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#15120312
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https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/54175545

Getting pissed off with the Tory BS at the moment. Bad enough you were allowed to drive to test your eyesight but couldn't see your gran, we now have Patel saying it's against the law to say hello to a friend on the highstreet but football is getting the OK to allow fans to watch games.

Don't get me wrong, I'm all for common sense and that individuals should evaluate their own risk so perhaps watching a game of football is OK under the right settings. But what is annoying me is the contradiction of when and who you can socialise with. Seems you can meet up with a stranger or your work colleague at any number whether it's at the pub or whatever. But babysitting the grandkids is a fucking no no if you have three of them.
#15120333
Is it the pandemic BS that bothers you the most? How about possibly breaking international law right after you made an agreement with your very most important trading partner? Or is it just peanuts in BoJo's Wonderland? :lol:
#15120338
Beren wrote:Is it the pandemic BS that bothers you the most? How about possibly breaking international law right after you made an agreement with your very most important trading partner? Or is it just peanuts in BoJo's Wonderland? :lol:


Surprised you haven't made a thread on the international breach actually. But sure that bothers me. The same way Brexit bothers me. But like the US and Trump, the UK cannot move forward until the Tories are out and Labour are in. And next year will be a clusterfuck that will break the Tories as no deal is a certainty.

As for Covid, it's the contradiction that bothers me. That is I am fed up of bluster but no action on the things that matter to please the elite but still trying to appease the doomsayers by stopping socialising. As if they took that action with Cummings.
#15120342
B0ycey wrote:Surprised you haven't made a thread on the international breach actually.

Why are you surprised so much when there's no British poster to do it? Even the Brits are tired of themselves it seems. :lol:
#15120345
Beren wrote:Why are you surprised so much when there's no British poster to do it? Even the Brits are tired of themselves it seems. :lol:


Perhaps because Brexit has become boring. When there was hope, it was interesting. But now its like, well let's just get it over with and deal with the forecoming consequence as that is the only way anyone can see what the EU means here. Also, the Brexit clusterfuck will be what breaks the Tories. When the shelves are empty, they will have to answer to that. Nonetheless, the UK reputation will be hindered with the rest of Europe and I expect to read more posts on the Albion imperialism and the Anglo mentality of plutocracy on here, but the reputation starts and ends with the Tories. Once they are out relationships will be rebuilt because we are neighbours. And in that regard, this new law is just another nail in the coffin for the Tories and perhaps it will bring some realism to our global relationships for future UK governments.
#15120346
B0ycey wrote:Perhaps because Brexit has become boring.

The UK and its politics have become boring as well. Or boring is not the best expression perhaps, they've become absurd and tiring. A kind of Monty Python Show. Even that can't be amusing and popular forever.
#15120353
Beren wrote:Is it the pandemic BS that bothers you the most? How about possibly breaking international law right after you made an agreement with your very most important trading partner? Or is it just peanuts in BoJo's Wonderland? :lol:


Technically he hasn't broken it yet, he has just moved the power to do so from parliament to ministers, but I think he's deluding himself if he thinks that will achieve anything.

B0ycey was in favor of herd immunity, he must have been quite disappointed when Boris switched course.
#15120357
Rugoz wrote:B0ycey was in favor of herd immunity, he must have been quite disappointed when Boris switched course.


Indeed. I was quite complimentary of our approach for like two weeks in February. But to be honest @Rugoz, if you do a Lockdown, it needed to be a Wuhan lockdown to bring cases to virtually zero. Not this half in half out bollocks and stopping when there are still a relevant number of cases because it was hurting your economy. We now have cases going up and no idea what to do next. Typical Tories.
#15120361
B0ycey wrote:We now have cases going up and no idea what to do next. Typical Tories.

It's not typical Tories, it's typical Anglos it seems because it's the same in the US. And maybe you'll follow them trade war-wise too, although you're not in the same league as the EU.
#15120363
Beren wrote:It's not typical Tories, it's typical Anglos it seems because it's the same in the US. And maybe you'll follow them trade war-wise too, although you're not in the same league with the EU.


I wouldn't put is in the same position as the US but Europe actually. Cases aren't pretty anywhere in the continent except Sweden it seems. And of course, as the UK followed Europe they also will follow their mistakes. But we will see what Winter brings before I make a conclusion on that.
#15120367
B0ycey wrote:Indeed. I was quite complimentary of our approach for like two weeks in February. But to be honest @Rugoz, if you do a Lockdown, it needed to be a Wuhan lockdown to bring cases to virtually zero. Not this half in half out bollocks and stopping when there are still a relevant number of cases because it was hurting your economy. We now have cases going up and no idea what to do next. Typical Tories.


The difference is that casualties/people in intensive care don't seem to go up this time, though that might change.
#15120369
Beren wrote:Well, I wouldn't put you in the same position as Germany, your government especially, for sure.


Why? Their R0 is above 1 and so is ours. There cases have shot up so have ours. If that trend continues throughout winter Germany will have more of an issue trying to control cases without a lockdown to the UK because of whatever herd immunity there is currently between nations.

Besides, I didn't think you were a fan of lockdowns either? Or have you changed your mind?
#15120373
B0ycey wrote:Why? Their R0 is above 1 and so is ours. There cases have shot up so have ours. If that trend continues throughout winter Germany will have more of an issue trying to control cases without a lockdown to the UK because of whatever herd immunity there is currently between nations.

Besides, I didn't think you were a fan of lockdowns either? Or have you changed your mind?

I rather meant to speak in general, however, even the Germans can't beat the Swedes.
#15120377
Rugoz wrote:The difference is that casualties/people in intensive care don't seem to go up this time, though that might change.


Funny thing is, that was the reason for lockdown and the make shift hospitals and the ventilator call and yet it never materialised in these things being overloaded, even in the UK where clearly we were the worse performers in terms of deaths. And sure perhaps the reason hospital admissions haven't gone up could be a sign that this virus mutated to a less deadly variant now. But I digest, the correct solution was Swedish approach and to let people taking responsibility for their own health and only enforce preventive measures. And now everyone is following the Swedish model in any case, although some nations are better then others even here.
#15120379
Beren wrote:I rather meant to speak in general, however, even the Germans can't beat the Swedes.


Oh yes. In general Merkel is better than anything we have here. :lol:

And I agree, Social Democracy, the Scandinavian model, is the best form of government full stop.
#15120395
B0ycey wrote:Funny thing is, that was the reason for lockdown and the make shift hospitals and the ventilator call and yet it never materialised in these things being overloaded, even in the UK where clearly we were the worse performers in terms of deaths. And sure perhaps the reason hospital admissions haven't gone up could be a sign that this virus mutated to a less deadly variant now. But I digest, the correct solution was Swedish approach and to let people taking responsibility for their own health and only enforce preventive measures. And now everyone is following the Swedish model in any case, although some nations are better then others even here.


The reason for the lockdown was to prevent deaths, and Sweden had a lot of them compared to its neighbors. If deaths go up substantially, I expect another lockdown.

The Swedish approach would have been a disaster with a people like the British.
#15120402
Rugoz wrote:The reason for the lockdown was to prevent deaths, and Sweden had a lot of them compared to its neighbors. If deaths go up substantially, I expect another lockdown.

The Swedish approach would have been a disaster with a people like the British.


The reason for lockdown was not to stop deaths but to protect the NHS FYI.

Nonetheless you'll be surprised how cooperative the UK public were at first. So you are wrong. And so was I. Because I didn't think they would be so good at following the rules either. It changed with the Cummings affair when Johnsons approval ratings tanked soon after. And now we are under the Swedish model in any case regardless whether the Tories are consistent in their message or not - which they aren't hence the OP.

Nonetheless the problem with our cases going up is with the low risk group anyways. Where the at risk group are largely staying indoors and taken the correct approach, the low risk group are socialising indoors and going on holiday and interacting. And that perhaps isn't a bad thing as deaths are still averaging 11 and you are gaining a degree of herd immunity off that. Especially with Winter coming and us all being indoors more soon. It isn't that I support herd immunity by the way. It is that people should be evaluating their own risk in order to keep society functioning which is what is happening.

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