Europe is a target for Da'wah (proselytizing). - Politics Forum.org | PoFo

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#14871969
@Oxymandias

You are not honest. Every Muslim knows these spineless Europeanss are perfect target for Da'wah (proselytizing).

Straight from the horse's mouth. Yusuf al-Qaradawi, one of the most prominent religious leaders in the Middle East

Last edited by noir on 18 Dec 2017 05:52, edited 1 time in total.
#14871970
noir wrote:@Oxymandias

You are not honest. Every Muslim knows these spineless Europeanss are perfect target for Da'wah (proselytizing).

Straight from the horse's mouth. Yusuf al-Qaradawi, one of the most prominent religious leaders in the Middle East



It's already happening and Islam isn't doing the Islamization of Europe alone, the EU is what is allowing Islamists to succeed. Or do you think Greece, Italy, Portugal and Spain entering a economical crisis at the same time was not planned? First was Greece, now is Italy. Spain will follow and then they will try their luck with the cherry of the cake, Portugal.
#14872214
Reichstraten wrote:Da´wah isn´t going to islamize Europe, that´s for sure.
Their whole faith is too remote from us Europeans. It´s in no way an appealing step to convert to islam.
Also the talk about ´spineless Europeans´ is greatly exaggerated.



When Europeans seek for realign they are not taking their own old Christianity but prefer to convert to Islam. The author Douglas Murray says, current European Christianity is left wing movement and doesn't appeal for the converts

@Reichstraten, read this thoughtful new book

The Strange Death of Europe: Immigration, Identity, Islam By DOUGLAS MURRAY

For some years now I have been especially struck by numerous accounts I have heard first hand and also read from people who have chosen to convert to Islam. Partly these stories are striking because they are so similar. They are almost always some variant of a story nearly any young person could tell. They generally go something like this: ‘I had reached a certain age [usually their twenties or early thirties] and I was in a nightclub and I was drunk and I just thought, “Life must be about more than this.”’ Almost nothing else in our culture says, ‘But of course there it is.’ In the absence of such a voice young people search, and they discover Islam. The fact that they choose Islam is a story in itself. Why do these young men and women (very often women) not reach out and find Christianity? Partly it is because most branches of European Christianity have lost the confidence to proselytise or even believe in their own message. For the Church of Sweden, the Church of England, the German Lutheran Church and many other branches of European Christianity, the message of the religion has become a form of left-wing politics, diversity action and social welfare projects. Such churches argue for ‘open borders’ yet are circumspect about quoting the texts they once preached as revealed.

There is another cause, too. The critical analysis of and scholarship around the roots of Christianity has not yet occurred to the same degree with the roots of Islam. A worldwide campaign of intimidation and murder has been exceptionally successful in holding back that tide. Even today in the West the very few people who work on the origins of the Koran and engage in serious Koranic scholarship – such as Ibn Warraq and Christoph Luxenberg – publish their work under pseudonyms. And just as anyone deemed to have blasphemed the religion of Islam in the Muslim-majority world will find their life in danger, so across Europe the people who have engaged in criticism of the sources and the founder of Islam will find themselves under sufficient threat that they either stop, go into hiding or – like Hamed Abdel-Samad in Germany – live under police protection. This has certainly had an effect in protecting Islam for a time and slowing the tide of criticism of its origins and beliefs that is coming its way. Since 1989 the texts, ideas and even images of Islam have become so heavily policed and self-policed even in Western Europe that it would be understandable if a young person becoming politically and religiously aware in the last few decades might have arrived at the conclusion that the one thing our societies really do hold sacred and impervious to ridicule or criticism are the claims and teachings of Mohammed.

This would solve one problem, but whilst alleviating Western Europe’s problems it would not in turn solve them.

The desire for radical change and the sense of emptiness of people like those converts would continue. There would still be a desire and search for certainties. Yet still these clearly innate desires run against nearly all the assumptions and aspirations of our time. The search for meaning is not new. What is new is that almost nothing in modern European culture applies itself to offering an answer. Nothing says, ‘Here is an inheritance of thought and culture and philosophy and religion which has nurtured people for thousands of years and may well fulfil you too.’ Instead, a voice at best says, ‘Find your meaning where you will.’ At worst the nihilist’s creed can be heard: ‘Yours is a meaningless existence in a meaningless universe.’ Any person who believes such a creed is liable to achieve literally nothing. Societies in which that is the case are likewise liable to achieve nothing. While nihilism may be understandable in some individuals, as a societal creed it is fatal.
Last edited by noir on 18 Dec 2017 12:59, edited 1 time in total.
#14872217
noir wrote:When Europeans seek for realign they are not taking their own old Christianity but prefer to convert to Islam. The author Douglas Murray says, current European Christianity is left wing movement and doesn't appeal for the converts


We life in conservative times.
This means that the unbelievers will mostly stay unbelievers, the christians will remain christian and the muslims will stay muslim.
It's mostly about immigration and demography.
Massive conversion from one side to another seems unlikely to me.
#14872221
SolarCross wrote:
I wouldn't worry that much about the proselytizing, but the breeding and terrorism is something to tackle.



Proselytizing and propaganda is of greather threat than terrorism. Terrorism can be dismissed after awhile as part&parcel, propaganda is changing the nation culture. Its impact is long lasting.
Last edited by noir on 18 Dec 2017 13:21, edited 1 time in total.
#14872223
Reichstraten wrote:We life in conservative times.
This means that the unbelievers will mostly stay unbelievers, the christians will remain christian and the muslims will stay muslim.
It's mostly about immigration and demography.
Massive conversion from one side to another seems unlikely to me.

Yeah it won't happen through plain persuasion. However If they win the demography war they can use terrorism and political incentives to forcefully convert the population. All muslim majority countries became near 100% muslim that way.

Submit to Islam and be safe. Or agree to the payment of the Jizya (tax), and you and your people will be under our protection, else you will have only yourself to blame for the consequences, for I bring the men who desire death as ardently as you desire life

- This letter was written by Khalid, from his head-quarters in Babylonia, to the Persian monarch Emperor Yazdegerd III before invading it.


Persia was 0% muslim before that letter, now it is 99%.
#14872282
Reichstraten wrote:Da´wah isn´t going to islamize Europe, that´s for sure.
Their whole faith is too remote from us Europeans. It´s in no way an appealing step to convert to islam.
Also the talk about ´spineless Europeans´ is greatly exaggerated.


I agree with all you said, but let's transport ourselves to 2011. Only 6 years ago would you say

1. London elected a Pakistani Muslim Mayor with well known connections with Islamic extremists
2. Islamics blow up a Adriana Grande concert with nail bombs, killing, hurting and crippling children. The target was British kids and young teens. Britains Government told them to pray away the terrorism and did nothing more
3.Germany received over 1 million Muslim immigrants in the course of 12 months
4. Greece was sold piece by piece by the EU to their favorite buyers. Economically weak, unable to make a stand, Greece became the door to Europe with hundreds of thousands of immigrants arriving at it's shore. EU and most European Governments have zero concerns about the Greek people, Greece and basically told them to suck it up
5. Merkel would open the doors of Germany to "every Muslim around" . A country that killed 6 million Jews not long ago now inviting their enemy that wants Jews dead inside, even given them a house and allowance.

If someone told you this among other things in 2011 , would you believe it? The Islamization of Europe is happening not because of Islam but because EU is making it possible
Last edited by Politiks on 18 Dec 2017 17:05, edited 2 times in total.
#14872307
Politiks wrote:If someone told you this among other things in 2011 , would you believe it? The Islamization of Europe is happening not because of Islam but because EU is making it possible


No one would have believed it, and to be honest, that was a completely different world back then.

If someone had told me in 2011 that there would be nationalist, fascist, and proto-fascist movements in Europe and the United States and that the most important issue for the right would be immigration, I would not have believed them either.

If someone told me that the "New Atheists" like Sam Harris would be ostracized for criticizing Islam as they had criticized Christianity, I would not have believed it.

If someone told me that the Christian right would basically disappear as a legitimate political force and would be joining forces with neo-pagans, atheist, gay libertarians, and ex-democrats, etc., I would not have believed them.

If someone had told me that the Left would promote solidarity with Islam and the censorship of free speech, after they fought so hard for it against the religious right, I would never have believed it.

If someone told me that Wisconsin, Michigan, and Pennsylvania would have gone red behind a Donald Trump and Virginia blue and that Brexit would have occurred, I would not have believed it.

The world went from a war between ideologies (libertarian v. communist, Christian v. atheist) to a war between civilizations (the West v Islam) and between those who love their civilization (The New Right) and others that think societal suicide is a just outcome for sins of the past (The Multicultural, Gender Confused, Left).

This literally all happened in a two-year spread. 2014-2015.

Its still the Twilight Zone.
#14999953
What is another threat is the ultra leftists who are ANTI SOCIALIST, want to ACCEPT Islam! They call any resistor of Islamic imperialism to be "Racist," or "neo-Nazi." Ultra leftists use these terms that are usually used against right wingers to silence all resistors of Islamic imperialism, left wing or right wing.

To an ultra leftist viewpoint, if one promotes patriarchal sexist gender roles that Christianity promotes, then they are racist. However, if a MUSLIM promotes patriarchal sexist gender roles, it is "Part of their culture" and it is "racist" to go against Islamic sexism.
#15000047
SSDR wrote:What is another threat is the ultra leftists who are ANTI SOCIALIST, want to ACCEPT Islam! They call any resistor of Islamic imperialism to be "Racist," or "neo-Nazi." Ultra leftists use these terms that are usually used against right wingers to silence all resistors of Islamic imperialism, left wing or right wing.

To an ultra leftist viewpoint, if one promotes patriarchal sexist gender roles that Christianity promotes, then they are racist. However, if a MUSLIM promotes patriarchal sexist gender roles, it is "Part of their culture" and it is "racist" to go against Islamic sexism.

Yeah interesting that. Why do you suppose they do that? What is the real agenda?
#15000088
@SolarCross, The Muslim agenda is to use the ultra far left as a foundation for the Muslims to get their far right, reactionary stuff to rule the world. Those reactionaries are using progressive politicial correctness to defend themselves. It's like having a pro slavery idiot say that it's "racist" and "discriminate" to go against the pro slavery people.

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