Joe Biden: The Gift That Keeps On Giving - Politics Forum.org | PoFo

Wandering the information superhighway, he came upon the last refuge of civilization, PoFo, the only forum on the internet ...

Political issues and parties in the USA and Canada.

Moderator: PoFo North America Mods

Forum rules: No one line posts please.
#15031219
It's fascinating to me that anyone could consider voting for this guy. He seems like a decent enough guy (outside of the political spectrum) but, Jesus, he's fucking stupid:

https://www.foxnews.com/media/joe-biden-dreamers-illegal-immigration-2020-gaffes

https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/as-he-campaigns-for-president-joe-biden-tells-a-moving-but-false-war-story/2019/08/29/b5159676-c9aa-11e9-a1fe-ca46e8d573c0_story.html

The single easiest way for Trump to win a second term is to go up against Biden. The guy's fucking senile...
#15031229
BigSteve wrote:It's fascinating to me that anyone could consider voting for this guy.

Unfortunately, politics is often a series of choices. For people who won't vote for Trump and like the establishment status quo, Biden is pretty much it for now. However, he does say some crazy things like the capital gains rate should be 39.6 percent--want to see the biggest stock market crash in history? Just implement that one. :roll: The only other non-crazy Democrats running are Tulsi Gabbard and Steve Bullock. The rest of them are proposing to more or less give away everything possible with absolutely no means to pay for any of it--paying off people's student loans or medical debt.

BigSteve wrote:He seems like a decent enough guy (outside of the political spectrum) but, Jesus, he's fucking stupid:

He's got the politician disease of thinking he's smarter than he is. However, he has a history of off-the-cuff musings that make him seem a little daffy at times. I think what concerns most people right now is that he seems to be at the very early stages of dementia. He's clearly lost a step.

BigSteve wrote:The single easiest way for Trump to win a second term is to go up against Biden. The guy's fucking senile...

Well, it will be one of the funniest ways for Trump to win. The Democrats are eating their own right now. Why the left is attacking Obama, etc. is kind of bewildering.

Additionally, the DNC is prematurely trying to narrow the field. It's September 2019, not May of 2020. Yes, there are too many people running, but the voters should be making the choice, not the DNC or the media. This is why they lost last time. Hillary Clinton simply wasn't a likable person. Remember, early on the establishment thought the Republican front runner would be Jeb Bush. Yet, he didn't drop out until he placed poorly in South Carolina. The electorate often behaves in ways the establishment doesn't anticipate.
#15031230
@blackjack21 is entirely insincere. We could easily pay for M4A and tuition by halving the military budget. Something that the establishment votes to increase at every opportunity across party lines. Pretending like these social programs are a pipe dream while ignoring the military budget is simple demagoguery. Especially from someone who professes to be anti-war. No one actually supports Biden they just think he's gonna be the candidate because he has name recognition from being friends with Obama.
#15031232
Red_Army wrote:We could easily pay for M4A and tuition by halving the military budget.

Colleges and universities are bloated and grossly inefficient and offer degrees that are useless in the private sector but could meet the BA/BS degree requirement of some government jobs--like Asian Studies, Black Studies, Women's Studies, etc. Utterly pointless and useless degrees that saddle the holder with immense debt while more or less labelling them as "dummy" simultaneously. What we should be doing is suing colleges and universities for consumer fraud. Colleges and universities are corporations. They are businesses. The fact that many of them do not turn a profit does not mean that they do not engage in the same sorts of frauds as other businesses. Students need to have the same protections against predatory colleges and their often worthless products/services as consumers have consumer protections against unscrupulous car and insurance salesmen or stockbrokers. It's outrageous that such expensive products/services are offered to the public with no consumer protections whatsoever.

Red_Army wrote:Something that the establishment votes to increase at every opportunity across party lines.

Military spending could be made a hell of a lot more efficient too. I have never argued otherwise.

Red_Army wrote:Pretending like these social programs are a pipe dream while ignoring the military budget is simple demagoguery.

Socialized medicine takes away choice. In some countries, that's a very popular notion. The US could make health care much less expensive in other ways. Simply having the government pay for everything that is bloated and inexpensive takes away the incentive to make things more efficient. Markets can do that themselves if they aren't structurally regulated to keep costs going up. In today's deflationary environment, that's not something politicians are very likely to take up.

Red_Army wrote:Especially from someone who professes to be anti-war.

I've never purported to be a pacifist. I oppose the neoconservatives now, because I disagree with their notion of open borders and because I think their use of the military is overly ambitious. Militaries are good at killing people and destroying things. They aren't good at nation building. I was all on board with the Republican party and Bush in the early 2000s. The Republicans turned on people like me, and they have people like Ted Cruz and Donald Trump because of people like me.

Red_Army wrote:No one actually supports Biden they just think he's gonna be the candidate because he has name recognition from being friends with Obama.

That was part of my point--the establishment candidate (think Jeb Bush or Hillary Clinton) may be substantially less popular among the masses than the media would have you believe. Primary voters tend to be more extreme than general election voters.
#15032468
Red_Army wrote:If Bernie doesn't get it I hope Biden does so I can watch the two dumbest old dipshits drool and gesticulate confusedly at each other in between asking to see their mom.


One old fart puts you to sleep, the other old fart talked about some random rapper for weeks.
#15032482
Red_Army wrote:If Bernie doesn't get it I hope Biden does so I can watch the two dumbest old dipshits drool and gesticulate confusedly at each other in between asking to see their mom.


Bernie won't. He had his chance during the last cycle. Basically, since he was a relative new face with radical ideas (relative to what we tend to see in mainstream politics), that was the height of his popularity as well. Now, he's basically old news. IN fact, I heard a podcast recently that looked at data around this sort of thing. Basically, if a new face doesn't get elected on their first try, they pretty much fade away.

Had Obama not get elected on his first go around, he would have never become president. The same would have been true of Trump.
#15032491
All this focus on "win-ability" is why the USA has such shitty politics.

Perhaps if someone actually had a good program, and you were able to vote for them, this would be some kind of meaningful democracy.

But voting for which pleasant soundbite-producer gets to cut taxes to the rich and start wars... isn't really a meaningful type of democracy, and this means that freedom is all in the hands of the very few.
#15032502
As far as I can tell, of all the candidates Joe Biden has by far the greatest amount of experience with foreign leaders, but he admits to not being much of an economist. He has oodles of good economists from whom he can select a VP. But i very much doubt Mr Biden will become palsy with Korean thugs etc. And hopefully he will look after the environment.
#15032508
Joe Biden is lousy at presenting speeches. He seems like a nice guy, but the guy selling produce at Walmart could be a nice guy as well. Nice is not a good enough reason to vote for someone.

Listening to candidate speeches and the debates always irritates me. Talk is cheap. They will say anything for your vote.

We need someone smarter to defeat Trump. Heck, someone a bit younger would be great too. Trump is old enough to retire.
#15032517
QatzelOk wrote:All this focus on "win-ability" is why the USA has such shitty politics.


I agree.

QatzelOk wrote:Perhaps if someone actually had a good program, and you were able to vote for them, this would be some kind of meaningful democracy.

But voting for which pleasant soundbite-producer gets to cut taxes to the rich and start wars... isn't really a meaningful type of democracy, and this means that freedom is all in the hands of the very few.


People are too dumb. It's a beauty pageant basically.

Red_Army wrote:@Rancid you are pretty much talking out of your ass. Nobody knows whats gonna happen or what's possible.


Why you mad?

There's data to support this, so no, I'm not talking out of my ass. History suggests he is even less likely to get nominated this time around than the last time.

Another recent version of this was Ron Paul. He had a massive popularity spike/fervor back in 2008. He didn't get nominated/elected. He came back for 2012, and at that point, he was old news, and people weren't going goo goo gaa gaa as much. This will happen to Bernie too.

This happens because the people just like the freshness of whatever ideas the candidate puts forth. However, the second time around, they're just the same old ideas, so they aren't as fresh and exciting. People become desensitized/bored, basically.
#15032528
Without saying anything about his politics, is it realistic to seriously consider someone starting his first presidential term at age 77 ?
#15032534
Ter wrote:Without saying anything about his politics, is it realistic to seriously consider someone starting his first presidential term at age 77 ?


No. But Bernie Sanders is even older.

If the Democrats were serious about winning, they'd put up young blood. Trump is the oldest President to win, and will be the oldest ever if he sees the end of his second term. Why not put up someone younger against him? Corey Booker, Kamala Harris or Tulsi Gabbard(because fuck it why not go for both Youngest President and first woman at the same time?) would be the obvious choices.

I'd support Bernie Sanders winning, but mainly as a party apology for the 2016 screw over, I don't think he has a chance of beating Trump.
#15032555
colliric wrote:Corey Booker, Kamala Harris or Tulsi Gabbard(because fuck it why not go for both Youngest President and first woman at the same time?) would be the obvious choices.


Only Tulsi seems sane of those choices, but she's getting the Ron Paul treatment for being anti-war. So she doesn't stand a chance. People might as well stay at home. Democrats and Republicans are all compromised, both want war, they accuse each other of anti-Semitism, racism and so on. It's a circus.
Last edited by Code Rood on 08 Sep 2019 09:45, edited 1 time in total.
#15032623
Red_Army wrote:If he doesn't win it'll be because all of the big money doners in the Democratic party hate him.

This is speculation, but this could explain the phenomena I'm talking about. Now that Bernie is no longer a surprise to the Democratic party establishment. The second time around, they can better prepare/scheme to make sure he is out of the picture. This could explain Ron Paul's worsened results in 2012 versus 2008 as well. Republicans were better prepared to shutdown his message.

I think this is a good hypothesis, it just needs to be researched further.

I guess I don't understand why you seem so adverse to this idea.

Red_Army wrote:The rest of your polling data got you where predicting Trump's election?

No, my point was, the last election was his only really chance at getting elected. Had he failed, he would not be successful were he to try a second run. Kind of like Bernie, he wouldn't be a surprise, and the Republican establishment can scheme against him more appropriately.
#15032640
The Democrats are straight up retarded if they put Biden forth, dude needs to be put in a care home or torture prison, imho.

I concur, Rancid is talking out of his ass. I'm no fan of Bernie, but doubt anyone can beat Trump in the election.

Also, Bernie didn't lose last time, the DNC gave the ticket to Clinton, even though Bernie had much more support.

The Dow is down 10.43% in the past five days and t[…]

Satire 2018

https://i.imgur.com/UfNmGEc.png

No, Korea is testing more than 1,000 a day. They […]

Sanders doesn't need Florida. Florida is no longe[…]