'Europe can only be stronger with Russia,' claims Moldova's president - Page 2 - Politics Forum.org | PoFo

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#15067912
Zionist Nationalist wrote:
Russia will not become friends with Europe even after Putin unless Europe will agree to give up on Ukraine becoming EU or NATO member recognize Crimea or at least lift all sanctions and leave Ukraine under Russian sphere of influence
Russia is vulnerable without Ukraine and will never give up on its influence there



Lebensraum, we've heard that song before.

Excuses are dime a dozen...
#15067915
late wrote:Lebensraum, we've heard that song before.

Excuses are dime a dozen...


We've got 26.7 million ''excuses'', mr Lebensraum :roll:

Were the dead we lost a ''dime a dozen'' in the cynical calculus of your hysterical Anti-Russian narrative? I'm getting pretty sick of your baseless assertions and conspiratorial insinuations without substance, demonizing and dehumanizing a people and their leadership so that it can help towards having your dream come true of a world without Russia... Weak and broken up into dozens of pieces, a resource colony of the degenerate West.

Not going to happen.
#15067917
annatar1914 wrote:We've got 26.7 million ''excuses'', mr Lebensraum :roll:

Were the dead we lost a ''dime a dozen'' in the cynical calculus of your hysterical Anti-Russian narrative? I'm getting pretty sick of your baseless assertions and conspiratorial insinuations without substance, demonizing and dehumanizing a people and their leadership so that it can help towards having your dream come true of a world without Russia... Weak and broken up into dozens of pieces, a resource colony of the degenerate West.

Not going to happen.


Its all about power struggle and Ukraine is being played around like a whore but they are not gonna get what they have been promised. the Ukrainian leadership knows this but people are kept in the dark and given false hopes
Zelensky is an actor he was put in office to play a role he is not a real president

“It cannot be stressed enough that without Ukraine, Russia ceases to be an empire, but with Ukraine suborned and then subordinated, Russia automatically becomes an empire.”

― Zbigniew Brzeziński, Strategic Vision: America and the Crisis of Global Power
#15067923
Zionist Nationalist wrote:Its all about power struggle and Ukraine is being played around like a whore but they are not gonna get what they have been promised. the Ukrainian leadership knows this but people are kept in the dark and given false hopes
Zelensky is an actor he was put in office to play a role he is not a real president

“It cannot be stressed enough that without Ukraine, Russia ceases to be an empire, but with Ukraine suborned and then subordinated, Russia automatically becomes an empire.”

― Zbigniew Brzeziński, Strategic Vision: America and the Crisis of Global Power


Exactly. You and I know what the game is being played here. The same Fascists, Nazis, Uniates, and Banderist scum who wanted to exterminate all the Jews and Russians during the Great Patriotic War are still at it now, except by other means as much as possible because they are still weak 75 years later. They cannot be strong if Russia is strong.

Seems to me like Russia and Israel need to join forces, along with other countries.
#15067980
Zionist Nationalist wrote:Russia will not become friends with Europe even after Putin unless Europe will agree to give up on Ukraine becoming EU or NATO member recognize Crimea or at least lift all sanctions and leave Ukraine under Russian sphere of influence
Russia is vulnerable without Ukraine and will never give up on its influence there


You are a prisoner of a 19th century imperial mentality. If we apply that thinking to the 21st century, it'll mean guaranteed mutual destruction.

The only way to solve the Ukraine/Russia conflict is to offer both sides EU partnership on condition they solve their dispute.

In fact, that was initially part of the EU's Eastern Partnership program. The EU's Eastern Partnership program was offered to all countries in Eastern Europe: Russia, Ukraine, Moldova, Georgia, etc. That was when Putin proposed the economic zone from Lisbon to Vladivostok.

The project was torpedoed by trans-Atlanticists particularly in Washington and Warsaw who wanted to pull Ukraine into Nato and the EU while repelling Russia. The Poles were able to hijack Brussels' Eastern Partnership program because as a Slavic nation they were naturally taking a leading role in the program. We all know the outcome. That's why Warsaw has been excluded from the Minsk II peace talks. Europeans once again let themselves be divided by Yankee imperialists. We are still paying the price for their imperial divide and conquer strategy.
#15067985
Atlantis wrote:You are a prisoner of a 19th century imperial mentality. If we apply that thinking to the 21st century, it'll mean guaranteed mutual destruction.

The only way to solve the Ukraine/Russia conflict is to offer both sides EU partnership on condition they solve their dispute.

In fact, that was initially part of the EU's Eastern Partnership program. The EU's Eastern Partnership program was offered to all countries in Eastern Europe: Russia, Ukraine, Moldova, Georgia, etc. That was when Putin proposed the economic zone from Lisbon to Vladivostok.

The project was torpedoed by trans-Atlanticists particularly in Washington and Warsaw who wanted to pull Ukraine into Nato and the EU while repelling Russia. The Poles were able to hijack Brussels' Eastern Partnership program because as a Slavic nation they were naturally taking a leading role in the program. We all know the outcome. That's why Warsaw has been excluded from the Minsk II peace talks. Europeans once again let themselves be divided by Yankee imperialists. We are still paying the price for their imperial divide and conquer strategy.


Joining the West for Russia would be like chaining itself to a rotting corpse, resulting in Russia getting the contagion that has killed the West in it's turn.
#15068002
Atlantis wrote:You are a prisoner of a 19th century imperial mentality. If we apply that thinking to the 21st century, it'll mean guaranteed mutual destruction.


I am in fact pretty pessimistic on this.

Even if we do not possess such imperial mentality ourselves, I am pretty sure that there are nations and regimes who do. Sometimes this is even not entirely voluntary -- for example, some nations are simply so populous and everybody's demand in their standard of living is so high that whoever in charge must adopt some imperial mentality simply to survive.
#15068012
Heisenberg wrote:It's amazing to me that Russia is considered some uniquely evil, inherently irredeemable bogeyman.

Don't worry, Britain's on the right path to replace them as such. :lol:
#15068028
annatar1914 wrote:Joining the West for Russia would be like chaining itself to a rotting corpse, resulting in Russia getting the contagion that has killed the West in it's turn.


:lol:

Patrickov wrote:
I am in fact pretty pessimistic on this.

Even if we do not possess such imperial mentality ourselves, I am pretty sure that there are nations and regimes who do. Sometimes this is even not entirely voluntary -- for example, some nations are simply so populous and everybody's demand in their standard of living is so high that whoever in charge must adopt some imperial mentality simply to survive.


That's the imperialist's trick, don't you see? They are trying to fool you. The empire is far too small and powerless to control the whole world. For Pete's sake, the Yanks can't even control an impoverished war-ridden little shit hole like Afghanistan. They can only control their empire by deceit and divide and rule tactics. That's how a tiny little wind-swept island at the outer periphery of European civilization managed to amass a global empire: the perfidy of the Albion.

All we have to do is not to believe their imperial lies and not let Europe be divided again. It's dead simple. It's like with the king's new clothes. They don't stand up to closer examination. The cultural hegemony of the Anglosphere will collapse because its incapable of disentangling itself from the net of its own lies.

I don't mind the imperialists. They do what they have to do, but I do hate the imperial lackeys who play the imperial game to betray their own people. There is a special place in hell for them. :muha1:
#15068071
@late

Who is forcing Putin to invade their country next??


Russia has not invaded any country in recent years. The Crimea returned to Russia after a plebiscite, fearing Ukrainian fascist revival, and the Donbass region separated from the Ukraine after the Fascists took over during the ''Maidan'' revolution. And in 2008, there was a war with Georgia after it's insane then-President attempted an ethnic cleansing of disputed areas, so that Russian troops now occupy those regions after mauling the Georgian military in 48 hours. I'd be happy to provide details if you are not convinced, as i've got friends who were in the Donbass and were among the refugees who had to flee for their lives from the Ukrainian military driving them out. I myself saw the refugee centers in Russia, and people crying out for the Russian government to help the people of the Ukraine, when Russian involvement has been primarily humanitarian (Russians were allowed to volunteer under limited circumstances to fight with their brethren of the Donetsk and Lughansk People's Republics, while Nazis, Fascists, and Jihadis from around the world helped the Banderist side in the Ukraine) The Donbass is a primarily Velikorussian region, and had no reason to seek much military aid from Russia anyway, being Ukraine's Military-Industrial complex and having plenty of armories of mainly military equipment from the 60's and 70's and most adult men having done some service in the armed forces of either the Soviet Union and/or the Ukraine. The Ukrainian military talks of Russia invading them because in their attempt to do ethnic cleansing, they were badly beaten and humiliated by the defense militias of these Novorossiyan republics. Don't fall for the lies of the piece of shit Fascist scum who are mis-ruling the Ukraine now.

Be careful what you wish for, revanchist dreams give birth to bitter realities.


Delusional. A majority of people in the former Soviet Union want the USSR back in some fashion, but President Putin is definitely, most emphatically, absolutely not one of those people.
#15068137
Atlantis wrote:The cultural hegemony of the Anglosphere will collapse because its incapable of disentangling itself from the net of its own lies.


In Eastern EU this will not be the case. Anglo-American culture has very strong position there - everybody learns English at school, if you turn on any radio station 95% of music will be Anglo-American, new generation born after 1990s grew up on American movies. Although European movies are sometimes shown in TV, they are rare and usually very boring. In richer areas people decorate their houses with lights for christmas. In shopping malls you have Santa Claus events. They absolutely dominate on the internet. Nobody cares about French or German discussion forums. English language is the new universal language. Unlike Western EU, Eastern members don't care about climate change or environment much. In cities there are no limits based on car emission level and all cars can drive in cities for free (parking is not), despite traffic jams. All that reminds us of US.

Skilled workers from Eastern EU prefer Anglosphere countries over Germany. If I had identical job offers from US, UK and Germany, Germany would have 0% chance. If I had single offer from Germany, it would still have 0% chance. Germany simply can't compete with them for skilled worforce. It's not only cultural domination, but also economical. They basically have one huge trading area that includes all English speaking countries and Germany or even EU can't compete against that with its many languages. EU was created just to stand a chance in global competition.

You Germans don't see to be able to comprehend the current situation and you are letting Anglophobia cloud your judgement.
#15068141
Heisenberg wrote:About bloody time! You'd think after colonising a quarter of the world and generally being Machiavellian demons for 400 years, we'd get the recognition we deserve :evil:

If BoJo and Sunak really go for that Singapore-on-Thames thing ('unleashing Britain's potential') while the Russians proposing a fair and reasonable Common Economic Space from Lisbon to Vladivostok, I wonder whether how much time it's going to take for Europeans, the French and the Germans especially, to consider the Anglos rather than the Russians their enemies.
#15068149
annatar1914 wrote:


Russia has not invaded any country in recent years. The Crimea returned to Russia after a plebiscite



and you call me delusional...

you know, if you're going to use Spetznaz troops to invade a country, using Russian uniforms without emblems doesn't really disguise them.

and if there's one thing Putin is good at, it's faking elections..
#15068156
and you call me delusional...

you know, if you're going to use Spetznaz troops to invade a country, using Russian uniforms without emblems doesn't really disguise them.


First of all Russian troops were already there in the Crimea, as part of Russia's relationship with all the previous Ukrainian governments before the Fascist coup.

Second, wearing baklavas and not having unit patches on lowers the risk of reprisals from fanatics and terrorists upon individual soldiers, because that's what chickenshits tend to do all around the world against troops.

and if there's one thing Putin is good at, it's faking elections..


Retarded. If Crimea being once again Russian land was unpopular among residents of Crimea, there would be at least some slight evidence of it. As it is there is none. Nobody with sense wants to be ruled by Ukrainian Banderists. Besides, President Putin doesn't have to ''fake'' elections, when a solid plurality of citizens continues to support him and his opposition is divided among numerous other candidates.

You have no idea whatsoever of what you're talking about. You know no history, no cultural or political contexts, likely don't know or understand anyone from eastern europe (except maybe some westernized liberal from Moscow or St. Petersburg who's learned to parrot the same political shibboleths as yourself, or else you're someone like a Ukrainian Fascist who's learned to pretend to be a Western liberal as political cover for Nazism) anymore than you likely do not know or understand anyone from ''flyover country'' in the United States. What you think you know of them you despise. You're so out of touch with reality and yet so mind-bogglingly arrogant and contemptuous, that it's going to be a genuine pleasure to see your whole world burn down to the ground in the coming years and collapse into ruin.
#15068157
@fokker, don't keep on telling me what I allegedly don't understand, if you don't even understand what I describe here in great detail. I perfectly well understand what's happening in Eastern Europe and I also have a head start of several decades over you guys of intimate knowledge of the Anglosphere. Intimate knowledge has nothing to do with any phobia. It means that you are capable of judging the merits and demerits of something instead of viewing it through rose-tinted glasses.

The point here is that democracy and the functioning of the EU are new to you guys. You may have your own vision of what type of democracy or EU you want, but that doesn't mean that is even possible. Democracy has certain minimum requirements which many in the East don't accept. That doesn't mean they have a better form of democracy. It means they want to replace democracy with a type of autocracy, because they aren't used to democracy. Similarly, the EU is a consensus-driven elaborate organism that has grown over more than 60 years, most of which you have no idea about. Giving in to the new members would actually destroy the EU since the EU can't function the way they imagine it should. The proof is in the doing.

Even if you don't understand it, but the Germans have made great efforts to pamper Eastern Europeans in order to keep the EU together. Most in the EU, especially France, take a more sanguine view of this. But here it is, the real beauty of the EU, these approaches complement each other, they don't conflict with each other. Merkel's caution and Macron's impatiens complement each other. Macron can afford to kick arse without you guys starting to scream Nazi or Ribbentrop. That's how the EU can advance. If you don't want to follow, no problem, you can stay at the periphery without influence while core Europe moves ahead. The EU has the Advanced Cooperation provision, which allows 6 members to move ahead even if the rest doesn't want to follow. Alternately, you can chose to be f*cked in the behind by the Russians, Chinese, Yanks, or why not, the Turks, as is the eternal fate of the imperialist lackeys. :D
#15068161
Beren wrote:If BoJo and Sunak really go for that Singapore-on-Thames thing ('unleashing Britain's potential') while the Russians proposing a fair and reasonable Common Economic Space from Lisbon to Vladivostok, I wonder whether how much time it's going to take for Europeans, the French and the Germans especially, to consider the Anglos rather than the Russians their enemies.


We are getting there, Beren, one step at at time, slowly but surely. :excited:

Both the French president and the German president have recently cited "Russia, China and the US" in one breath as our systemic rivals.
#15068164
I don't see something foreseeable for this matter. All Europe is in demographic decline whereas Middle Eastern countries are getting bigger. Prosperity is leaving Europe.

It is more like Turkey will replace Russia as strongest army in the region. National defence industry is catching up Western standradrs very quickly. I believe that Turkey will be able make overseas military operations on its own. It will be real in 5 to 10 years.

In the beginning of the Syrian Civil War, Turkey was importing a huge portion of its military equipment. Now national defense industry accounts for 70% of all military equipments. This is obiviously a real change which should be noticed.
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