Does China Owe Reparations for Coronavirus? - Page 5 - Politics Forum.org | PoFo

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Does China Owe Reparations for Coronavirus?

1. Yes, they do.
10
29%
3. No.
23
68%
4. Other
1
3%
#15080614
Patrickov wrote:
All nations do and should try to stay ahead of it's tendency to collapse into chaos. What I perceive is that China either is not up to the job or sometimes deliberately sabotages the effort, because those in power believe themselves staying in power is the way to achieve it, when (at least occasionally) the opposite is true.

I acknowledge the risk part to be factual so the problem is what will happen when the said collapse becomes inevitable or imminent.



It's a risk we don't have to take.
#15080618
late wrote:It's a risk we don't have to take.


Sorry I did not make it clear enough. I agree that many find the risk of forcing China falling into chaos undesirable and unnecessary. I don't necessarily hold that view, and I think the problem is that this collapse seems inevitable.
#15080621
Patrickov wrote:
Sorry I did not make it clear enough. I agree that many find the risk of forcing China falling into chaos undesirable and unnecessary. I don't necessarily hold that view, and I think the problem is that this collapse seems inevitable.



You want to make it inevitable, not the same thing.

Life is a fragile thing, and humanity has a steadily growing risk of cascade failure.
#15080622
China is socialist by name but de facto its national socialist (fascist)
their ultimate goal is to create an orwellian society (they are very close doing this)
and than project the same "ideas" all over the world

you think American imperialism is bad? wait until China takes over you will beg for the yankees to bomb you
#15080623
@Patrickov COVID-19 is causing people to die, not China, so your argument is complete rubbish.

To put it in terms you'd understand, it's like walking thru the departments store, someone else breaking something, and you being asked to pay for it.
#15080624
late wrote:Life is a fragile thing, and humanity has a steadily growing risk of cascade failure.


I agree with this observation.


Godstud wrote:COVID-19 is causing people to die, not China, so your argument is complete rubbish.

To put it in terms you'd understand, it's like walking thru the departments store, someone else breaking something, and you being asked to pay for it.


My observation is that Chinese policies (initial cover-up of the epidemic, and some face-mask procurement or availability related policies) or the personalities of many Chinese (some of them tried to go away to "avoid" infection, not knowing the some of them are already infected, while others tried to procure face masks for themselves) cause many infected (some of those not to have symptoms) to spread the virus out of its borders and expose other countries to the virus.

In other words, China is the person, foreign people are the vases, and the Chinese people going abroad and spreading the virus are the hands that (unintentionally) break the vases.

I do acknowledge that foreign countries transporting their citizens in China back is not necessarily a good idea either, and some of them have been lackey in dealing with possible outbreaks.
#15080627
You could say the same of the American federal response, which is irresponsible, at best. States begging for help. No Leadership.

So... First, remove the beam out of your own eye, and then you can see clearly to remove the speck out of your brother's eye.
#15080628
Godstud wrote:The very idea of reparations for a pandemic is absurd. Nobody wanted this to be spread. You'd have to find some actual purpose and intent behind this, and that's impossible to determine.


So you forget you posted this when you are bashing the American president. How convenient.


Godstud wrote:You could say the same of the American federal response, which is irresponsible, at best. States begging for help. No Leadership.

So... First, remove the beam out of your own eye, and then you can see clearly to remove the speck out of your brother's eye.



wow it only took a couple post for you to forget on this thread. Holy hypocritical Batman.
#15080632
Finfinder wrote:So you forget you posted this when you are bashing the American president. How convenient.
How is that relevant? I am not expecting Trump to pay reparations if he drops the ball on this, as he is. There is no federal leadership.

Finfinder wrote:wow it only took a couple post for you to forget on this thread. Holy hypocritical Batman.
Holy Dumbass, Batman, What's your point? I am pointing out that you can't ask for reparations for a disease! That's not hypocritical, but I don't think you know what the word means. Wiki it.

@Patrickov Just as dumb.
#15080635
No. China does should not and will not pay reparations for a disease that most countries aren't handling nearly as well.

When people complain about the disease spreading, one needs only look at Taiwan to see a perfect response to a pandemic. They knew at the same time everyone else did, but they ACTED, and didn't WAIT, like most other countries have.
#15080637
Godstud wrote:No. China does should not and will not pay reparations for a disease that most countries aren't handling nearly as well.


If China had not had the virus starting there and spreading out of it, other countries would not have had to deal with it in the first place.

Though as I said, I agree with the "will not" prediction.
#15080638
Godstud wrote:How is that relevant? I am not expecting Trump to pay reparations if he drops the ball on this, as he is. There is no federal leadership.

Holy Dumbass, Batman, What's your point? I am pointing out that you can't ask for reparations for a disease! That's not hypocritical, but I don't think you know what the word means. Wiki it.

@Patrickov Just as dumb.


How is it relevant because the Chinese are fucking liars. Sure you can ask for reparations from a disease when it was the fault of China and it was the fault of China to lie about its reporting of said disease.
Do you believe the bullshit it came from some market? That is joke.

And it is relevant to the USA's response to have accurate information. So stick to shitting all over your own country whichever one that you have not already abandoned.
#15080639
Patrickov wrote:He still does, but how does that affect the poll's main question? Sincerely it is not relevant.

I urge Trump-supporters to stop derailing this debate.


It's totally relevant Because the Chinese are fucking liars. You can't answer the poll to acquit the Chinese because they lie. It goes to a posters credibility. How can you say China doesn't owe reparation then shill all over the USA's response when China wasn't honest about when it started or occured.
.
They always lie about everything. Where did the virus form some market or a lab that happens to be in the middle of the epicenter?
Last edited by Finfinder on 01 Apr 2020 15:23, edited 1 time in total.
#15080642
Again, you're blaming China for a disease that is nigh impossible to contain, as is evident by it being in every country in the world. Pretending a disease can't skip over borders is ridiculous, and since it can be transmitted before symptoms show. make it even harder to contain.. Even if China had responded perfectly, it's extremely unlikely that they could have contained it.

Blaming China for failing to contain a disease, that's extremely easy to transmit, is just STUPID.

SHOULD NOT, is the proper response.

Why don't you just admit that you fucking hate China and that makes you extremely prejudiced against them, @Patrickov. You're practically racist in your hatred that you've shown. Forget the feelings and deal with facts.

I will deal with the part of your post that isn't a childish rant, @Finfinder
Finfinder wrote:And it is relevant to the USA's response to have accurate information
USA had accurate enough information to declare it a pandemic well before it was done. They had as much time as Taiwan did and look how well they handled it.

Finfinder wrote:So stick to shitting all over your own country whichever one that you have not already abandoned.
Ah, back to insults since you aren't nearly smart enough to have any kind argument. Speak for yourself. I served my country. Did you?

Stick to tugging President Bonespurs off. It's about all your kind are capable of.
#15080644
Godstud wrote:Again, you're blaming China for a disease that is nigh impossible to contain, as is evident by it being in every country in the world. Pretending a disease can't skip over borders is ridiculous, and since it can be transmitted before symptoms show. make it even harder to contain.. Even if China had responded perfectly, it's extremely unlikely that they could have contained it.

Blaming China for failing to contain a disease, that's extremely easy to transmit, is just STUPID.

SHOULD NOT, is the proper response.

Why don't you just admit that you fucking hate China and that makes you extremely prejudiced against them, Patrickov. You're practically racist in your hatred that you've shown. Forget the feelings and deal with facts.



It is common sentiment in Hong Kong that China is responsible for cover-up and making the spread as serious as now in the first place.

I am already being reasonable because I do agree that most other countries (Germany, Japan and Taiwan are exceptions) also did a very bad job. They have no excuses either. But that doesn't mean China can be exonerated.
Last edited by Patrickov on 01 Apr 2020 15:28, edited 1 time in total.
#15080645
Right, so since there aren't any perfect countries. Expecting perfection of China is completely unreasonable. Your reaction is only tied to your abject hated of China, and nothing reasonable or logical.

Your feelings towards China distort your view of reason and logic. As a result you can't make an intelligent argument.
Last edited by Godstud on 01 Apr 2020 15:28, edited 1 time in total.
#15080646
China is in fact responsible for this virus due to a severe lack of hygiene standards in several of its markets and she is also responsible for the spread of the pandemic as well because she lied about it, she hid the truth and she even murdered/beat/imprisoned those who spoke up about it. She is not just responsible for criminal negligence but also for covering it up.

Calling it the "Chinese virus", putting China in the corner for it and maintaining this kind of political pressure on her is of course the logical thing to do with a view of imposing trade restrictions on her unless she changes her ways to better implement hygiene standards and to liberalise her political structures so that whistleblowers are not placed in body-bags.

China needs to be told in very clear terms that she either becomes more open/democratic or she gets economically isolated from the west completely. This should go for everyone else as well. Fascism & dictatorship are "fine" as long as those engaging in it are in quarantine from the global travelling & trading system. Basically any government found not to adhere on basic liberal & democratic principles for the whole or part of their population should have their international organisation status revoked(UN, WHO, WTO, etcetera).

That is assuming that our liberal democratic order actually survives the crisis and we do not end up with fascism globally in the end.

The same needs to be told to the Americans and that orange buffoon they voted into place. That buffoon the Americans call a president would be in prison now if he was the PM of any European country as European countries force elected officials to publish their tax returns and generally the countries themselves have very high standards of what their elected officials can and cannot say.
#15080648
Godstud wrote:Right, so since there aren't any perfect countries. Expecting perfection of China is completely unreasonable. Your reaction is only tied to your abject hated of China, and nothing reasonable or logical.

Your feelings towards China distort your view of reason and logic. As a result you can't make an intelligent argument.



There are countries which contained the disease successfully so the "impossible" argument does not hold.

I am not expecting perfection in China, and I did say in the main epidemic thread that having 100,000 of their own people dying in the epidemic is not necessarily Communists' fault (because of the vast population of China), but at least the spreading out thing is avoidable, which is the main point of this debate. Both Koreas might have thousands dying there but they don't seem spreading it out. Nor does Japan and Taiwan.
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