The guilt of intellectuals in helping to bring the Nazism - Politics Forum.org | PoFo

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#1719758
Joachim C Fest the best author on the Third Reich lays the blame where few liberals dare to do, he quotes the Jewish novelist, playwright, and poet Franz Werfel, who also went into exile, who unambiguously acknowledges the responsibility which he and his his own generation of artists and extremist, he even castigated himself for his arrogance: "Applauded by the laughter of a few philistines, we stoked the inferno in which mankind is now frying"

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Between Heaven and Earth‎ - Page 250 by Franz Werfel

Franz Werfel, once a member of the Expressionist avant-garde, wrote shortly before his death in Hollywood in August 1945, one of the most succinct characterizations of the age to which Hitler finaly took power


The Face Of The Third Reich
by Joachim C Fest
'Perhaps the most important recent addition to the literature on the Third Reich'—Hannah Arendt


http://www.ourcivilisation.com/smartboa ... chap20.htm

The Intellectuals And National Socialism
Part 3 — Functionaries Of Totalitarian Rule
I don't want any intellectuals!— Adolf Hitler

In every spiritual attitude a political attitude is latent. —Thomas Mann




The aim of this first period was defined by Reich Minister Frick in the words: 'An end must be put once and for all to this spirit of subversion that has gnawed for long enough at Germany's heart.' Chief among the measures adopted to this end were the mass introduction of new professors into the universities, the suppression of unwanted artists by forcibly preventing them from working and legally banning their work, and the most spectacular gesture of resolute hostility to the intellect: the burning of some 20,000 so-called un-German writings in the public squares of German university towns to the accompaniment of SA and SS bands playing 'patriotic airs'.

Almost more staggering were the countless half-pacts with the National Socialist leaders, the attitude of those prepared to back any theoretical anti-intellectualism, who evidently persuaded themselves that barbarism was divisible and finally saw in National Socialism the degeneration of their folk, anti-rational ideals of a rebirth of the soul or whatever it might be. These were people like the literary historian and poet Ernst Bertrand who, during the first days of May 1933, set out to remove from the lists of works to be burnt the books of his personal friends Thomas Mann and Friedrich Gundolf, and after succeeding in this wrote happily that now he could 'participate in the solemn auto-da-fe' and actually had a poem to the flames, specially written for the occasion, read out in public.

Within those weeks no fewer than 250 writers left Germany, giving the cue for a process of unparalleled cultural wastage whose after-effects can still be felt. Others withdrew and fell silent out of disgust and helpless anger. But the nationalist intoxication swept away such feelings, and where official intellectuals did not avert their eyes in embarrassment from the many tragedies of the outlawed and expelled, they mocked them in the full consciousness of their fine illusions. 'If the fulminations of world opinion strike us because we have ostensibly betrayed freedom, we can only smile wryly as they do who know the facts,' Wilhelm Schafer declared in a speech in Berlin under the self-confidently ironic title 'Germany's Relapse into the Middle Ages'. And while Rudolf G. Binding in his 'A German's Answer to the World' defended the expulsions on the grounds of the national interest and stated: 'Germany this Germany — was born of the furious longing, the inner obsession, the bloody agonies of wanting Germany: at any price, at the price of every downfall,'

Finally, any inquiry into the causes and responsibility for the failure of the educated classes continually leads back to that crisis of consciousness whose protracted preparatory phase reached its climax in the infectious spiritual climate of the 1920s. Every intellectual knows an occasional temptation to fall for the charlatan; in each there lives an urge to the Black Mass, a desire to 'turn the world of the spirit upside down with an intellectual gesture, to interchange the signs that mark its whole system of relationships, as the practical joker switches all the shoes outside the doors of hotel rooms during the night'.

But when the charlatans and 'practical jokers' suddenly appear in droves and, not with the gesture of ironic detachment but the mien of dark wisdom, as though they were continually holding anguished converse with angels, then everything points to one of those crises of the spirit that precede politico-moral catastrophes. A culture whose mouthpieces, to the applause of the majority, had long since become the spokesmen for the defamation and negation of everything upon which this culture rested could no longer credibly oppose its own destruction. The Expressionist poet Hanns Johst, later President of the Reich Chamber of Writers, went to the heart of this crisis when he made the hero of one of his dramas say that he released the safety catch of his Browning as soon as he heard the word 'culture'; fundamentally, everyone did. F. G. Junger wrote: 'Every new screw in the machine-gun, every improvement in gas warfare, is more important than the League of Nations.'

Symptoms of the same condition showed in the contempt for man seen in literature and art, the brutality of style and expression which ran parallel with the mania for twilight and darkness, the delight in barbarism, downfall, myth and cynicism which were not confined to the political right. Looking back, as one who was for a time part of all this, Franz Werfel confessed in terms that are probably not universally valid but certainly largely apply to the situation at that time: 'There is no more consuming, impudent, mocking, more devil-possessed arrogance than that of the avant-garde artist and radical intellectual who are bursting with the vain hankering to be deep and obscure and difficult and to inflict pain. To the accompaniment of the amusedly indignant laughter of a few philistines we inconspicuously heated up the hell in which mankind is now frying.'

Keyed as they were to a mood of downfall and destruction, artists, writers and intellectuals as a whole failed to see that the culture which they were slandering included everything upon which their existence as artists, writers and intellectuals rested, and many eventually acclaimed the victory of National Socialism precisely because of the possibilities of barbarism and chaos which it brought with it — to the terror, as they thought, only of a 'cowardly and well-fed bourgeoisie'.

The guilt of intellectual radicalism in helping to bring about National Socialism lies in the way it prepared public opinion for the regime's excessive claims in all fields, in its expulsion of reason, its devaluation of the image of man, its scorn for all those who still recognised truths or moral standards and its consistent denunciation of all ethical principles, these being presented under the guise of a fresh, undismayed, undeluded feeling for life. This is an incontestable fact, regardless of such questions as whether an intellectual attitude can be held responsible for what happens when that same attitude is fraudulently distorted and actually put into practice. 'Everything romantic stands in the service of other, unromantic energies,' wrote Carl Schmitt in 1925, involuntarily giving himself away.

User avatar
By Anothroskon
#1719809
Nazism didn't arise by itself. There was a turn of a large part of society towards occultism, pseudoscience and irrationality. These were a means of negotiating the psychological effects of Germany's defeat and abject humiliation in WWI. Obviously they didn't work too well since they just produced even more of the same.

German scientist Willy Ley's Pseudoscience in Naziland is supposed to be a classic on the issue but I have as of yet been unable to find the whole article on-line but only, very tantalizing, fragments. He describes among others the Welt Eis Lehre or Cosmic Ice Theory which you'll have to read to believe that anyone actually believed in it.

The worrying thing is that Germany was at the time, as it still is, one of the most educated, literate and scientifically advanced societies on the world. The moral is that if it could happen there it can happen anywhere.
By Dempsey
#1719822
Nazism didn't arise by itself. There was a turn of a large part of society towards occultism, pseudoscience and irrationality.


Joachim Fest refers on the reasonability of the humanist enlightenment German intellectuals not the philistines
User avatar
By Anothroskon
#1719837
Both he and Lay point out the anti-intellectualist current that enabled the Nazis to be taken at face value, as opposed to being taken to a nice, white, padded cell. To be fair though, prior to WWII racism, nationalism and fascism were not discredited and their adherents could and did proudly proclaim their allegiance rather than having to resort to devious word games like they do today.

the attitude of those prepared to back any theoretical anti-intellectualism
By Dempsey
#1719976
The point here is how radical intellectuals (many of them Jews) mocking every sacred thing in German life brought inevitable backlash. We hear very little about this dark aspect. I've read it at the first time in Fest book. How many left wing intellectuals castigated themselves for thier action before Hitler took the power? The left always sounds so self-righteousness. But this aspect clarify how it could be happen.

As you wrote:
The worrying thing is that Germany was at the time, as it still is, one of the most educated, literate and scientifically advanced societies on the world. The moral is that if it could happen there it can happen anywhere.
User avatar
By Potemkin
#1720029
The point here is how radical intellectuals (many of them Jews) mocking every sacred thing in German life brought inevitable backlash.

Ah, so that's your agenda. The Jews and the Lefties are really to blame for Nazism, which was merely an understandable reaction to the sight of sacred German values being trampled underfoot by Jews and left-wing intellectuals. The Final Solution was no more than they deserved for their arrogance and their crimes against German culture. Gotcha. :up:
By Dempsey
#1720116
Potemkin
The Final Solution was no more than they deserved for their arrogance and their crimes against German culture. Gotcha.


When the Nazis took power no one predicted the Final Solution. The German people didn't support Nazi take over in 1933 for its Final Solution (which was a WWII result). They supported it because they want it to put the house in order.

Becuse the enormous suffering and injustice directed towards the German dissident we hear little about this little-discussed aspect.

After WWII, German historiography (in fact the west as a whole) tried to learn and teach a lesson from this time, thus focusing only on the anti intellectualism, occultism, pseudoscience and irrationality as contributors for the rise of Nazi power. The martyrdom of the German left wing dissident should not blare us to see the whole picture.

The radical intellectuals were more than happy to mock the Prussian militaristic spirit for the sake of democracy and humanism. All fine ideals. But in the context of WWI defeat which was devastating for Germany mood they played with fire. And when it comes from Jews it seemed as betrayal against host country. Too bad very few deal with it and dismiss it like Potemkin as "Ah, so that's your agenda." One need the prestige of Joachim Fest to say the truth. What's wrong with self criticism?

Nazism didn't arise by itself. The radical intellectuals were all for democracy but unintentionally they helped to bring it down. After the war, to bulid stable democracy, the German were told to blame only one side of the coin. But the true learning would be when the public opinion will see there were more about the left than martyrdom. They should examine why their messages were so off putting. You can't change the people. The people rejected them.
By Mercutio
#1720216
Someone on this forum is also pushing a new book blaming liberals for fascism. Apparently Musolini et al were liberals in disguise. Good luck with both of those efforts.
User avatar
By R_G
#1720270
William Shirer is the best author on Nazism.

Anything you need to know is in his book, Rise and Fall of The Third Reich.

Enjoy.

Nazism, aside from The Holocaust, was not an " evil " movement.

And I'm not even going to get into the whole issue of how the Holocaust really got blown out of proportion, it was never planned to be as big of a mass murder as it was, long story.

My point, saying people were " guilty " because they didn't do enough to bring down Nazism is subject to opinion.
By Smilin' Dave
#1720479
@ Russian_Guy
Nazism, aside from The Holocaust, was not an " evil " movement.

T4 program. Nuremberg laws. Sponsorship of political terrorism campaigns in neighbour countries. Invading said countries without good reason. The deliberate destruction of Germany as their armies retreated.

Evil is a pretty stupid term, but these were not events to overlook.

it was never planned to be as big of a mass murder as it was, long story.

Goebbel's diary contained a prediction of 6 million dead, so I would be interested how you came to this conclusion.

@ Dempsey
I can't decide whether you are blaming the victims, or just giving them too much credit. Is it not possible that the radical intellectuals didn't create the anti-intellectual atmosphere, but were rather reacting to their environment? After all, artists are products of their societies to some extent, and all have to work with their prospective audience in mind.

As for your agenda, let's look at your past posts:
http://www.politicsforum.org/forum/view ... 93#1643393
"Like many Jews of his generation this "Holocaust survivor" never grasped what was wrong on this behaviour before WWII that brought upon them the wroth of many Germans and other Europeans."

http://www.politicsforum.org/forum/view ... t=#1658346
Looks suspiciously like an endorsement of the stab in the back legend.

http://www.politicsforum.org/forum/view ... t=#1686445
"Naturally enough, the question of anti-semitism comes up but wasn't it true?"

Why stop at Jews?
http://www.politicsforum.org/forum/view ... t=#1679763
"I may support Obama (because if he wins it's great history), my puzzle is about his chance. Americans are so patriots and he's so foreigner. It simply doesn't make sense."

Hey, Reinhard Heydrich wasn't such a bad guy right?
http://www.politicsforum.org/forum/view ... t=#1694860
Liddice was the Allies fault too apparently.

Has anyone else taken the opportunity to look at the rest of the "Our Civilisation" website? It's a little creepy... maybe I'm just paranoid.

Maybe you don't have an agenda, but some of the ideas you appear to flirt with are somewhat distasteful.
By Dempsey
#1720518
Smilin' dave

Maybe you don't have an agenda, but some of the ideas you appear to flirt with are somewhat distasteful.



Great study. Yes it's nagging me

Looks suspiciously like an endorsement of the stab in the back legend.


No it's not
User avatar
By R_G
#1720860
Goebbel's diary contained a prediction of 6 million dead, so I would be interested how you came to this conclusion.


There is no such thing as Goebbel's Diary being found and exposed.

When?

Yeah that's right.

My point stands, this thread is pretty much the same " Nazi is evil " bolony. They weren't great but Nero was satan himself.
User avatar
By Anothroskon
#1720907
Russkie, if you really are, then you might be interested in something called GeneralPlan Ost, the nazi's plan to ethnically cleanse Slavs from eastern europe.

I agree that our perception of them as the "absolute evil" is influenced by our temporal proximity. I would however say they are worse than the communists for while commie murders were a bybroduct for the nazis they were an end in themselves.

BTW Smillin Dave you are correct. I looked at the website and this Atkinson person is a crank. I feel soiled, but that's what you get for not reading the whole op.
By Dempsey
#1721057
Anothroskon, are you from Germany? Given that post war Germany was still ruled by (silenced) Nazis while dissident writers like Alfred Döblin didn't found they are welcomed in new Germany, can you say the remarkbale reconstruction of Germany and its stable civil democratic institutions were so successful due the fact that both Hitler and this sort of radical intellectuals were missing?

No one mentioned it before, but could it be the case? The post war German democracy was built because the romantic Germanic value of people community was still in place, and now paracticed even better than during Hitler days. Can you say the post war German people rejected the returning dissidents because they were seemed as part of the problem and not part of the solution?
User avatar
By R_G
#1721111
Russkie, if you really are, then you might be interested in something called GeneralPlan Ost, the nazi's plan to ethnically cleanse Slavs from eastern europe.


False, there is no consistent factual evidence to support this.

Hitler never intended mass execution of the Slavic peoples.

In fact, in countries such as Ukraine, the nation which saw the most Jews killed ( Not Poland ), there was no sign of any planned mass execution.

In reality, even with the high productivity of some of the death camps, it would have been near impossible to kill even a quarter of the Slavic population.

No, the majority of Slavic population were to be used as slaves, cruel, but no mass execution.

Not to mention the alliances that were made with Yugoslavia, Romania and Bulgaria.

Get it?

The idea of Nazis killing Russians in death camps was largely created by Soviet propaganda and Western media.
By Douglas
#1721117
False, there is no consistent factual evidence to support this.


What about the Stellungnahme und Gedanken zum Generalplan Ost des Reichsführers SS document?

In reality, even with the high productivity of some of the death camps, it would have been near impossible to kill even a quarter of the Slavic population.


In what time frame, under what predicted conditions?

Not to mention the alliances that were made with Yugoslavia, Romania and Bulgaria.


And the one that was made with Russia of course.
User avatar
By peter_co
#1721177
Not to mention the alliances that were made with Yugoslavia, Romania and Bulgaria.

Romania is not Slavic.
User avatar
By R_G
#1721211
That plan was for Poland wasn't it? Since Polish " race " is very questionable with continuous change in its territory.

And, Romania is not Slavic per say, but what is it exactly?
By Dempsey
#1721372
Russian_Guy


Goebbel's diary contained a prediction of 6 million dead, so I would be interested how you came to this conclusion.



There is no such thing as Goebbel's Diary being found and exposed.

When?

Yeah that's right.



The number 6 million dead came about Nuremberg trials based on the testimonies of Nazi officals. Goebbels didn't mention the numbers. But his diary says "The procedure is pretty barbaric and one that beggars description, and there's not much left of the Jews." (On March 27, 1942)

Sorry for the source but Russian_Guy may found it more reliable. It's from David Irving's biography on Goebbels

Revelations from Goebbels' Diary
Bringing to Light Secrets of Hitler's Propaganda Minister
David Irving
On March 5, 1942, Goebbels received a report from Heydrich about guerilla warfare in the occupied east. Blaming the Jews for this as well, he comments:

It is therefore understandable that many of them must pay with their lives for this. Anyway, in my view the more Jews who are liquidated the more consolidated the situation in Europe will be after the war. Let there be no phony sentimentalism about it. The Jews are Europe's misfortune. They must somehow be eliminated otherwise we are in danger of being eliminated by them.



Although Goebbels did not hear in advance of the meeting, you'll find in Goebbels' diary -- in his entry of March 7, 1942 -- that a copy of the well-known Wannsee Conference protocol was sent to him. Nobody else has spotted this.

There were still eleven million Jews in Europe, Goebbels dictated on that day, accurately summarizing the document. "For the time being they are to be concentrated in the east [until] later; possibly an island like Madagascar can be assigned to them after the war." It all raised a host of "delicate questions," he added. "Undoubtedly there will be a multitude of personal tragedies," he wrote airily, "But this is unavoidable. The situation now is ripe for a final settlement of the Jewish question."

More chilling is another diary entry a few weeks later. On March 27, 1942, Goebbels dictates a lengthy passage about another SS document that had been submitted to him, and which appears to have been much uglier in its content. "Beginning with Lublin," he states, "the Jews are now being deported eastward from the General Government [occupied Poland]. The procedure is pretty barbaric and one that beggars description, and there's not much left of the Jews. Broadly speaking one can probably say that 60 percent of them will have to be liquidated, while only 40 percent can be put to work."

It's a very ugly passage, and it's easy to link this diary passage with everything we've seen in the movies and on television since then. He's describing "Schindler's List" here -- or is he? I don't know. All he's actually saying here is that the Jews are having a pretty rigorous time. They're being deported, it's happening in a systematic way, and not many of them are going to survive it.

When I visited the Hoover Institution library in Stanford, California, to see the portion of the original Goebbels diary that they have there, this was the first page I asked to see. And when I was in the Moscow archives to examine the glass plate copy of the diary, this was also the first plate I searched for. I knew that if the diary had actually been copied by the Nazis in Berlin, and the glass plate version in Moscow matches the text in the Hoover library, there's no way anyone could have faked it. And there it is on the glass plate in Moscow, identical. As a final clincher, this portion was also microfilmed in 1947 in New York from the text that is held by the Hoover library. So there are three different indications that this is a genuine quotation from a genuine Goebbels document.

So there are the facts about Dr. Goebbels and the "final solution." If we're looking for a culprit, if we're looking for a criminal behind the "final solution" or the "Holocaust," whatever it was, for the man who started it in motion, then it was undoubtedly Dr. Goebbels first and foremost. Not Julius Streicher, not Adolf Hitler, nor any of the other Nazis. Goebbels was the moving force, and the brain behind it in every sense of the word. We still don't know if he knew what exactly happened at the other end, but then this isn't surprising, because we ourselves don't know either.

Links to Holocaust denial websites are not a good idea - SD


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