true. There is something deeper that is missed by the kind of people that this headline is designed to manipulate.

This claim (assuming true), means that all new jobs created are of so low quality and skill, that even an immigrant with no education and little ability to speak the language can take "your job". What does that say about the person complaining that "their job" is being taken? What does that say about the ability of the capitalist invisible hand to take care of us if we just work hard? The system that many people put their full faith into?

Folks like @Puffer Fish are like soooo close sometimes, but just can't find it to take that last logical step that would really help them understand how broken everything is, and how illegal immigration is basically just a symptom of a much bigger, deeper, and fundamental issue.

I don't see anything wrong with importing latin american immigrants if there is labour shortages in certain sectors. Just do it legally. Get it on the books.

What I don't understand is progressive leaning folks being ok with this. Many illegal migrants make below minimum wage, they are often not protected by worker rights, and employers have a great deal of power/leverage over them. They're not quite the new slave class working the fields again, more like indentured servants who can be threatened and exploited by employers. Not to mention some of the human and sex trafficking that occurs. These migrants can't even vote. This doesn't seem very compassionate or "progressive" to me.

Why is this allowed to keep happening? Because the corporate and wealthy classes love it. It's good for their profits to pay people crap wages and ignore their rights They don't want the politicians/parties they pay off to change a thing.

Importing an underpaid impoverished underclass doesn't seem very smart either. Some food prices might be higher if they made minimum wage, but when was this ever a problem before?
#15318575
Unthinking Majority wrote:I don't see anything wrong with importing latin american immigrants if there is labour shortages in certain sectors. Just do it legally. Get it on the books.

What I don't understand is progressive leaning folks being ok with this. Many illegal migrants make below minimum wage, they are often not protected by worker rights, and employers have a great deal of power/leverage over them. They're not quite the new slave class working the fields again, more like indentured servants who can be threatened and exploited by employers. Not to mention some of the human and sex trafficking that occurs. These migrants can't even vote. This doesn't seem very compassionate or "progressive" to me.

Why is this allowed to keep happening? Because the corporate and wealthy classes love it. It's good for their profits to pay people crap wages and ignore their rights They don't want the politicians/parties they pay off to change a thing.

Importing an underpaid impoverished underclass doesn't seem very smart either. Some food prices might be higher if they made minimum wage, but when was this ever a problem before?


Which progressive leaning folks are ok with this? I also hope you are not insinuating I'm one of those.

Your point is valid, but it's besides what I stated. Let's also get real, the conservatives that are angry about this headline won't be made happy if it is made legal and put on the books.

Your last couple of comments is getting to the heart of my point exactly. The capitalist system (i.e. corporate will) is focused on profit, and not to taking care of people. The focus is profit, people be damned. Illegal immigrants are the easiest to exploit. Hence, why we have what we have. However, many conservatives have been manipulated into looking away from that fact. More over, they have been manipulated into looking towards hating the people being exploited. Genius on the part of our corporate and political elites. It's classic, pit us all against each other so we don't pay attention to the bigger picture, and the bigger ass fuck.
#15318580
It's way too easy to instill fear in people especially ignorant folks who don't understand what is exploitation and who is gaining from using illegal immigrants. Illegals accept lower pay than legal citizens that's one small part of the equation. Rancid and Unthinking have mentioned profits...bingo! Less spent in paying your labor force, you have more money in your pocket. This is a major reason for outsourcing to India and other poorer countries. It's all about money.

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