- 20 Apr 2018 07:46
#14907882
Verv wrote:My liberty is actually being hurt if I am forced to do anything, Godstud.Well, unfortunately, in the real world, there is no such thing as 100% liberty. We have laws and rules to limit that for the safety of the public. We also do not have it so that people can be treated fairly.
Verv wrote:Liberty is the act of being unhindered in what you do. So how would my liberty not be hurt if I was forced to provide labor for something that I think is immoral?Morality is subjective. If society does not deem it immoral, it is not. Homosexuality is not considered immoral in most societies. That some people don't find it such, is irrelevant.
Verv wrote:Godstud's very position is:Do not assume to know my position. You are making a stupid assumption about my position without considering the ramifications of unregulated discrimination.
- If you do not do what the minority wants, you are harming him. Correct?
In this case, because you didn't bake him a cake... You harmed him.
Verv wrote:Here is another question: if discrimination is 100% illegal, then you would agree that the only grounds for which a Hotel can refuse service to an Alt Right seminar or Alt Right gathering would be if it literally was already booked and already in business, right? They have to otherwise host an Alt Right event.I never said discrimination is 100% illegal. That's absurd, and I never said as such. Discrimination on certain grounds, is illegal. Please... do not assume to know my position, and mock it, if you clearly have no clue as to what it is.
Verv wrote:Wouldn't it be upsetting for Jewish or Indina-American or black American people who own hotels to be subjected to hosting an event for an organization against their interests?You can do so. You would, however, likely have to defend that position in court, and if the law didn't agree with you, pay restitution for that discrimination.
Verv wrote:Likewise, imagine a private clothier who specializes in making vestaments for Catholic clergymen. If he was forced to knowingly make custom made clothing mimicking Catholic monastic clothing and other official vestaments to be used in the production of film or photography mocking Catholicism through adult entertainemtn and some such, would that not violate his conscience?Only if he could prove that by doing so he would be hurting his business. You're worried about his conscience/feelings, again.
Verv wrote:I do not understand how allowing the rights of people to choose to withhold their labor protects Liberty: it violates the liberty of the people involved.Yes, but at the same time it ensures that others retain their liberty and are treated fairly, and without discrimination, or bias. What of their liberty to live without people discriminating against them based on religion, race, etc.?
“Let me never fall into the vulgar mistake of dreaming that I am persecuted whenever I am contradicted.” ― Ralph Waldo Emerson